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1993-10-13 SPECIAL TOWN BOARD MEETING OCTOBER 13, 1993 4:00 p.m. #71 TOWN BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT Supervisor Michel Brandt Councilman Betty Monahan Councilman Susan Goetz Councilman Nick Caimano Councilman Pliney Tucker Supervisor Brandt -Called the Meeting to order. I have asked Ralph VanDusen to come and talk to us first what he and I discussed this morning a matter that had, with the plant expansion he met with the O'Brien and Gere people yesterday and what comes up quickly is the, in doing O'Brien and Gere work they need to know what our intent is, as far as land goes next to the plant. We need to acquire some land so that we can expand and when we make a decision of what it is we are trying to acquire we have to make a formal presentation to Niagara Mohawk who owns the land and I suggest that Ralph come and talk to us directly about it and see if we can come to a decision. Mr. Ralph VanDusen-Deputy Water Supt. (Used maps) Just briefly this is a rectangle that we currently own where the treatment plant is. In the past we talked about purchasing some land from Niagara Mohawk to allow us to expand the facilities one of the concerns was, as the, I will call it the neighborhood becomes developed once the land is built on it is no longer available for a treatment plant. It is currently vacant and it seems like it makes sense in long term planning for the Town to acquire that land that we will need at some point, certainly when we expand the plant. Currently to take the plant from where we are today the ten million gallons a day the question of land of what land we want to use for the sludge drawing facilities. It seems to make some sense in the long term standpoint to plan it in a location that allows you to continue to expand the plant and not have to disrupt those drying beds or sludge.. There are a couple different scenarios that may work out, what was originally proposed by O'Brien and Gere a long time ago was that this parcel behind and back toward the Northway is thirty four acres, we acquire a portion or all of that to enable us to move currently in our yard we have like a pipe yard and some storage of fittings and what have you in this corner of our property. It might make sense to move that over into this area the drying beds were envisioned as being over here, as well, because drying beds are relatively shallow and they take up a fair amount of space maybe as much as an acre a piece. When we go to fifteen million gallons a day we will probably be looking at somewhere in the range of four or six acres of land that would be taken up for drying bed purposes. This area in here I think is in the range of seven acres I am not sure if I have that or not, I think this rectangle is in the range of seven acres that we have so in reality half of it would have to be used for drying beds and we do not have to go to fifteen million gallons a day and we do not have that much land available to be able to dedicate that to that. There is another scenario here we may be able to put some, to go to ten million gallons a day if we put drying beds in here that will take care of it but when we go to fifteen you are going to run out of space and you are going to have to move those, you will have to dig those up and move them over here. Supervisor Brandt -So you are better off to put them over here to start with. Councilman Caimano-Is all this land available? That whole triangle. Mr. VanDusen-This triangle is available. Councilman Caimano- What about this? Mr. VanDusen-There are three different parcels that Niagara Mohawk is broken it into. There's this parcel between the canal and the back of our property they are calling parcel B, that is available Councilman Caimano- This is our plant right here? Mr. VanDusen-This is our current facility right here. Councilman Caimano-Ok. That is available. Mr. VanDusen-This is available. There is another parcel which originally was labeled parcel A and it was this whole thing, this is our intake building up here we do not own that we have an easement on it. We had originally asked to purchase this whole thing at that point we thought maybe some drying beds over in here, left land for an additional intake building here. Nimo has come back and said we do not want to sell that whole thing to you we will sell this area here which. Councilman Caimano- Why don't they want to sell the whole thing to us? Supervisor Brandt-It is prime recreation area. And the Town should be looking at that parcel in its recreation plan. Councilman Caimano-How many acres is that whole thing? AB&C. Mr. VanDusen-This is 7.3, I sorry, this is roughly a two acre parcel, this is a 3 1/2 acre Councilman Caimano- That is not my question. I do not want to know what they want to give us I want to know what the whole parcel is. Mr. VanDusen-This is 7.3, Nimo says we will not sell this. Councilman Caimano- They won't sell that. Mr. VanDusen-This parcel C they will not sell they have got a hydro-electric plant down here the gate house is here, they want to keep this so they can work as a construction site to store things here, that is not for sale. This is roughly 3.4 acres this is 7.3. Councilman Caimano-So it is 10.7 acres. Supervisor Brandt-But it is the piece over here that's. Mr. VanDusen-This piece over here which on this map is this is 34 acres. Councilman Tucker-How much are they asking... Councilman Monahan-This parcel was not on there. Mr. VanDusen-That is correct physically, this sites like this. Councilman Caimano-So there are 44 acres give or take, that are available potentially. Mr. VanDusen-This is going to sit something like that. Councilman Tucker-How much are they asking for all of it any idea? Mr. VanDusen-1 do not think any prices have been, in the past when we purchase, in the past when we worked out a deal we purchased some land back in here and it was appraised and the price it was appraised for is what it was sold for. Councilman Caimano- Which was? Mr. VanDusen-1 do not remember, it was relatively low.. Councilman Tucker-I thought there was some negotiations going on to acquire some more of this land? Supervisor Brandt-There has been no negotiations because of their application in front of us for Councilman Tucker-No, no this was before this. Supervisor Brandt-I do not know that. Councilman Monahan-You are talking about 44 acres roughly there. Mr. VanDusen-Overall, now keeping in mind this parcel has no road frontage, anywhere, has no water frontage so it is certainly not Councilman Caimano- That is the worst part. Mr. VanDusen-This parcel here has 13 feet of road frontage. Councilman Monahan-Which one? Mr. VanDusen-This parcel that is by our intake, that would go down by our intake building. Councilman Monahan-Oh, is that the parcel you are talking about they they will not sell? Mr. VanDusen-No, this portion right here. Councilman Monahan-Oh, ok, that does not have a label on it then. Or is it part of parcel A? Mr. VanDusen-It is part of parcel A and they are calling it exhibit A, this is a Nimo drawing here, ok, this 34 acre parcel has I think it is I do not know, 50 feet of road frontage or something like that. Supervisor Brandt-Is that road, is that? Mr. VanDusen-This is Corinth Road right here. Supervisor Brandt-Ok. To me you want that large parcel for the future. Mr. VanDusen-Personally, I, it is the right thing to do for the long term. Councilman Caimano-Go for the whole 44 acres? Mr. VanDusen-Where the question comes up is, when O'Brien and Gere is pricing for a cost estimate, if they are going to put drying beds here, it will have one cost if they are going to have to say no we are not going to ever buy any more land find a way to fit it in here it is going to be whole different pricing scenario. They are not ready to design it yet but when they come back with us for a map, plan and report they are going to give a cost estimate and to do that they need to know the general philosophy because, is it probably going to be here is it probably going to be here. Supervisor Brandt-I think you want parcel B, I think you want minimum of this piece in here that they are showing which sits in here and I think you want all of this so that in the future... Councilman Caimano-We should go after all of A with a fall back position of the minimum, right? Councilman Monahan-So you are saying for Ralph to go after 44 acres to start with plus or minus some ... this, this, this and then if you cannot get this to go for the small parcel here, parcel B and this big parcel. Councilman Tucker-Whatever we can get. Mr. VanDusen-The septic system for this building is now is right here. Supervisor Brandt-We can get any of it because you can take it you have the authority... Councilman Tucker-We will take all they will allow us to have. Mr. VanDusen-Certainly I would recommend that, that is something that we need to come back with.. Supervisor Brandt-Is that agreed upon by everybody? ..agreed...So you will contact them and start the process. Mr. VanDusen-Ok, I will contact them and advise them that it is our goal to obtain those..to install the drying beds in a situation to put in a long term plan so it does not require moving it, whether it is 10 years or 40 years down the road... Councilman Monahan-Or even if someday in this Town we needed to go to 20 million, I take it that we would have plenty of room there now any expansion we could forsee in the next fifty years. Mr. VanDusen-As long as you acquire this you can build a forty million gallon a day plant there yea., ok. We did discuss at length the possibilities dealing with high lift pumping to get the water from the plant out into the system and when we went through, we spent several hours in fact just going through different scenarios how will this work and how will this be implemented and they will be getting back to you in the very near future on the cost estimates on this. Councilman Monahan-That is the area where you were concerned about vortexing... Mr. VanDusen-That is correct and being able to take the.. . out of service and some of the scenarios involve taking the treatment plant out of service for a long period of time to make the... work in some cases days. Councilman Monahan-We cannot afford that. Mr. VanDusen-No, you can't we do not have storage for days Councilman Monahan-That is not an option. Mr. VanDusen-So, unless you bring in a temporary treatment plant somewhere, which you have got to get Health Dept. approval for and you are going to spend more money to ..that Councilman Monahan-Forget that one. Mr. VanDusen-But those are things we are looking at and they will be getting back to the Board with that information and cost estimates. We looked at the tank sites.. that is about it for tonight. What I will do in the future as we have meetings and discussions I will do memo's to Mike and the Board. Supervisor Brandt-You are saying on the 25th they think they will be to us... Mr. VanDusen-1 talked to them at 3:30 today and felt that on the 25th by Monday the 25th they would have dollars, preliminary dollars on probably the whole project and a real good feeling on the high lift pump situation and they need input back from the Board to say here are your options here is how we think that they might work, which way do you want us to go. Councilman Monahan-Will they come in and explain those to us? Mr. VanDusen-Yes. They would be willing to meet with the Board to do that themselves. Councilman Tucker-On the land situation you are going to tell O'Brien and Gere Mr. VanDusen-That it is the Board's intention to attempt to acquire that entire parcel. Councilman Tucker-Are we going to into motion to try and get it or what? Councilman Caimano-We will have to hear what they say first. Mr. VanDusen-O'Brien and Gere is going to say fine. Councilman Caimano-Nimo. Mr. VanDusen-Oh, Nimo. Councilman Tucker-We do not even know whether they.. Councilman Caimano- W e do not know anything at this point. Supervisor Brandt-We have to, I do not know if we have to have a motion to negotiate I think what we have to do is to explore the negotiations.. Councilman Caimano-It is our intent to negotiate. Mr. VanDusen-Who would you like to do that? I do not care I just, I do not want the ball to sit in the corner with everyone thinking that someone else is picking it up. Councilman Tucker-Why wouldn't it be .. Councilman Monahan-O'Brien and Gere or Mike or who does it? Mr. VanDusen-It does not make any sense for O'Brien and Gere to act, I would think it would make sense for someone from the Water Dept. or someone from ... Supervisor Brandt-I would rather the Water Dept. does it than the General Board because we have a matter before us and I do not want to get into any discussions of the rezoning that they are asking for in light to what you are looking for, I would keep it totally separate, I think you should do it. Mr. VanDusen-So then you would like me to handle it. Supervisor Brandt-Yea, I think so. Mr. VanDusen-Ok, fine, I do not have a problem with that I just want to make sure it is clear. Councilman Tucker-So you are going to move on that right, Ralph? Mr. VanDusen-Yes. DISCUSSION HELD -TOWN BOARD SETS UP NEXT BUDGET WORKSHOPS October 20th Accounting, Attorney and Highway October 21st. Historian, Landfill, Water October 26th Wastewater, Recreation, Building and Grounds all to be held at 4:00 P.M. Supervisor's Conference Room BUDGET WORKSHOP 1. TOWN CLERK A. Town Clerk's Office B. Elections C. Records Access 2. PINE VIEW CEMETERY 3. ASSESSOR On motion the meeting was adjourned. Respectfully submitted, Miss Darleen M. Dougher Town Clerk-Queensbury