2003-03-31 SP
SPECIAL TOWN BOARD MEETING
MARCH 31, 2003
MTG#16
RES#184-186
7:05 P.M.
BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT
SUPERVISOR DENNIS BROWER COUNCILMAN ROGER BOOR COUNCILMAN THEODORE
TURNER COUNCILMAN DANIEL STEC COUNCILMAN TIM BREWER
GLEN LAKE DREDGING - SCOTT CARTIER, DAVE WICK FROM WARREN COUNTY SOIL AND
WATER PRESENT
Mr. Cartier-Discussion held regarding Glen Lake Dredging. We are going to reclaim that part of the lake is
what we're doing to make it better for fishing, wildlife, etc., and also enhance the property around the lake.
We started this four to five years ago. We already had one permit went to the Town made the project
bigger, since then Dave has come on Mike, Bill, Virginia, and residents that live at that end of the lake the
whole lake in general is in favor of this project. Presented and went over budget with board. The
mobilization-demobilization has to do with getting the dredge up here and into the water that is two trips up
and back. Earth work on the site that is to prep the dewatering site. One of the big considerations of this
project we have to remember without the dewatering site the project can't be done. You have the
dewatering site at no charge at all it's a private landowner who is doing it as a donation it's an ideal site.
Training on the dredge there are a couple of gentlemen from Scota that will come up and certify that you
can operate this dredge. The turbidity curtain is the item that insures that none of the spoils from the
dredging will spill out into other parts of the lake it will stretch from Point A to B; it's in your packets.
Seed and hydro mulch to rehab the spoil site. Culvert work for Reardon Road you do have to go under
Reardon Road and get to the spoil site. Miscellaneous was put in the budget for obvious reasons you don't
know what else you are going to need. A sub-total then you have a ten percent project overage, which runs
your total to fifty eight two twenty we are going to have to pay a Dredge Operator did computations at
paying them ten, twelve, fifteen and twenty dollars per hour and how that would project out to a project
total. Those are all the costs we see right now being associated with it. At the high side we're thinking the
Dredge Operator is obvious twenty dollars an hour, which would push the total to sixty three thousand six
hundred and twenty with orne slight overage in there. You can always go higher hopefully you come in
lower that's the best budgeting we can do right now. The project itself we had another neighborhood
meeting about two weeks ago we have looked to include as many people as humanly possible in this as far
as the shoreline. There are some technical things that Dave will go over on why you can't go certain places
and do certain things. We really feel this project you are not going to get it any cheaper. Besides having
that free spoil site the contractor doing this free of charge this doesn't happen very often. You are not going
to find too many people that would come in and do this project free of charge. The company that's doing it
their insurance policy matched perfectly. They have pollution coverage and they are doing this free of
charge. Unknown-Whose is it? Mr. Cartier-P.W. Stevens, Incorporated it's owned by Bob and Jane Barber
who live on that tip of the lake. Mr. Wicks-One of the things is who is going to be in chargeofthis project.
Our office decided we can't do it because it is not in our purview to do as did the Town, which left us
either with going with the private homeowners group or going with a private contractor. We are very lucky
with the fact that P.W. Stevens has stepped up to take the project under their wing and take all liability and
responsibility for that with our office essentially being the Project Manager of that. We are going to be
named held harmless to this project as is any other party that's going to have an active roll in directing work
on it. Permitting is one of the other major hurdles. Most of you guys were on site when we had the Core of
Engineers and DEC come out, DEC and the Core felt that it was a beneficial project they have done this
verbally they can't do anything in writing until we provide them with a permit package. The permit
package is developed it's pretty much what you have right here plus the actual permit itself which is all the
logistical details which we do have signed. That is going to be submitted once we figure out the income
budget. The exenditure budget Mike just went through we need to figure out the income budget hopefully
with some information tonight then we will get together shortly thereafter. We are hoping for a quick
turnaround time on the permit it really could take as short as forty five days which is unexpected or as long
as two to three years which we are hoping against. That would be the case if somebody requires us to go to
an environmental impact statement. We don't see this happening we see this as being neg dec's and all the
issue should hopefully been addressed in the document right here. Councilman Brewer-Whose the Lead
Agent for the SEQRA? Mr. Wicks-That's to be determined right now. Councilman Boor-Can you do it?
Mr. Wicks-That's debatable right now we are technically a Municipality we're a legal subdivision of State
Government no conservation district has ever been named as a lead for SEQRA. Councilman Boor-The
held-harmless clause would that be applicable to the agency that does the SEQRA? Mr. Wicks-I don't kno
I can find that out. In putting together the permit package they listed off a few things that we should be
addressing all of which is kind of here giving a little bit of history and the reason for it. We go into the
project implementation and the management of whose going to be doing the daily oversight of that which is
essentially our office. The project permitting is our office in conjunction with the other group that's been
working on the project. Councilman Boor-That's the only other thing that I checked on here is the turbidity
curtain. As far as insurance how is it marked so that boats don't cruise through it? Mr. Wicks-We're going
to have to put certain spacing on lighted buoys for nighttime. Councilman Boor-Is that in your budget?
Mr. Wicks-That is included in the cost of the turbidity curtain. The original map cut off a lot of these
properties. Page 3, talks about hours of operation. We have looked at the hours of operation 8:00 a.m. to
5:00 p.m. Monday through Friday, which won't disturb eople during dinnertime and won't disturb people on
weekends. If that needs to be modify before we submit it or the DEC or Core requires us to modify that we
will do so. Councilman Stec-Monday through Friday, forty hours a week, is that eighteen weeks? Mr.
Wicks-We're expecting right now, four months it might carry into four and a half months it depends.
Dewatering of spoils Mike already mentioned we have that available it's a four-acre site on private property
that will be a written landowner agreement between the parties involved and those landowners to be held
harmless. It's going to be compartmentalized in one-acre lots. We are going to pump to one acre the first
day, the second acre the second, three and four. By the time we get back to the first acre a private
contractor will have taken those materials out and re-prep it for another day of dredging. Removal of
dewatering spoils is going to be contracted out privately to whomever comes in at the highest bidder for
that material. Mr. Cartier-They 0 want that material to use on that site so it's probably not going to be
available for sale. That will be taken care of by the landowner he is going to use the material coming out of
the lake. Mr. Wicks-The sediment analysis relates directly to that if that material is going to be used by a
private contractor it has to be approved by DEC for use. That works out to be six hundred dollars per
sample. We went out and took one sample had it analyzed in the range of twenty to thirty different
chemicals and....it came back negative for every...we're going to go for the other sediment samples once we
figure out the income budget. Dredging noise levels there is a little bit of information on that. It turns out
the operating noise level is about ninety to ninety four levels which equates to a power lawn mower or large
diesel truck. Refueling the dredge was a question brought up by this board. We talked about there is
availability of private party barge that we can install a stationary diesel tank that can be loaded from a truck
then brought out to the dredge to expedite. Councilman Boor-You would be getting permits for that? Mr.
Wicks-We would take care of permits for that. Public meetings and awareness we already addressed that at
previous sessions. All the landowners in that area have been notified of the project. Getting back to
logistics, which is one of the key remaining not problems, but something that we need to work throgh. If
you take a look at your map you'll notice that this site is done is a horseshoe fashion because that's where
the levels of impacts are. I spent about four hours today with different companies saying how can we
logistically do this. Essentially it's a runoff of an eye you have a cross cable at the top anchor to two trees
then a cable that goes down through the middle then there is a cable at the bottom this thing winches itself
across the lake on the cable. With that being the fact we have the issue of how do we work ourselves into a
horseshoe shape area. The simple part is the very northern tip where you anchor on either shoreline and
pretty much bring yourself back and forth. That works pretty well until you get out to here then you start to
lose the benefit of having perpendicular shorelines. We talked about essentially doing almost in a pie shape
fashion where we anchor two over here then one over here. Then we just kind of swing it a pendulum over
in the corner. This is going to be a diffiult project but its doable it will slow down on our anticipated time
frame and it may ultimately cut out some of these northern properties here. Just because it's a convex
shoreline on this side which essentially means if we try to anchor on these two points down here and try to
anchor on these two points here we are going to be pulling ourselves across dry land. We really want a
concave shoreline so we can just kind of pull ourselves into there that needs dredging. This is something I
will be working out as a committee, but we prefer to submit the permit work like this which means we can
cover up to this area we can always do less we can't do more. For permit purposes we really like to leave
this in then leave it up to the technical aspect of getting the project done. This is really the project in a
nutshell. We really come a long way from where we were even a year ago. I give some credit to this board
for making us keep coming back and defining the project to a point where we are ready to present it 0 DEC
and the Core. The last step, which is up to you folks, is the budget. Councilman Brewer-I would just say
that from the beginning of this I've supported it to be honest with you I'm quite impressed with what you've
all done. I think with the events that have happened in the last couple of months with this Town with the
purchase of property on the lake and future purposes it's a true benefit to the Town of Queensbury. I would
say the money you've raised the interest you've kept I'm very pleased to see that you didn't give up. I
would propose that we support this financially as much as we can. Councilman Boor-I would agree. We
have to figure out contractually how we would do it. I'm not sure what the approach there is. I'm all in
favor of supporting it financially. Councilman Stec- This is definitely for Town Counsel at this point.
Councilman Boor-This is a great job. It did end up where I hoped it would end up. It was wise to go with
an independent contractor they are the people that can carry te insurance relieves the liability on you and
relieves it on us the project gets done. That's more than reasonable the price is very inexpensive for what is
being done here. The project is bigger than what was proposed but that's good. Supervisor Brower-Who is
here to speak on the finances of the Association? Are you in a different position than where you were
when we talked last time? Mr. Cartier-....got to distance ourselves from the Glen Lake
Association. The people that live at that end of the lake there is no formal association. The homeowners
we were in the neighborhood of twenty thousand last time I think we are still in that neighborhood.
Everybody is still informed as it goes on and on everyone from that end of the lake knows we're back
tonight and everyone is hopefully gives as much as they could before, I don't anticipate that changing.
Councilman Boor-If you could come up with twenty I wouldn't have a problem doing the rest of it. Mr.
Cartier-This figure we prepared it as well as we could with anything we get leery if we have to go over we
have to remember sixty three six....Councilman Brewer-You don't stop the project before it goes to sixty
five. Mr. Cartier-We're in the neighborhood of twenty thousand we're not looking for it to go to two
hundred thousand for those properties that might take another half a month if we can do that tangent
property. Councilman Brewer-This number truly doesn't represent what's involved here. That n mind I
wouldn't have a problem saying in my mind I only speak for myself if you got the twenty thousand I don't
have a problem financing the rest of it. Unknown-When you approve this where does it go? We as this
group that's going to do this are going to be responsible for whatever do, we submit bills? Supervisor
Brower-You have to fill out a voucher then we usually reimburse, that's how it typically works. In this case
I don't know if it would work differently or not. What are you guys, are you a corporation you are not the
Glen Lake Association? Mr. Wicks-I think what we talked about last time the Town wanted to be distance
from liability but provide a donation. The donation would come to our office and we would be responsible.
Councilman Boor-That would be easy. We authorize Warren County Soil and Water to distribute funds as
they see appropriate. Unknown-My point was we would set up the right procedure so that we would know
how to react to it and everybody would be happy and the monies would bespent or not spent or even given
back if we come under. Councilman Boor-I would like to see them acting as if they owned it. Supervisor
Brower-The project owner is the landowner whose property is going to be....Mr. Wicks-The private
company that's the owner of the project. Supervisor Brower-That's the Barber's? Mr. Wicks-They are
responsible for all facets of the project. They are naming our office to run it for them. Supervisor Brower-
They are going to keep the sediment that comes out that is dewatered they are going to use that sediment?
Mr. Wicks-I haven't heard that yet, but that's apparently the prerogative if they wanted to do that. Mr.
Cartier-They didn't require that but they just asked they would do it without that. Councilman Boor-I
would prefer that we give you the money and we say nothing. I don't want us to have any say. Councilman
Stec- This is a great project everybody wins. Councilman Boor-When it comes down to time frame in
contracts we can certainly direct our Attorney to look int it. Councilman Stec-Bob Hafner would be
contacting you Dave? Mr. Wicks-That's fine. We would just run it by Paul Dusek at the County.
Supervisor Brower-The last time we talked about participating on a fifty fifty basis up to a maximum
amount we were talking between thirty and forty thousand dollars as the Town's maximum contribution.
We're really kind of in line with what our original intent was and your numbers have come in better than I
think even you projected at that time. Councilman Stec- Y ou guys want to know what you are leaving here
with. What I'm hearing is you are leaving here with a plan from the Town to have Bob Hafner contact you
and Paul Dusek to start working out the terms. I think you are looking for a dollar number from us I think I
heard forty three thousand...Councilman Boor-Six hundred and twenty dollars. Councilman Stec-Ifthere is
going to be an overage you have to talk to us again. Unknown-Does this have to go to a public board
meeting? Councilman Stec-For resolution not for pblic hearing. Councilman Boor-I think you should give
a presentation. I think you should give a presentation it would be great publicity, which doesn't mean we
can't be doing the work on it right now. Supervisor Brower-Was that the commitment you had provided us
twenty thousand dollars or was it more than that? Councilman Turner-It was twenty. Supervisor Brower-
If you are able to come in under this I would hope it wouldn't cost the Town quite as much. Councilman
Boor-Lets not worry about that right now. Supervisor Brower-Will Dave Wicks office be holding your
twenty thousand too? Unknown-We have an account already set up there is no problem with that.
Supervisor Brower-You already have monies contributed? Unknown-Don't you remember three meetings
ago we had to do that. Councilman Brewer-I think its simple Dennis that we set it just like we did with
Feeder Dam. We set up the contract the work is completed we give them a check. Councilman Boor-I
wouldn't have a problem with them getting some of it ahead of time, but certainly you want a reasonable
retention. Supervisor Brower-When can you start this project? Mr. Wicks-It's really based on permit time
frame. I talked to the Mayor of Scotia today he is ready and willing. I talked to the Parks Chair today he is
ready and willing. He atually went out and counted the feet of pipe he is set to go. Everything right now is
based on DEC permit and income budget. Supervisor Brower-You don't expect that to be to lengthily? Mr.
Wicks-If we can make that then we are doing okay. Councilman Brewer-There are public hearings
involved with the SEQRA so be prepared for that. Mr. Wicks-We need to fill out permits for just about
every project we do and they are usually unlisted projects. You go through the short form if there is
determined there is no impact there is no public hearing. Councilman Brewer-The purpose of the SEQRA
is to allow the public to comment on it. If you don't have a public hearing then you can't have public
comment. There has to be a lead agency for the SEQRA to be done. Mr. Wicks-If it's a listed action, if it's
an unlisted action then there is no lead agent requirement. I know it's the Town's concern not to be lead
agent so that won't be a consideration. Councilman Boor-Are you comfortable with what you heard? I
think yu can go forward with what you want to do. Mr. Wicks-Absolutely.
BAY RIDGE RESCUE SQUAD
CONNIE TUCKER, AND JAMES HAGGERTY REPRESENTING BAY RIDGE RESCUE SQUAD
PRESENT
Ms. Tucker-Going back to our five-year plan that was submitted two years ago. On our five-year plan we
had made some provisions for some things that we were going to do. One of the things we were going to
do was wire the existing garage for lighting and electrical which we did not get done because we couldn't
get a contractor in there. The good news is his is going to be doing it for us at a much less rate so we will
be able to work that into our budget this year. Councilman Boor-When is he going to do it? Ms. Tucker-
By the middle of summer. The other thing we didn't do last year, which was planned, was build a storage
loft in our existing garage. The reason that it wasn't done is because I couldn't find anyone that was willing
to do it for a reasonable price. Councilman Boor-What was the lowest price you received? Ms. Tucker-
About thirty two hundred dollars I thought it was too much for what I wanted. All I wanted was some
supports, a loft and set of stairs. A new roof on the existing barn on the roperty, which we didn't worry
about that. Councilman Boor-Is it leaking? Ms. Tucker-It's not our garage it's the bam that actually the
Historical Association doesn't want us to tear down because it's a historical land marker. They replaced it
with a tarpaper roof when they did it the last time. Councilman Boor-Is their stuff in the bam? Ms.
Tucker-The stuff that we got in there is junk stuff nothing that's worth it. We could use it if we needed too.
We did reseal the blacktop for thirteen hundred dollars. We basically didn't spend any money last year.
We actually came under budget for almost every line item. One of the things we also purchase last year
was the Life Pack Twelve Monitor that we wanted to purchase. We wanted to wait until we got close to the
end of the year because we weren't sure how much it was going to cost us. What we did end up with at the
end of the year was thirty five thousand six hundred and thirty six dollars and forty-six cents overage on
our budget. That's money that we did not spend. What we did with some of the money was because of the
ambulance loan that we had to take out last year when we bought the new ambulance there was not enough
provision in this years contract or last years contract to pay for that. We did take some monies and we did
pay for that which left us a balance of twenty nine thousand six hundred thirty six forty six. We looked at
the Life Pack Twelve Monitor that we wanted. We talked to the gentlemen and decided that this was the
monitor that we needed to go with because the other two organizations in the Town of Queensbury are
presently using this we wanted to be consistent with the other squads that we work with most closely.
What is happening in EMS and what's happening with the Hospital right now is the Hospital has gone to
what's called a PCI Program. That's where they are dong emergency angio plasty in the Cath Lab. Part of
that process starts with EMS. The goal of having a patient to the Cath Lab is within sixty minutes from the
on set of symptoms. Part of that process is you have to a twelve leading KG which would show the
indicator for having a stint placement for an emergency angio plasty is ST elevations on a twelve lead
EKG, which is something we do not have capability of our monitors are twelve years old. The other two
organizations in the Town do have that and their budgets in the previous years had requested the monies for
those and had gotten it. We held off because we weren't quite sure if the technology was quite up to snuff.
The technology is now there and the technology is what we need to have. Also the State of New York
within the next two years the standard of care is going to be twelve lead EKG monitoring in the field. We
stand here because we need to replace our monitors. Our monitors are no longer purchasable they are not
making them anymore and afternext year we will not even be able to get them serviced. Dr. Carillo is
willing to write a letter to you stressing the importance of having these monitors if you require it. These are
coming off State Contract. Met with Mr. Hess two weeks ago noting he sent a letter to the board regarding
this matter. Councilman Brewer-How come you need three? Ms. Tucker-Because we have a. ...truck and
two ambulances one for each vehicle. Supervisor Brower-What are the old ones worth? Mr. Haggerty-Five
thousand each. Ms. Tucker-They cost us under ten when we bought them new. Mr. Haggerty-That's in the
proposal on three. With what were getting we're also looking at replacing some other equipment. This
single piece of equipment will allow us to get rid of two other pieces of equipment at the same time that is
also getting old and at this point we could turn around and sell which are the Automatic BP Cuffs is built
into this as well as the Pulse.... We will be able to offset those pieces of equipment; as well we will have to
sell these ourselves. What you have tonight is the revised quote because the quote we originally had ran
out, they gave us the same exact price. Councilman Brewer-How much money do you have? Ms. Tucker-
Twenty nine thousand six hundred thirty six forty six. Councilman Stec- Y ou need forty grand. Ms.
Tucker-I really don't want to take out another loan. Mr. Haggerty-Part of the reason for waiting is that was
new technology and its changing constantly. We wanted to make sure that what we were getting was going
to stay for a while. Councilman Boor-Would prefr not to borrow. What are we going to do? Councilman
Brewer-We would have to have a resolution to amend the budget. Councilman Boor-We can authorize
whether we want to take the forty thousand out of the sixty. Ms. Tucker-Will this come up at a later
meeting? Councilman Stec- There will have to be a resolution. No action taken.
RESOLUTION ENTERING EXECUTIVE SESSION
RESOLUITON NO. 184, 2003
INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Roger Boor WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION
SECONDED BY: Mr. Theodore Turner
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby adjourns from Regular Session and
moves into Executive Session to discuss attorney/client privilege and one personnel matter.
Duly adopted this 31st, day of March, 2003 by the following vote:
Ayes: Mr. Boor, Mr. Turner, Mr. Stec, Mr. Brewer, Mr. Brower
Noes: None
AbsentNone
RESOLUTION ADJOURNING EXECUTIVE SESSION
RESOLUTION NO. 185, 2003
INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Theodore Turner WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION
SECONDED BY: Mr. Roger Boor
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury here adjourns from Executive Session and
moves back into Regular Session.
Duly adopted this 31st, day of March, 2003, by the following vote:
Ayes: Mr. Turner, Mr. Stec, Mr. Brewer, Mr. Brower, Mr. Boor
Noes: None
AbsentNone
RESOLUTION ADJOURING SPECIAL TOWN BOARD
MEETING
RESOLUTION NO. 186, 2003
INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Theodore Turner WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION
SECONDED BY: Mr. Roger Boor
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby adjourns its Special Town Board
Meeting.
Duly adopted this 31st, day of March, 2003 by the following vote:
Ayes: Mr. Stec, Mr. Brewer, Mr. Boor, Mr. Turner, Mr. Brower
Noes: None
AbsentNone
No further action taken.
Respectfully Submitted,
Darleen M. Dougher Town Clerk Town of Queensbury