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1993-01-26 SPECIAL TOWN BOARD MEETING JANUARY 26, 1993 3:00 P.M. MTG#8 RES NO 88-95 BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT Supervisor Michel Brandt Councilman Pliney Tucker Councilman Nick Caimano Councilman Susan Goetz Councilman Betty Monahan TOWN ATTORNEY Paul Dusek PRESS Glens Falls Post Star TOWN OFFICIALS Ralph VanDusen Supervisor Brandt opened the meeting noting that this meeting is a continuation of the Regular Town Board Meeting of January 25th, 1993. RESOLUTIONS RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING RETENTION OF COLE-LA YER- TRUMBLE TO PERFORM ADDITIONAL SERVICES RESOLUTION NO.: 88, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Michel Brandt WHO MOVED ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mrs. Betty Monahan WHEREAS, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury previously authorized an agreement between the Town of Queensbury and Cole-Layer- Trumble, which agreement provided for the rendering of services in connection with the revaluation of properties in the Town of Queensbury, and WHEREAS, said agreement provided that should the parcel count as shown on the 1993 tentative assessment roll exceed the parcel count set forth in the agreement by more than five-percent (5%), the Company would be entitled to an additional rate of $10.00 for each additional residential parcel and $40.00 for each additional commercial parcel, and WHEREAS, the Town Assessor has advised that additional services are needed in connection with a number of commercial parcels and the same exceeds the number of parcels to be included as part of the services to be performed by Cole-Layer- Trumble under the aforedescribed agreement, and has requested authorization for the further services of Cole-Layer- Trumble, NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby approves the retention of the services of Cole-Layer- Trumble to perform services in connection with certain additional parcels in accordance with the terms and provisions of the contract currently existing between the parties, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the total amount expended, in accordance with the terms and provisions of this resolution, shall not exceed the sum of $3,000.00 and shall be paid forfrom Account No.: 01 13554741. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: AYES: Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Brandt, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker NOES: None ABSENT:None RESOLUTION ADOPTING DETERMINATION OF NON-SIGNIFICANCE OF ROAD DEDICATION RESOLUTION NO.: 89, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano WHO MOVED ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mr. Michel Brandt WHEREAS, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury is considering the acceptance of Ferris Drive and Hampton, offered for dedication by Forest Wood Homes, Inc., and WHEREAS, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury is duly qualified to act as lead agency with respect to compliance with SEQRA which required environmental review of certain actions undertaken by local governments, and WHEREAS, the proposed action is an unlisted action pursuant to the Rules and Regulations of the State Environmental Quality Review Act, NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury, after considering the action proposed herein, reviewing the Environmental Assessment Form, reviewing the criteria contained in Section 617.11, and thoroughly analyzing the project with respect to potential environmental concerns, determines that the action will not have a significant effect on the environment, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby finds that the proposed responses inserted in Part II of the said Environmental Assessment Form are satisfactory and approved, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Town Supervisor is hereby authorized and directed to complete and execute Part III of the said Environmental Assessment Form and to check the box thereon indicating that the proposed action will not result in any significant adverse impacts, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the annexed Negative Declaration is hereby approved and the Town Clerk is hereby authorized and directed to file the same in accordance with the provisions of the general regulations of the Department of Environmental Conservation. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: A YES: Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Monahan, Mr. Brandt NOES: None ABSENT:None RESOLUTION APPROVING EASEMENT OF NIAGARA MOHAWK POWER CORP. IN QUEENSBURY FOREST SUBDIVISION INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano (NO ACTION TAKEN AT THIS TIME) WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mrs. Susan Goetz DISCUSSION HELD Councilman Monahan-Questioned the conditions of the easement. Noted she would like to wait until Attorney Dusek arrived. It was the decision of the Town Board to wait for the Attorney Dusek to arrive to discuss this matter. RESOLUTION TO SET PUBLIC HEARING ON APPLICATION FOR VARIANCE OF SANITARY SEW AGE DISPOSAL ORDINANCE FOR MR. HOWARD DENISON RESOLUTION NO.: 90, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano WHO MOVED ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mrs. Susan Goetz WHEREAS, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury is, by operation of Law, the Local Board of Health for the Town of Queensbury and, as such, is authorized under Chapter 136 of the Town of Queensbury On-Site Sewage Disposal Ordinance to issue variances to such Ordinance, and WHEREAS, Mr. Howard Denison has applied to the Local Board of Health of the Town of Queensbury for a variance from certain standards of the Town of Queensbury On-Site Sewage Disposal Ordinance set forth in Chapter 136, Appendix A, such standard providing as follows: APPENDIX A TABLE I - HORIZONTAL SEPARATION DISTANCES FROM WASTE WATER SOURCES TO STREAM WELL OR LAKE OR WASTE WATER SUCTION WATER PROPERTY LAKE GEORGE SOURCES LINE (a) COURSE(c) DWELLING LINE AND TRIBS. Seepage Pit (a) Water service and sewer lines may be in the same trench if cast-iron sewer with lead-caulked joints is laid at all points eighteen (18) inches below water service pipe; or sewer may be on dropped shelf at one (1) side at least eighteen (18) inches below water service pipe, provided that sewer pipe is laid below frost with tight and rootproof joints and is not subject to settling, superimposed loads or vibration. Water service lines under pressure shall not pass closer than ten (10) feet to a septic tank, absorption tile field, leaching pit, privy or any other part of a sewage disposal system. and WHEREAS, Mr. Howard Denison has indicated a desire to place the seepage pit 6' from the water line, rather than placing it at the mandated 10' distance, NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Local Board of Health for the Town of Queensbury will hold a public hearing on February 8th, 1993, at 7:00 p.m., at the Queensbury Activities Center, (reasonably accessible to persons with mobility impairment) 531 Bay Road, Town of Queensbury, Warren County, New York, to consider the application for a variance of Mr. Howard Denison to place the seepage pit 6' from the water line, rather than placing it at the mandated 10' distance, on property situated at 379 Ridge Road, Queensbury, New York, and bearing Tax Map No.: Section 57, Block 1, Lot 2.2, and, at that time, all persons interested in the subject thereof will be heard, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Town Clerk of the Town of Queensbury be and is hereby directed and authorized, when in receipt of a list of neighbors within 500 feet of the subject property, to publish and provide Notice of said Public Hearing as may be required by law, and authorized to mail copies of said Public Hearing Notice to the adjoining neighbors. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: A YES: Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Goetz Mrs. Monahan, Mr. Brandt NOES: None ABSENT:None RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING INTERFUND ADVANCES RESOLUTION NO.: 91, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Michel Brandt WHO MOVED ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano WHEREAS, pursuant to Section 9-A of the General Municipal Law of the State of New York, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury is authorized to temporarily advance moneys held in any fund to any other fund, and NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby authorizes the temporary advance of funds to the accounts or funds indicated, and in the amounts indicated, as set forth below: FROM: TO: $ AMOUNT 40 - Queensbury Water 01 - General Fund 100,000.00 40 - Queensbury Water 910 - Landfill Fund 10,000.00 and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Town Supervisor, as Chief Fiscal Officer, is hereby authorized and directed to arrange for and accomplish the above-authorized transfers, and temporary advances, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Town Supervisor, as Chief Fiscal Officer, shall keep suitable records and arrange for the repayment of the temporary advances as soon as possible, and the Town Supervisor shall also determine the amount of interest, if any, to be paid, upon repayment. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: A YES: Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Brandt NOES: None ABSENT:None DISCUSSION HELD - Queensbury Forest Roads Councilman Caimano-Asked why is Farone mentioned in the easement when the Town is dealing with someone else now? Councilman Monahan-Noted that the Town is getting granted rights to construct and maintain the road, normally the developer constructs the road. The road is partially constructed it doesn't have the top coat on it. Attorney Dusek-Noted that what happens in these types of easements whenever they have to cross the power line in these roads it's up to the developer to secure the rights from Niagara Mohawk. Then what they do is offer the roads with easements for dedication. Noted when he received all the paperwork he reviewed the easement with Niagara Mohawk and felt uncomfortable with the language that was contained in that easement. There were a number of conditions that were imposed in that and I found that it wouldn't be advisable for the Town to enter into. Noted he contacted the Attorney first and then spoke with Niagara Mohawk's people explaining his concerns. Had found an earlier easement that the Town had with Niagara Mohawk that didn't have those conditions. Once, I explained everything to them they agreed to provide the Town with an identical easement that they provided in a previous matter. What happened in order to make it work we take the assignment in the first instance the Farone easement and everything else as it was and then the second resolution takes this new easement. In the easement so everything is correctly stated because there is originally an easement from Farone it was Niagara Mohawk to Farone and they had the right to assign to us so that is a correct reference in this because this one is now modifying that previous easement. Councilman Monahan-Asked if Farone was out of the easement? Attorney Dusek-Noted that Farone is out of it completely. Noted Farone transferred the property to Forest Woods Homes. It went from him and then he in tum is transferring the easement rights over to us. Councilman Monahan-Questioned if the developer has done everything he has to do in regard to the road? Attorney Dusek-Noted that we're taking a letter of credit for the top coat. Supervisor Brandt-Asked if we have a letter of credit? Attorney Dusek-Yes. Councilman Monahan-Questioned if we can take the assignment before the developer is out of there? Attorney Dusek-Yes. Noted that this is permissive rights from Niagara Mohawk to you to be able to do it if you want to do it. The only thing that remains to be done is the surfacing. In the event that the developer doesn't do it you have the letter of credit to protect you. Councilman Tucker-Noted that this is the property that had the retention pond in it and had four feet of water in it last winter. They changed their drainage and the waters not going into the retention pond. Noted he was involved in a meeting with Paul Naylor and Mr. Ammirati. Mr. Naylor is going to take the sand from the sweeping of the roads in the winter time and take it over there and fill that hole. The following resolutions were passed. RESOLUTION ACCEPTING DEDICATION OF FERRIS DRIVE AND HAMPTON COURT RESOLUTION NO. 92, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano WHO MOVED ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mrs. Susan Goetz WHEREAS, Forest Wood Homes, Inc. has offered a deed to dedicate to the Town of Queensbury Ferris Drive and Hampton Court, which are more particularly described in the survey map presented at this meeting and the original deed being presented to this meeting, and WHEREAS, Paul H. Naylor, Superintendent of Highways of the Town of Queensbury has advised that he has reviewed inspection reports concerning the construction of and specifications of the said road proposed to be dedicated to the Town of Queensbury and he finds the same, in their current condition, to meet the appropriate Town of Queensbury specifications, with the exception of application of the final black-top surface, and WHEREAS, Thomas K. Flaherty, Superintendent of Water of the Town of Queensbury, has advised that he has made an inspection of water mains and appurtenances along said road proposed for dedication and finds that the installation is in accordance with the requirements of the Town of Queensbury Water Department, and that said installation is approved, and WHEREAS, the form of the deed and title to the road offered for dedication, as well as the affidavit promising to complete the road, and Letter of Credit, have been reviewed and approved by Paul B. Dusek, Town Attorney for the Town of Queensbury, and WHEREAS, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury has considered the environmental effects of the proposed action by previous resolution and issued a Negative Declaration pursuant to the State Environmental Quality Review Act, NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the aforementioned deed for dedication of the said road be and the same is hereby accepted and approved, that the Town Supervisor is hereby authorized to execute, sign and affix the Town seal to any and all documents necessary to complete the transaction, and that the Town Clerk is hereby authorized and directed to cause said deed to be recorded in the Warren County Clerk's Office, after which said deed shall be properly filed and maintained in the Office of the Town Clerk of the Town of Queensbury, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Letter of Credit in the amount of $ and Affidavit wherein the developer promises to complete the road within year(s) be accepted, and BE IT FURTHER, RESOLVED, that the Town Clerk retain and file said Letter of Credit and Affidavit, and that the road be hereby added to the official inventory of Town Highways, to be described as follows: Road Number: 490 Description: Beginning at Walton Court and continuing in a northerly direction a distance of 1976' and .37 hundredths of a mile and ending at Ferriss Drive Name: Hampton Court Feet: 1976' Road Number: 436 Description: Beginning at Ferriss Drive and continuing in a southerly direction, a distance of 876' and .16 hundredths of a mile and ending at Dead End Name: Ferriss Drive Feet: 876' Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: A YES: Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mr. Brandt NOES: None ABSENT:None RESOLUTION APPROVING EASEMENT OF NIAGARA MOHAWK POWER CORP. IN QUEENSBURY FOREST SUBDIVISION RESOLUTION NO.: 93,93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano WHO MOVED ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mr. Michel Brandt WHEREAS, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury has, as of this date, accepted the dedication of certain roads in the Queensbury Forest Subdivision known as Ferris Drive and Hampton Court, and WHEREAS, as part of that dedication, an easement granted by the Niagara Mohawk Power Corporation was also conveyed to the Town by the developer, and WHEREAS, the Town Attorney has recommended that the aforesaid easement be modified and Niagara Mohawk Power Corporation has agreed to so modify the easement, a copy of such modification having been presented at this meeting, and WHEREAS, the aforesaid, amended easement shall run to the Town of Queensbury and supersede or amend the previous easement conveyed by the Developer, NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby approves of the new easement offered by Niagara Mohawk Power Corporation to the Town of Queensbury and hereby authorizes the Town Supervisor to execute the same on behalf of the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury, place the seal of the Town upon the same, should it be necessary, and take such other and further steps as may be necessary to file and record the papers at the Warren County Clerk's Office. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: AYES: Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Monahan, Mr. Brandt NOES: None ABSENT:None DISCUSSION LGRMIF GRANT - TOWN HISTORIAN MARILYN VANDYKE Marilyn VanDyke- Town Historian. Made a presentation to the Town Board regarding the Town seeking a grant that's available through the State for preserving Town records. After further discussion the following resolution was passed. RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING SUBMISSION OF APPLICATION TO STATE RESOLUTION NO. 94, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Michel Brandt WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano Authorizing submission of an application as finalized by the committee and submitted to the State and authorize the Town Supervisor to sign it on behalf of the Town and to place the Town seal on any documents that may be necessary. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993 by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Brandt Noes: None Absent:None DISCUSSION HELD Councilman Goetz-Noted that on January 12th, she had received a letter from Mike Shaw, with the projected sewer bills for ACe. In the letter he has requested the Town Board's permission to forward it to ACC. The Town Board was in agreement to forward the letter to ACC. Supervisor Brandt-Noted that he has been informed that DEC has notified our engineers that there is a conditional acceptance of the Closure Investigation Report on the landfill it has been written and sent to the State we should be getting it in a few days. The condition for approval of the Closure Investigation Report is that we continue to take water samples and test them within the program that's been, all ready been established. Councilman Caimano-Questioned who was sending what to whom? Supervisor Brandt-Noted DEC engineers are telling our engineers that essentially Warrensburg who has reviewed this is accepting it and they are recommending it and sending it to Albany. That means momentarily we can get an acceptance to go ahead and close off the first cell here, which then would mean we would have to go ahead and write bid specs and get it out right away which is engineering work. Noted there is a lot of engineering work that has to done on a continuing basis to investigate this. Attorney Dusek-Presented Board with letter outlining matters concerning the landfill. (letter on file) Noted that the Town does need additional engineering assistants in terms of putting together the final plans regarding the landfill. Some of your options will start to materialize very quickly your engineer can take that into account. As he builds his plans he can get the fundamental basis underway for you and then simply modify it. If we get to a point where we find something is going to work for you and we need an extension then, I think we have enough to show DEC where we're going and what our plans are and hopefully be able to get an extension from them, noted he can't guarantee that. Thinks more has to be generated than what we have currently. Councilman Tucker-Questioned if the information about Roilite and paper sludge was already forwarded? Attorney Dusek -Noted it was forwarded to Econ. Supervisor Brandt-Noted that they haven't received a response on that letter, has tried to contact them many times. Councilman Tucker-Asked if this was the plan that they are trying to put together. Supervisor Brandt-Noted it is the beginning of it. There still has to be a lot of engineering work done. Has asked Morse Engineering to give an estimate of what kind of money is involved. Noted it will cost $41,700.00 before it's all done. Councilman Monahan-Asked how far it will take them? Supervisor Brandt-Through construction inspections on the first part and develop the plan to bring to DEC through the other phases of the closure. Noted the biggest single item is $23,000.00, which is construction inspection. Noted they have a very good working relationship with Morse Engineering and requested that the Board pass a resolution authorizing to continue to work with Morse Engineering. It was the decision of the Town Board to set up a meeting with Morse Engineering for discussion of the landfill on Monday, February 1st, 1993 at 6:30 p.m, before the regular scheduled meeting. Attorney Dusek-Spoke to the Board regarding two bills that were submitted at the audit of bills at last Monday's meeting concerning Morse Engineering. One of which was for the Closure Investigation Report and one which was $800.00 over. Noted to authorize the payment of this the Board would have to pass a resolution authorizing a higher amount. You had authorized $14,000.00 you would have to go to $14,882.86 to approve the bill. Supervisor Brandt-Noted he would authorize such a resolution. Councilman Caimano-Seconded it, as long as it's discussed at a later date. Noted the resolution called for $14,000.00, and they are asking for more. Noted that if he needs more money then he should come back and ask for it. Supervisor Brandt-Noted that this is an on going thing that's going to go on for a long period of time and if you want to do it correctly you should allocate the money to do it. RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING ADDITIONAL PAYMENT RESOLUTION NO. 95, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Michel Brandt WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano Attorney Dusek-You had two bills that were submitted by Morse Engineering. There was a Closure Investigation Report that was within the confines of the resolution. There was another one that was $800.00 over. I took a look at it, if you want to authorize the payment of this what you have to do is authorize a resolution authorizing the higher amount. You had authorized $14,000.00 you would have to go to $14,882.86 to approve the bill. Supervisor Brandt-I would authorize such a resolution to get that behind us. Councilman Caimano-I'll second it as long as we discuss at a later date. Duly adopted this 26th day of January, 1993, by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Brandt Noes: None Absent:None DISCUSSION HELD Councilman Tucker-Read report to the Board on lights. The Dixon Road project, they are going to take the poles out the second week in February. Cranberry Lane and Sherman Road the light should be up, Walker Lane they are going to put a 400 watt bulb in, but will not angle the light. Glenwood A venue and Quaker Road they are going to give an estimate on setting new pole and a 400 watt light. Councilman Monahan-Farr Lane, Pliney you wanted the cost of that remember Farr Lane Extension. Paul said it's going to be, he wasn't able to talk to Leon Steves who was over there doing the surveying, but he talked to Matt to see how much additional it would be for road grade and stuff. It will be between $3,000.00 and $5,000.00 for that and the blacktop they are going to need between $5,000.00 and $8,000.00, so we got from anywhere from $8,000 to $13,000.00. I don't think we have any problems with that do we? Councilman Tucker-How much road? Councilman Monahan-I don't know Pliney. Councilman Goetz-I thought you said it was a small... Councilman Tucker-It really don't matter Betty. Supervisor Brandt-So, what do you want to do? Do you want to allocate money, that's not in the highway budget right? Councilman Monahan-Well, when we chopped them remember we chopped the blacktop way down and everything. I think Paul would be more comfortable if we put some in so he's not chopping something else. Councilman Tucker-We also promised him if we could find the money that we would put the blacktop back in too. Councilman Monahan-He's going to need between $8,000.00 and $13,000.00 he gave me a range of figures here it depends upon how much the surveying is. A minimum of eight and a maximum of thirteen. Councilman Tucker-Can we do with what thirteen? Supervisor Brandt -So what your saying is up to thirteen thousand dollars. What you want to do is do a resolution to transfer from the general fund contingency account let's get a project account, how do you want to do this? Councilman Monahan-Just move to highway paving and surveying accounts wouldn't you? Councilman Tucker-Can't you give it to the highway department to do this project? Supervisor Brandt-Allocate to this project. Councilman Monahan-You wouldn't want to set this up as a separate account. Attorney Dusek-We could check with E.J. tomorrow and have a resolution prepared for Monday's meeting. Supervisor Brandt-Let's do that. Is that all right Betty? Councilman Monahan-Yeah, because highway is getting nervous they have to get their paperwork together. DISCUSSION WATER TREATMENT PLANT EXPANSION Ralph VanDusen-Presented Board with a report on the Water Treatment Plant Expansion. A huge majority of the report is just a summary of what happened in 1992. There are two pages with a summary by Tom indicating again, a brief summary of what happened in 1992. His conclusion is that we are currently operating a number of days each year in excess of our rated capacity. It's just a matter of time before we have complications that force us to run out of water or not be able to supply our existing customers. I'm recommending that we proceed with the plant expansion which would start off with a design with an expansion to the plant. Councilman Caimano-Ifwe had an extended heat spell this summer, extending meaning a week or more would we be forced to ration water? Mr. VanDusen-It's certainly possible. More importantly, right now if we have a failure of anyone of the components of our system you have rationing without a heat spell. We had times this winter if one of our system failed we could not have produced water enough to supply the Town. Also, you should know we did a vibration check on the pump motors and we found that one of the pumps the motor the bearings are shot it's got to be rebuilt. Your talking about a week of down time, I'm waiting for a cost estimate to come m. Councilman Caimano-Are you going to do it in the winter time? Mr. VanDusen-We hope to do it this month the early part of February. I'm expecting cost estimates in tomorrow on that. It's a case where if that pump dies, if we hadn't done that test if we just let it go until it died we would have been down for weeks if not months. Councilman Tucker-What do we have down there two pumps? Mr. VanDusen-There are two...pumps. Councilman Tucker-And room for a third? Mr. VanDusen-Yes. The original design there was room for a third. There is a complication for piping that if you put the third in it may not operate very well, but that was the original concept. Councilman Monahan-Ralph, do you know the span now or do you have to use both of those? Mr. VanDusen-Any time we exceed five million gallons a day we have to run two. Councilman Monahan-The idea is to get this thing fixed while you are going under the five million while lower demand is down. Mr. VanDusen-That's correct. Councilman Monahan-In case we had a big fire or something would we be okay with that one out of there? Mr. VanDusen-Yes. In an average day this time of the year it's between two and three million gallons a day. Councilman Caimano-Just out of curiosity since August there has been a big drop in...in our water compared to previous years, what do you attribute that to? Mr. VanDusen-Soda ash specifically, 92 is the first year of soda ash. It took us probably four to six months to really get a handle to maximize of efficiently of it since then it's worked extremely well. Councilman Monahan-Does any of this stuff change the taste of the water or does it taste like it did before you starting using it? Mr. VanDusen-An average person would not know the difference. The water is by far better quality right now than it was a year ago there is no question. Supervisor Brandt-What's the will, what do you want to do? Councilman Monahan-I move that we jump in and go. Councilman Caimano-What's bothersome is that we've heard since the middle of summer that's the last time we talked about this thing, that if we started today we're three years from a drop of extra water. Councilman Monahan-l 995, he told us the other day. Mr. VanDusen-Thirty two months minimum. Supervisor Brandt-We're also being told that we've got a sixty three percent increase in revenue that we have to charge the customer whether it be in taxes or water costs, but it's a sizable increase in the cost to the consumer. I don't remember the rate study, I don't have it right here but it was three hundred and something dollars per year and raising up to five hundred dollars a year which is a very significant piece of money that bothers me. Councilman Caimano-It's only significant if you don't have water. Supervisor Brandt-Right now, what's being proposed is a plant expansion to fifteen.... Mr. VanDusen-The recommendation was to upgrade to fifteen. Supervisor Brandt-The minimum you could expand to it is eleven million gallons and the cost is thirteen million dollars, I'm going right off memory. Councilman Monahan-It was $250,000.00 difference going from the lower amount of gallonage to the maximum amount of gallonage, that figure I do remember. Supervisor Brandt-I also have a...is what I've seen in the estimates of usage. Certainly other communities, Hudson Falls has said clearly that they want our water. Kingsbury has clearly said they want our water. Fort Edward is very interested in talking to us both the Village and the Town and have made inquiries. But, when you add all those together the consumption figures are still very minor, I want to get that report. I've taken O'Brien and Gere's table of it's called Table Three, Water Demand Projections. I'm saying, let's assume we're going to deal with Fort Edward, Town and Village, Hudson Falls, Kingsbury and Queensbury. I'm eliminating Lake George, Moreau, Wilton and Glens Falls. Taking the year 2015 the projection is the average daily gallons. If you add those together it's six million gallons a day. If you take the peak, what I'm saying fifteen million is a lot of gallons. If you went to a ten million gallon plant in the year 2015 you could have your six million gallons a day plus the additional four million available for surges. Perhaps, if you do some restrictions in flows that is for sprinkling of lawns why don't we look at a modular of smaller expansion? Councilman Caimano- That's fifty percent though, isn't it? We have to by law that's a fifty percent number isn't it the six million a day? Mr. VanDusen-If you need to treat six million a gallons a day you've got to shut down one part of your system and still treat six million gallons a day. Councilman Caimano- That's right. Mr. VanDusen-If you have a need for a peak of six you can't build six million gallon plant. Supervisor Brandt-In 1987, there was a study done by Kestner and I've dug that one out and it's for a ten million gallon plant. It was like six million dollars not thirteen million dollars that we're talking about now, I'd like to look at that. Councilman Monahan-That's no comparison Mike, you compare that. Councilman Caimano-Number one, it's 1987. Councilman Monahan-It really doesn't matter cause where the price is going to be is where the contractors out there say their going to do it for. Supervisor Brandt-That's five million gallon expansion not ten million. Councilman Monahan-That's why when we did the study back in 1987 we didn't go through with Kestner because the way the water use was starting to go around here we said, it's dumb we're going to waste money if we have to do something twice that's a waste of money. That's why we didn't go for that 87 report we figured we better start thinking of going to the fifteen million. Supervisor Brandt-I would like to look very hard at that 87 report or 88 report. I like to look at alternatives to going to this larger modular. If you can do it for six million or seven million that's a heck of a lot different than twelve million or thirteen million. Councilman Monahan-Automatically your six or seven million right now has probably got a fifty percent charge on it right now. Supervisor Brandt-Let's ask an engineer. I like to know that, I'd like to ask Kestner to update that. Councilman Monahan-I don't think you want to get involved with Kestner again after he got us a thirty percent cost overrun on the sewer and that can be put right in his lap. Supervisor Brandt-I don't want to blame Kestner for something, I don't know much about. I don't want to let that get in the way here. I'd like to look at what alternatives we have. I'd also like to look at can we cut cost. Are there ways of running the place for less money. If there are can we face our citizens and say, we don't have to go to five hundred dollars a year per household. I like to look at that hard before we jump into this. Councilman Caimano- When? Supervisor Brandt-Right now. Councilman Monahan-O'Brien and Gere all ready told us we are running our operation with less people than any place around. Supervisor Brandt-That's not a fact. O'Brien and Gere is not correct if that's what they are telling us because.. . Councilman Caimano- That is what they are telling us. Supervisor Brandt-I can find you places that are running plants for less. I'm starting to look into them and I want to look some, before I want to jump into it. Councilman Caimano- That's fine, but all I'm saying is when? Can we set a meeting up for the first or second week of February in which we have a round table discussion of all of these matters. Nothing else is discussed at that meeting except the potential expansion of the water plant and any variations. Bring out your 87 report, talk to Kestner people, talk to O'Brien and Gere, I don't care who we talk to I don't think we should...(tape turned) build a water plant that has a built-in shortfall of, well if we get troubles we can tum the sprinklers off. That to me is folly because it's a type of disaster. But, I'm certainly willing to look at anything across the board. All, I care about is that we get on with it. Supervisor Brandt-I think we have to expand the plant, no question of that. The question is how much and the question is should we blend an expansion program with the restriction of water on fifteen days a year or should we build twice as much plant as we need for those fifteen days a year. We might be smart to tell people to water their lawns drive a point and water with your own system. Councilman Caimano-Forgetting about the practicality of telling people that in an area where we've always said we had plenty of water there is a matter of fact that you can always be wrong. If you plan for a shortfall and you miss then you could be in real trouble you don't plan for a shortfall. Supervisor Brandt-By their figures it's six million gallons consumed in 2015. If you build for ten million your not planning on a shortfall what your doing is saying on those fifteen or eighteen days that you spike and use twice as much water as you normally do you may have to have some restrictions. Councilman Caimano-As I recall, the difference between eleven and fifteen was a matter of minor cost. Councilman Monahan-It's $250,000.00 which is nothing. Supervisor Brandt-If that's the way it tums out, so be it. But, so far what I've seen is that there can be six million dollars difference between the two plants whatever that figure is I sure like to know what that figure IS. Councilman Caimano-And that same logic can be used in planning shortfalls. You plan on fifteen days when you cut your sprinklers back and because of something we can't foresee today it's thirty days, thirty five days. I don't think you should be planning for shortfalls.2 Councilman Monahan-The other thing, I'm concerned of is that anybody can give you a low estimate and then it comes right down to what that goes out to bid for and what you get something for. Or you get somebody who wrote the contracts in such a manner that we ran into that cost overrun that we did in the sewer and that was a blow. You talk about paying things, there is where you get into trouble. Supervisor Brandt-We're not talking sewer we are talking water. That plant, I know was designed to go in modular. We build a five million gallon plant it could expand to ten million and to fifteen million. I know that the Town later in the 80's, did a look at those. I also know at that same time there was enormous growth and everybody was looking at a Regional Water Treatment Plant. But, the original concept isn't coming to be the people who are interested are very very small water consumers that is the other towns. The ones that are the big water consumers aren't interested in the regional plant so, I think we have to be careful not to over build too. Councilman Caimano- That's fine, all I say is let's get on with it before we get in real trouble. Councilman Monahan-Tell me if I'm wrong, but under the State aren't we suppose to do a twenty five year projection? Mr. VanDusen-The State recommends twenty to twenty five years. The big problem is the time you start talking about plant expansion until a gallon of water flows it's years, it's been five years that we've been talking about. Councilman Monahan-What I'm saying is that we should be planning for some year early in the two thousand's. Councilman Caimano-Just give me a date in the next two weeks when we sit down and have a workshop with nothing but the water plant that's all I care about. Supervisor Brandt-Right now you've got two things on you the two rezonings, I like to see if we can get those out of our way. I like to stay in process with those and get them out of the way and then let's go to the water plant right behind that. Councilman Caimano-Ifwe don't pick a day it's not going to happen. Councilman Goetz-What would your suggestion be for a date? Councilman Caimano-Ifyou want to wait after the Red Lobster, I'm thinking of the week of February 22nd. We ought to be done by then and if we're not we're certainly close to it. Supervisor Brandt-I have no problem with it. Councilman Monahan-I think it should include the engineers. Supervisor Brandt-Pick a day of that week and invite the engineers in. Councilman Caimano-How about February 27th, Saturday at 9:00 a.m. It was the agreement of the Board to meet at this date. Discussion held regarding the organizing of a phone answering system for the Town. It was the decision of the Town Board to meet with Pete Brault and Harry Hansen regarding this matter. Attorney Dusek-Noted to the Board that he has received a message from Attorney Howard Krantz noting his opposition for the rezoning of Red Lobster. No further action taken. On motion, the meeting was adjourned. Respectfully Submitted, Darleen M. Dougher Town Clerk Town of Queensbury