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1993-06-22 SPECIAL TOWN BOARD MEETING JUNE 22, 1993 3:34 P.M. MTG#46 RES# 370-371 BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT Supervisor Michel Brandt Councilman Pliney Tucker Councilman Nick Caimano Councilman Susan Goetz Councilman Betty Monahan TOWN ATTORNEY Paul Dusek Supervisor Brandt -Called meeting to order. First of all, one of the reasons we called this meeting together was to discuss with Paul Naylor, through my secretary and his secretary, I've learned that he has an appointment this afternoon and he is not going to come here. I've tried to set up another meeting with him as soon as possible and the first time he can meet with us is on June 30th, a week from tomorrow. I'm very concerned about the expenditure of the repair and improvement funds for the Highway. I've tried to do a little research from time to time on the agreement that is called for in the Highway Law between the Town Board and the Town Superintendent of Highways. Earlier this year when Paul gave me a proposed contract basically he said in simple terms that the Town Board would agree to let him choose any highway he wanted to pave, just gave away our authority to him. I told him I wasn't willing to sign such a contract and that I wanted to enter into a contract between the Town Board and ourselves. I don't remember the exact date, but I had a discussion with him before June 14th about the need for such a contract and I suggested he sit down and have such a meeting. He had already requested it to be on the agenda of the June 14th meeting so the discussion that we could handle it on that agenda. The meeting of June 14th he canceled out and didn't come to the meeting and that item was pulled off the agenda. On June 21st, the agenda that came out the Friday before June 21st, included an item on the agenda with Paul to talk to us and I assumed that we could handle it then. But, then last night, again he choose not to show up. During the weekend I had a chance to go up, I drove on Pickle Hill Road in particular and saw that we have been paving there. It concerns me a great deal that he's paving without discussion with the Town Board and without an agreement in place. I for one, am not willing to continue to fund that. I think that we have under the law a clear right to such an agreement. I think, I've asked for it personally, I think Paul is just totally ignoring my wishes at least and I don't know what other Town Board members discussions have been with him but, clearly the law says that there should be an agreement in place. Councilman Caimano- That we sign? Supervisor Brandt-That we sign by the Board. Councilman Caimano-Where's the one last year? I don't remember signing one for last year. Councilman Monahan-There has never been a precedent for doing that in all the years that I've been on the Town Board. So, I mean that precedent says that we don't do it. Councilman Caimano-I don't remember signing one last year to be honest with you.2 Councilman Monahan-We didn't. Attorney Dusek-I thought you did sign one. Councilman Caimano- I've never seen the agreement. Supervisor Brandt -Betty, I can show you copies of some that you signed. Councilman Monahan-What kind of contract? Supervisor Brandt -On this subject you've signed such a contract in the past. Councilman Monahan-I'm surprised to see that Mike. It doesn't ring a bell maybe if I saw the piece of paper it would be, but by title it doesn't ring a bell. Supervisor Brandt-There is under the law and certainly he knows the Highway Law a provision for this. That contract is given to the County Superintendent of Highways or can be given the law calls for that. Councilman Monahan-We did roads tours and the roads were discussed and we agreed on them. Councilman Caimano- That's what I thought. Until, I talked to you and you straighten me out then after our meeting, I didn't know what he was talking about either you told me about the Town Law that... that. I don't know that I signed any document last year at all. Supervisor Brandt-But, we did meet and we came to an agreement... Councilman Caimano- Verbal agreement. Supervisor Brandt-And we have not met on this subject and we have not come to an agreement. Whether it's a formal contract or informal agreement a verbal contract is as binding as a written contract. Councilman Caimano-That's true. Except if the law says that we have to have a contract then we have to have a contract. If we didn't do it last year and we didn't do it this year what we have is a procedural problem that we have to control. Councilman Monahan- I would like to see written contracts, I mean we had the list of roads in the booklet just like we did last year. Councilman Caimano- That's all I saw was a list of roads. Councilman Monahan-This year? Councilman Caimano- This year. Supervisor Brandt-That list of roads was designed assuming Chips money and Chips money is not forth commg. Councilman Caimano-I don't think that's so. There was enough roads there, I think that was the original two hundred some odd thousand dollars which we approved for the roads. There are not enough roads there. Councilman Tucker-It comes to $348,341.69. I thought we approved 7 miles of road at $26,000 a mile. Councilman Caimano-I thought it was thirteen at twenty six, but whatever. Supervisor Brandt-Thirteen is what we we're doing with Chips money. Councilman Caimano-So then it was half of that. It was seven at $26,000, which is $182,000. I thought it was around $200,000 that we approved. Supervisor Brandt-I think there are some major questions that have to be addressed here as to the level of funding and what roads we're paving. When Paul decides on his own to go out and pave certain roads without our input I'm offended by that. I think it's wrong it's contrary to the conversations I've had with him regarding the law. I've looked into it a bit and perhaps he has some money somewhere in some funds that he can do this with. I've asked him, you know in the conversation of last nights meeting, I've asked that that be identified. I don't know what the Boards feeling is on this, but I'm expecting.... Councilman Caimano-I think that certainly there are reasons to question this thing. But, before both sides go off into fireworks we ought to sit down and find out where we are what's the explanation for this thing. I don't remember this thing about a contract comes as a total surprise to me. I have not signed any agreement with the Highway Department other than the fact that I have agreed by raising my hand like the rest of us did to his budget. As I told you this afternoon on the telephone, I assumed by that and my assumption was wrong and he straightened me out that the Highway Superintendent then had the authority to spend X amount of dollars on the roads. He then out of a courtesy and it seemed to me to be a political courtesy more than anything else went to each of the Ward Leaders and said, look here's what I'm planning does this kind of work with what you are doing and we all kind of nodded with that. But, I didn't know that was a formal declaration I was making, I honestly thought it was kind of..... Councilman Goetz-This year or last year? Councilman Caimano-Last year. In any year that he does it I thought it was a political courtesy so that all Wards would be semi -equally represented. I have no idea of any report. I didn't sign anything last year that I know of. I don't remember anything other than the drive when we saw the roads and said that's okay. Councilman Goetz-We had a schedule for a drive this year, I wonder why we didn't? Councilman Caimano- I have no idea. Councilman Goetz-I do have questions, I need his input on my Ward and I have input for him. Councilman Caimano-Before we go crazy with this thing there are obviously some, there certainly are on my part some bad thoughts there just wrong thoughts. We need to sit down with him, I'm sorry he is not here today. Councilman Tucker-How are we going to do that if he doesn't want to show up, Nick? Councilman Caimano-I haven't ask him whether he wants or not want to show up, I assume that he has to show up right? Attorney Dusek-If you don't reach an agreement as to what roads are going to be repaired or paved there are going to be some problems he can't spend that money. Councilman Caimano- Is there no other day in this week he can meet? Supervisor Brandt-He said the soonest he could meet with us is June 30th. I said I would try to arrange a meeting any time any day of the week including Monday night when we have a Regular Town Board Meeting and he can only meet with us June 30th. I am unwilling to let him spend the entire budget wherever he chooses between now and June 30th, I can see that coming. As far as I'm concerned I'm ready to notify the people who provide the materials that this is not a Town Board obligation and that they had better be aware they may be selling it to Paul Naylor individually and personally. Councilman Goetz-Why didn't he make those other dates that you mentioned? Supervisor Brandt-I don't know, he chose not to come. It was on the schedule.... Councilman Caimano- There was one time he was coming and the only reason he was coming was we were going to go over that snow and ice contract the new one.... Councilman Goetz-State Highway Funds. Councilman Caimano-And I wasn't going to be at the meeting so, I assume that was canceled because of that. Councilman Tucker-He was suppose to be on last night, but it didn't happen. Councilman Monahan-And I think that one time that it was suppose to be on he didn't have all the facts from the State yet. Remember after we met with the State there were still more things to be gathered. Councilman Caimano-Maybe what we should do before we blow this thing into the water and cause the Town problems as opposed to everybody else. Maybe you as the Town Attorney acting on behalf of the Board so he doesn't think there is any political shenanigans here say, look we have some honest questions we need answers for the Town. How about we need to get together as quickly as possible, I can't imagine it would take more than a half hour to get this thing resolved can you, Mike? Supervisor Brandt-I can imagine a good thorough discussion could take hours possible. Councilman Caimano-It could, but I don't think so. Their either going to like it or not like it and that's the end of it. Councilman Goetz-I have some other questions I'd want to ask him about since we didn't get that sand screen or whatever it is and have we made other arrangements. Councilman Monahan-They've been working on repairing the old one, but god knows how much that's going to cost. Councilman Goetz-It's more than just the paving. I really want to talk to him. Now, I saw him we went to that VFW, you all were there remember whatever it was. Councilman Caimano-Memorial Day Parade. Councilman Goetz-At that time, I said I really want to talk to you about my paving. Now, maybe that was an inappropriate time to do it and he said he couldn't meet with me until last week and I didn't hear from him so I don't know what to do. Attorney Dusek-I'm happy to do whatever the Board would like. I have no problem calling up Mr. Naylor attempting to mediate this thing mediate and bring the parties together. Supervisor Brandt-The Town Law is very clear why don't you read it. Attorney Dusek-I'm familiar with section if that's what your talking about. This is the Standard 284 Agreement. Supervisor Brandt-That opinion says that he cannot without, who's opinion is that? Attorney Dusek-This is out ofa Court case in 1976. It says the Town Superintendent of Highways may not make any payments for highway repairs in absence of an agreement with the Town Board as to the manner in which money is levied and collected for repairing improvement of highways and as to the manner which money is received from the State for that purpose shall be expended nor may any repairs or improvements be made in highway system of Township in any manner other than set forth in Agreement. Councilman Caimano-But, you can't be arbitrary and capricious either. If we haven't done this in the past and I don't know if we have. Attorney Dusek-Nick, I would have to say my recollection is as far as I know, I've never gone on the road trip so I don't know but, as far as I know every year there used to be a road trip and they go out and decide what roads are going to be paved. To me that must of been when they were reaching this understanding as required as a 284, cause why would they do that... Councilman Caimano-Mike just said there was a contract signed in the past by a previous board. Attorney Dusek-Well last year, I can't remember the year before, but I do distinctly remember a contract of this nature coming to my attention I thought it went back to Mike or it went to all the Board. But, there was a contract that was circulating around last year somebody asked me a question and I said, you better believe it. Councilman Caimano-I'mjust asking that we don't be arbitrary and capricious. Councilman Monahan-I would like to see that contract. Supervisor Brandt-Not only do we have to...the law so does Mr. Naylor. I see a pattern of things that bothers me a great deal. I've heard Pliney Tucker in a Town Board Meeting come back and say the word came to him that if you don't get a Board and do what is told to be done by the politicians then by jesus you won't get any paving in your district. Councilman Caimano-At a Town Board Meeting? Supervisor Brandt-That was done at a Committee Meeting. Councilman Monahan-That wasn't said by Paul either. It was somebody else sounding off a personal opmlOn. Supervisor Brandt-Well it was a former Town Board member. Now, when I see him circumvent this part of the law an go and spend the very limited funds we have in whatever manner he wants to, I'm concerned. I think it's time to blow the whistle and say, stop until you have an agreement. Councilman Caimano-Fine. I don't disagree with you one bit. All I'm saying is if we haven't as a Board whether it's this Board or a previous Board done anything to make him whoever the Highway Superintendent is tow the letter of the law prior to this then what we need to do is say, this is where it stops. Supervisor Brandt-I think we have done it in prior it may have been informal, but it was done, I believe it was formal also. I think he's well aware of this law and he's circumventing it. Councilman Monahan-I think maybe the....agreement that Paul read that it could also refer to the fact the agreement...during budget time put these numbers in your budget and you collect the taxes.... Supervisor Brandt-You have to read the law Betty that's just not the case. Councilman Goetz-I'm concerned about the percentages and I understand there are some other numbers that I probably should be concerned with and I like to hear his input on it. But, when the percentages came out my Ward is really low constantly for the last 91,92,93. Councilman Caimano-But, your Ward.... Councilman Goetz-I know what he told me because of the Quaker Road Sewer District. I don't want to take somebody else's percentages if I'm not due it. More concern to me is I drove all the roads because I wanted to see, you know I have some questions about the roads he has got. But, I know of roads in other people's Wards, if! don't need it I don't want to say its got to be 25 percent. Councilman Caimano- Y our not complaining it's to low? Councilman Goetz-It made me look at it when it was shook out. But, Betty pointed out to me last night there may be some other factors that come into play. If he won't meet with us how am I going to ask him? Councilman Caimano-Well, I don't know. I'm not saying he won't meet with us he needs to find a way to get him to meet with us as quickly as possible. Councilman Goetz-Like he's got Twicwood Lane down, I don't want this in the paper, one street he's got down. I don't think he's paved one street over to me it was a lot worse things like that I need to talk to him about. Supervisor Brandt-I have seen roads in the Town that need paving worse than some that we just finished paving. I like to have my input on that, too. Councilman Tucker-Where does this thing stand now? Are we going to let Mr. Dusek put it together as soon as? Councilman Monahan-Well, shall we all just in case put it on our calendar for three thirty next Wednesday so we have that time reserved? Supervisor Brandt-We'll have our whole pavement schedule gone Betty, I'm not willing to do that. Councilman Caimano-He can't pave... Supervisor Brandt-He did $13,000 and $17,000 in the last Audit and none of us knew paving was going on certainly I didn't. Councilman Caimano- That's only one mile. Supervisor Brandt-That's one mile out of six. Councilman Monahan-Pickle Hill got started what it's the second and third year so it's been an on going road that they've been trying to bring up to standards. Councilman Caimano- They started on Corinth Road last Wednesday. But, I think you need to tell him that it's really imperative that we get together as quickly as possible. Councilman Goetz-So it's tentative for the thirtieth? Councilman Caimano-As far as I'm concerned it's tentative. Supervisor Brandt-What are you going to do shut down his operation till then or are you just want to let him pave six miles of roads come and find out.... Councilman Caimano-He's not going to pave six miles of road between now and next Wednesday. Supervisor Brandt-If he paves two that a third of the budget that you have available. If he paves three it's almost a half. Councilman Monahan-There is a bigger question here. If there is not money to pave what are we going to do with the crew of the Highway Department or do we just practically shut down the Highway Department? Supervisor Brandt-I don't know, that's what I want to question. Councilman Monahan-There are a lot of ramifications here rather than just paving maybe. Councilman Caimano- That's right. Councilman Monahan-I don't think we should get this tunnel vision going. Paul that case went the eighteenth to the Supreme Court? Attorney Dusek-I believe it's already gone and they are probably waiting for a decision. Councilman Caimano-The chances of us getting any Chips money this summer are... Councilman Monahan-When do you think that decision is going to come down the pike? Attorney Dusek-No matter which way it's decided they will probably end up appealing. You probably won't see a decision on that for a year. Councilman Goetz-I find it hard to believe he can't meet before the thirtieth, you know what I mean. Supervisor Brandt-We canceled out on work you did today, Pliney did today, to come to this meeting. Maybe he could find time on his busy schedule to do that even on the company payroll. I'll meet with him anytime any place, but I want to meet him. I don't want this aura of a political enforcement going on and that's what it seems like to me or a disregard for the law. Barbara Bennett -Offer him lunch. Supervisor Brandt-It has to be a Town Board meeting. Councilman Goetz-Maybe he can come Monday night to the Board meeting. Supervisor Brandt-That was asked of him today and he can't come till Monday. Councilman Tucker-If we turn his money off what's he's going to be doing? Supervisor Brandt-I don't know that. Councilman Tucker-He's paving right now, if we turn his money off he ain't going to be doing anything either. Councilman Caimano-Ifyou indiscriminately turn the money off without getting answers to questions without hurting Paul Naylor or the Towns people we all want to do something precipitous if, in fact the money should be spent for the Town road... Councilman Tucker-The direction it's going right now and I don't know what his theory is he's paving in Ward One right now, Ward One. In the book we've got is $348,000 before he gets out of Ward Three there ain't going to be any left for Ward Four and I'm concerned about that and I've got a promise. Councilman Caimano-What are you saying to me? Do you know that he's going to go to Ward Three after he goes to Ward One? Councilman Tucker-He started in Ward One. He could go to Ward Two, Three, I don't know what he's going to do. Councilman Caimano-I don't either. Councilman Goetz-What did you think about Gurney Lane that forty nine or whatever it is? Did you think the whole one Gurney had to be done? Councilman Caimano-I don't think it's ever been done. Councilman Goetz-Really. Councilman Caimano-After they made the pool, I don't think it's ever been done that's the reason he did it. We had a lot of complaints, I thought nothing of it. Councilman Goetz-I didn't know if you had other streets that needed it. Councilman Caimano-All I really needed was Fox Hollow. But, I don't have a lot anyway. I have more dollars than you, but less streets. The point is we need to sit down and talk. Supervisor Brandt-We are trying to do that. We have agreed to do that, we're meeting here to do that, the only problem is Mr. Naylor's not here and not willing to meet with us until June 30th, so maybe you can call him and get his interest. Councilman Tucker -You know, if the money was all there to pave everything that he had here outside of your questions and the couple that I've got there wouldn't be any problem, but the money not's there. Supervisor Brandt-And we have to make adjustments and we have to come to that as a group. Indications are that Paul Naylor is playing hardball we're not playing hardball back. We have the financial responsibility that's our charge. If the money is dissipated without our input then we are not doing what we're suppose to do under the law and I don't intend to do that. Councilman Caimano-Why don't you call and see if he's finished with his meeting. Councilman Goetz-He had another meeting scheduled? Councilman Caimano- Yea. Attorney Dusek-I've reached Jean, Paul's secretary, he's still in a meeting. However, he is still in the building and I indicated to her that the Town Board would like to meet with Paul if he gets done with his meeting to come over. Supervisor Brandt-Let's put that behind us for now and move on to the water business in hopes that we can get together with Paul. DISCUSSION HELD Attorney Dusek-Presented and reviewed with Town Board members an updated draft of the Queensbury Water Department Water Treatment Plant, Storage Facilities and Distribution Request for Proposals for Engineering Services. RESOLUTION ACCEPTING DRAFT QUEENSBURY WATER DEPARTMENT TREATMENT PLANT, STORAGE FACILITIES & DISTRIBUTION REQUESTS FOR PROPOSALS - ENGINEERING SERVICES RESOLUTION NO. 370, 93 INTRODUCED BY: Mrs. Susan Goetz SECONDED BY: Mr. Pliney Tucker Councilman Goetz-I'll offer a resolution to accept this document with corrections. To be sent out as a RFP for Engineering Services for expansion of the Water Treatment Plant. To be put in the Dodge Eastern Contractors, the local paper and the Times Union. To be available in the Town Clerk's Office and will be sent out as soon as possible, and authorize the Town Attorney to prepare a notice for the newspaper in such form as may be approvable by the Town Attorney. Duly adopted this 22nd day of June, 1993 by the following vote: Ayes: Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mr. Brandt Noes: None AbsentNone RESOLUTION AMENDING RESOLUTION NO. 364, 93 RESOLTUION NO. 371,93 INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION SECONDED BY: Mrs. Susan Goetz Town Clerk, Dougher-We like to correct Resolution No. 364, 93 to read Cedar Court instead of Cedarwood Court Road from the letter of credit last night. Duly adopted this 22nd day of June, 1993, by the following vote: Ayes: Mrs. Goetz, Mrs. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mrs. Monahan, Mr. Brandt Noes: None AbsentNone DISCUSSION HELD Attorney Dusek-Phoned Mr. Naylor's Office there was no answer. Supervisor Brandt-Paul one concern I have every time I read an audit report it talks about management of the Town is responsible for the financial affairs and safeguards of the resources. Another one it says the Town Board is responsible for the management of the resources of the Town is that correct? Attorney Dusek -Your charged with the Audit responsibilities as well as the budgeting responsibilities for the Town funds. Supervisor Brandt-The way these monies are spent are our responsibility. We can't advocate from that or if we do, I think we're making a grave error and I'm very concerned about this. I think we have the responsibility to make sure the proper roads are paved. I know that it doesn't appear on the paving schedule at all, but I've been told that Mud Pond Road is in very very bad shape. I know that the Luzerne Mountain Road is in very tough shape at the top of the mountain it's almost impassable it was at least earlier this year. Councilman Tucker-From Tuthill to the top of the mountain? Supervisor Brandt-Right. But, the very crest is broken to where cars would drag bottom on it that's a very highly used roads. I think we need to discuss these things. Councilman Caimano-Keep working on him the sooner the better. Attorney Dusek -You want me continue to try to reach him? Councilman Caimano- I think you should. Councilman Tucker-How much time are we going to give him Nick? Councilman Caimano- You've got to the thirtieth. Right now he said the thirtieth we're trying to get it sooner than the thirtieth that's only a week away. I guess Monday night if the agenda is full we can meet before hand we can extend the meeting. Supervisor Brandt-Do you want at this point to do nothing? Councilman Caimano-I don't want to do nothing. I want him to continue to operate and see if we can get it done faster. Tomorrow you can have a conversation with him and report back to us what that conversation says. Tell him that its important that we meet all of us would like to meet with him. Attorney Dusek-I'm certainly happy to try to reach him. Councilman Monahan-I should hope that he could come by Monday evening maybe we could meet earlier. Supervisor Brandt-I'm willing to meet any day of any night this week. Councilman Goetz-Thursday we're interviewing at five thirty maybe we could meet after that. Councilman Caimano- To go back to what I said earlier impress upon him the fact we're trying to resolve differences between the Town and the Highway Department for the benefit of the Towns people. Supervisor Brandt-The fact he may be spending money without authorization we may be protecting him from that as a matter of fact. He could be incurring a personal liability. Councilman Goetz-So your going to offer Thursday late afternoon or Monday night? Attorney Dusek-What I'm getting the impression from you, you want me to try to reach him. When I reach him as far as discussion of times is concerned I'll certainly indicate to him that the Board is schedule to meet five thirty on Thursday if that is compatible with his schedule that's certainly fine with you. If not I'll ask him if there is any other time he can meet with you before the thirtieth. Councilman Monahan-Wednesday we've got him scheduled for three thirty is that correct, on the thirtieth? Councilman Caimano- That's so far. Councilman Goetz-But, that's the last resort. Councilman Tucker-I think what you should impress on him is right a way and then dicker from there if you've got to dicker. Councilman Monahan-Mutually we have to find some way of getting around this impasse of no money. No further action taken. On motion, the meeting was adjourned. Respectfully Submitted, Miss Darleen M. Dougher Town Clerk Town of Queensbury