1996-03-20
o
ORIGINAL
()
QUEENSBURY ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS
FIRST REGULAR MEETING
MARCH 20, 1996
INDEX
Area Variance No. 8-1996
Tax Map No. 36-1-31
David Kenny
The Meeting Place Rest.
1.
Use Variance No. 12-1996
Tax Map No. 109-4-2.1
Washington County, SPCA, Inc.
14.
Area Variance No. 13-1996
Tax Map No. 66-1-5.1
Tuomo S. Nykanen 34.
Julie N. Nykanen
Area Variance No. 17-1996
Tax Map No. 16-1-32
Dr. & Mrs. Joseph G. Guerra 35.
Ar ea Var i ance No. 14-1996
Tax Map No. 41-1-21.1,
21.2, 21.3, 25
Alfred E. & Mary E. Kristensen 42.
THESE ARE NOT OFFICIALLY ADOPTED MINUTES AND ARE SUBJECT TO BOARD
AND STAFF REVISIONS. REVISIONS WILL APPEAR ON THE FOLLOWING MONTHS
MINUTES (IF ANY) AND WILL STATE SUCH APPROVAL OF SAID MINUTES.
\..-"
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
QUEENS BURY ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS
FIRST REGULAR MEETING
MARCH 20, 1996
7:00 P.M.
MEMBERS PRESENT
FRED CARVIN, CHAIRMAN
CHRIS THOMAS, SECRETARY
THOMAS FORD
WILLIAM GREEN
BONNIE LAPHAM
MEMBERS ABSENT
ROBERT KARPELES
DAVID MENTER
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR-JAMES MARTIN
PLANNER-SUSAN CIPPERLY
PLANNING BOARD ATTORNEY-MILLER, MANNIX AND PRATT, JEFF FRIEDLAND
STENOGRAPHER-MARIA GAGLIARDI
OLD BUSINESS:
READ PUBLIC HEARING LETTER FROM ROSETTI INTO RECORD REGARDING
HEINEMAN VARIANCE FROM LAST MONTH.
MR. THOMAS-I haven't got the letter.
MR. CARVIN-George, is there something on that Old Business there
from Rosetti, regarding the Heineman?
MR. HILTON-It should
It was read into the
plan for that same
Heineman variance.
be in the box. There was a letter submitted.
record before the Planning Board for the site
item, a let t e r 0 fin t ere s t reg a r din g the
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Well, seeing as how that variance was tabled, we
could, and I believe I left the public hearing open on that, we can
take care of that at that time, when we, if we should ever see that
again.
MR. HILTON-Yes. It should be in that box.
MR. THOMAS-It's not in there.
MR. HILTON-Okay.
NEW BUSINESS:
AREA VARIANCE NO. 8-1996 TYPE II HC-IA DAVID KENNY THE MEETING
PLACE REST. OWNER: SAME AS ABOVE FRONT OF DAYS INN HOTEL, EAST
SIDE OF NYS ROUTE 9, SOUTH OF ROUTE 149 APPLICANT PROPOSES TO
CONSTRUCT AN 800 SQ. FT. ADDITION TO AN EXISTING RESTAURANT. THIS
ADDITION REQUIRES RELIEF FROM THE DENSITY REQUIREMENTS OF SECTION
179-23A, THE PERMEABILITY REQUIREMENTS OF SECTION 179-23C AND THE
STREET SETBACKS IN SECTION 179-23C (TRAVEL CORRIDOR OVERLAY ZONE).
WARREN COUNTY PLANNING 3/13/96 TAX MAP NO. 36-1-31 LOT SIZE:
3.39 ACRES SECTION 179-23A, 179-23C
MICHAEL O'CONNOR, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT
STAFF INPUT
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
Notes from Staff, Area Variance No. 8-1996, David Kenny The
Meeting Place Rest., Meeting Date: March 20, 1996 "PROJECT
LOCATION: Days Inn Hotel NYS Route 9 PROPOSED PROJECT AND
CONFORMANCE WITH THE ORDINANCE: The applicant is proposing to
build a 800 square foot addition to an existing restaurant. This
addition requires relief from the density requirements of Section
179-23A, the permeability requirements of Section 179-23C and the
street setbacks in Section 179-28C (Travel Corridor Overlay Zone).
The property currently has 60,000 square feet of building area on
this lot. This is over the maximum allowed square footage of
56,644 for a lot of this size in the HC-IA zoning district. The
proposed addition would further increase the total square footage
on the property to a total of 60,800. As a result the permeability
of the property which is currently at 25.6% would be decreased to
25.1%. The addition would also be located 55 feet from the Route
9 Right of Way instead of the required 75 feet. CRITERIA FOR
CONSIDERING AN AREA VARIANCE, ACCORDING TO CHAPTER 267, TOWN LAW.
I. BENEFIT TO THE APPLICANT: The applicant states that this would
allow him to add on to an existing restaurant. 2. FEASIBLE
ALTERNATIVES: There does not seem to be any alternatives which
could provide a lesser amount of relief from the Ordinance. 3. IS
THIS RELIEF SUBSTANTIAL RELATIVE TO THE ORDINANCE?: The relief
that is being sought would further increase the overall density of
this lot, and decrease the permeability. The existing setback on
Route 9 is 51 feet, the new addition would have a setback of 55
feet. 4. EFFECTS ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR COMMUNITY?: Thi s
addition would increase the density and decrease the permeability
on this lot. The subject property's permeability and density
already conflicts with the requirements of the HC-IA district. 5.
IS THIS DIFFICULTY SELF-CREATED?: The existing nonconforming
street setback was in place before the setback was changed to 75
feet in the Zoning Ordinance. Development of this property has
created the permeability and density conflicts which exist today.
PARCEL HISTORY: This hotel was built under Site Plan 31-87. An
800 square foot addition was approved in 1995. The most recent ZBA
action for this property was the granting of setback relief for a
ramp which was required by ADA regulations. STAFF COMMENTS AND
CONCERNS: Staff has concerns about increasing the density on this
property. The density of the property at this time is well over
what is allowed in the HC-IA district. The current permeability is
under the 30% required by the Zoning Ordinance. Staff is concerned
about reducing the permeability any further. SEQR: Type II, no
further action required."
MR. THOMAS-"At a meeting of the Warren County Planning Board,
on the 13th day of March 1996, the above application for an
Variance to construct an 800 sq. ft. addition to restaurant.
reviewed, and the following action was taken. Recorrnnendation
No County Impact" Signed by C. Powel South, Chairperson.
held
Area
was
to:
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Dave, do you have a corrnnent?
MR. MENTER-I'm going to abstain from voting on this issue.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
MR. HILTON-Staff has some comment, for the record. Initially,
figures that were provided indicated that the applicant would be
reducing the permeability on site. After these corrnnents were
prepared, the applicant's agent amended this information and in
actuality, they aren't decreasing the permeability any. So the
reduction of permeability isn't an issue. The density of the site,
however, remains an issue.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Again, any questions of the applicant?
MR. THOMAS-No.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. CARVIN-Okay. I just have a question. When I was out there, it
had appeared that this is green area here. Is this an accurate
representation of what this lot looks like?
MR. O'CONNOR-My understanding is it is an accurate reprèsentation.
The pavement line, I don't know if it's clearly shown there. It's
just behind where the restaurant bui Iding is, I'm told. Let me
state for the record, I'm Michael O'Connor, from the firm of Little
& O'Connor, and I appear here on behalf of the applicant. My
understanding is that is a set aside area for potential parking
area. It is not actually the paved parking area. When the site
plan was done some time ago, that was shown as potential parking if
necessary.
MR. CARVIN-All right, because it appeared, when I was out there,
that, although I don't think it was curbing, it did appear that
there is no traffic flow this way.
MR. O'CONNOR-It's not used. It's very seldom called upon.
take a look at the parking in the back, you'll find there's
in the back of the site also.
If you
excess
MR. CARVIN-It seems to me there was a dumpster or something over in
here. Are you familiar with this, George? In other words, this
si te, I'm looking at this representation. When I was out on the
site, this doesn't look like anything that l recognize.
MR. HILTON-Well, no, I don't remember seeing a dumpster. I think
that area is designed for overflow parking, that green space back
there.
MR. MENTER-Yes. There is a dumpster.
MR. O'CONNOR-It is presently green space.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. That's what I thought. It didn't look like, I
mean, this kind of indicates that there is potential for traffic to
flow around the building, but when I looked at it, there's no way
that there's traffic that would go around it.
MR. O'CONNOR-I don't believe that there is. They've done planting,
probably more planting than what they had at one time, simply
because they aren't using the parking, or at least there's not a
demand on the business.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Well, I guess my question would be in regard to
the permeability. Is it actually at 25 or 26, as it's currently
stated, or is it actually much greater than that?
MR. O'CONNOR-I can't honestly tell you, because I don't know how
the figures were scaled. My recollection of my conversation with
David Kenny was that all potential area of parking was included as
being nonpermeable, with the idea that someday it may be actually
developed as parking. I think our definition of permeable in the
Ordinance includes parking areas, whether paved or not paved, as
long as they're compacted, so that drainage is not as easy through
them.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
MR. O'CONNOR-I think Staff may have answered your question, though.
The addition that is proposed is proposed in an area that is
already paved. There was some misunderstanding in that, and it
gets rather convoluted, but I can answer some of it, in the sense
that in 1988, when the initial site plan was approved, there was
more paving on the site then there presently is. Some time along
the last few years, this area, which was at one time paved, was
redesigned and became a green area. So if you look at the site
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
from the site plan approval that was approved back in 1988, there's
actually an increase in permeable area, and that was some initial
discussion that David Kenny had with Staff, that apparently got
some, I don't know everybody got off in not full understanding of
what each other was saying. When 1 got involved, I asked, where is
the decrease in permeability by the proposed action? The proposed
action is the construction of this wing, if you will, of the
restaurant, and the best 1 can tell is that there is no affect at
all upon permeability. That's a paved area. If anything, I think
Beautification suggested that on the outside of this, that there be
a planting area of maybe two feet. So two feet the length of that
proposed would be an additional increase of permeable area, and it
calculates permeability.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. This corridor here. What does this consist of?
Is this just a long corridor to connect to the hotel, or is this?
These are rooms in here?
MR. O'CONNOR-These rooms are serviced from the outside. So this is
fully motel. This is not a corridor. You would go outside the
restaurant to get to the office area of the motel here, and if you
had a room in this area, you would enter directly from the parking
lot. They don't go both sides. They enter from the south side
only. What you have, I think, is the 800 foot addition
superimposed upon what was the 1988 mapping.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, but those are all rooms then?
MR. O'CONNOR-This is all rooms right through here.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Any other questions from anyone?
I'll open up the public hearing.
All right.
PUBLIC HEARING OPENED
MR. CARVIN-Any letters, correspondence?
MR. THOMAS-No.
MR. CARVIN-All right. Any public conment at all?
MR. O'CONNOR-I'd like to submit a letter from Mr. Kenny to the
Board, just to give you a little bit of narrative idea as to
exactly why he's making the request, rather than simply the
numerical figure of saying it's 800 feet that he has or doesn't
have.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
then.
Well, why don't you read that into the record,
MR. THOMAS-A letter dated 3/16/96 "Dear Board Members, I am
writing in reference to Area Variance No. 8-1996, required for the
proposed 800 sq. ft. addition to the Meeting Place Restaurant. I
am not able to be present at the March 20th meeting, as I have a
prior commitment. I would like to express my reasons for this
addition, and discuss the variance application. The addition is of
great importance to the Days Inn Motel as well as the Meeting Place
Restaurant. In addition, it will be an aesthetic improvement,
giving the building a much more balanced appearance. Over the past
few years the 'off the road' business in the motel has diminished
greatly. In keeping with industry trends we have pursued the motor
coach business, and in doing so, it has become evident to us that
our seating capacity in the restaurant precludes us from being able
to acconmodate certain groups. Each bus carries approximately 45
people, and occupies approximately 15 rooms in the motel. We
currently can acconilllOdate 100 people in the restaurant which
enables us to serve 2 busses. Tour operators have indicated to us
that at 109 rooms the motel is adequate in size, but that our
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(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
dining capacity limits the groups that they will consider bringing
to our property, since it is important to these operators that
groups are able to dine at one time. In addition to accommodating
groups, the added seating will enable us to better serve our
customers during peak periods when it's common, particularly in the
morning, for motel guests to eat during the same one or two hour
period. At the time the property was developed in 1988, there were
no variances needed. The zoning has since changed, requiring us to
apply for these variances. The proposed addition's front setback
would certainly have no impact on the road or neighboring
properties since it would actually be further from the road than
the current building. Most buildings on this road have approximate
setbacks of 50' because they preexisted the current 75' setback
requirements. What makes the area unique is the difficulty that
the increase in setback requirements has placed on each business
owner looking to make any change to their business. With regard to
permeability, the proposed project would effect only paved parking
area, and would result in no change to permeability or green space.
The current 30% requirement for permeability was changed from 20%
after the 1988 site plan on this property. I currently have
approx. 25% green space, and have increased green space by approx.
3,000 sq. ft. since the 1988 site plan was filed. The proposed
density would also have a minimal impact. The code currently
allows for 12,000 sq. ft. of gross floor area per acre for a single
story building, or a total of 15,000 sq. ft. of gross floor area
for a multi-story building in this zone. On this property a one
story building of approximately 40,000 sq. ft. of land area would
be allowed for general commercial use. Since a smaller percentage
of property may be used for a two story bui lding, the density issue
is not one of ground space use, but one of intensity of that use.
The motel use is much less intense than many of the other allowed
uses in this zone, as is shown by town parking requirements. As an
example, approx. 165 parking spaces are required for the current
motel, but for a similar size retail building (which would be
subject to the same density requirements), approximately 300 spaces
would be required. I truly believe that the intent of the zoning
regulations adopted in 1988 was not to penalize and limit
developments such as motels and other lower intensity commercial
uses. Motels require only one car for 500 sq. ft. while retail
requires about 2 times as much parking for the same square footage.
I believe that the purpose for only allowing 15,000 total sq. ft.
per acre with a two story building, is that for many allowed uses
in this zone, there would not be sufficient space left on the
parcel for the required parking. With the much less intense motel
use, this is not an issue. There are no feasible alternatives to
this proposal due to the configuration of the property, this
solution would appear to have the least impact on the property and
surrounding properties, as well as provide aesthetic benefits.
Sincerely, David J. Kenny"
MR. O'CONNOR-I would add just a couple of comments. We're talking
about an 800 foot addition. It's my understanding that 270 feet of
that is actually the kitchen for the existing restaurant and the
balance is for seating. So that he can serve four buses, the make
up of four buses, at one time, as opposed to what he presently
serves, because of the change in the nature of the business, as
opposed to being "off road" business, being more coach business,
and trying to acconmlOdate what is apparently the direction of
business. He really is probably not talking about attracting a lot
more traffic or business to this site, but better servicing what is
on the site, and that gets into his issue about maybe comparing him
to other conm1ercial uses is not necessarily realistic here, because
if he brings a bus in, you're talking about two, three spots, as
opposed to the number of cars that may be this type of conm1ercial
spot might have if it were retail, something of that nature. He's
talking about doing the coach business, servicing the motel
business that's there in the early morning, which is when people
like to have, most of his off street business is done in the
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
restaurant at lunch time, when much of the motel is vacant. So he
is able to kind of swap the uses a little bit, and he services
there a lot of people who are elsewhere occupied in that stretch of
Route 9, who walk to that restaurant as being one of the few
freestanding restaurants in that particular area. The impact on
the community is very insignificant. All of which he has requested
is created, not necessarily by his action, but by changes in the
Ordinance. If he had built out to his maximum, when he built in
1988, he'd have been able to build a lot larger than this. At that
time, we used a foundation measurement of the building. We didn't
add to it, if there was two story. We treated two story the same
as one story, and he didn't build out to the foundation limit at
that time. The same thing with the permeability issue, or not the
permeability issue, but the actual density of the building. He
could have had a much bigger building. It's been a well run
operation. I think you're going to see very minimum impact. You
also have an approval by the Beautification Committee. So,
aesthetically, they didn't have a problem with it. I don't know if
you have any specific questions I could answer regarding this
issue.
MR. CARVIN-Let me close the public hearing. Is there anyone else
wishing to be heard? If not, then I'll close the public hearing.
PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED
MR. CARVIN-Does the Board have any questions of the applicant?
MR. GREEN-No.
MR. FORD-We're going from two buses, potentially, to four?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes.
MR. FORD-What's the projection, then, for number of people who
could be served? Right now it's about 100. Are we looking at a
couple of hundred, then, could be served simultaneously?
MR. O'CONNOR-] believe you'd be talking 45 people per bus.
MR. HILTON-If I may, I would just like to point out to the Board
members that, presently, with the building area on site, they are
4,369 square feet over the maximum allowed density for the HC-1A
district, that's before this application. If approved, the density
would then be 5,169 square feet over the allowed, in the HC-1A
zoning district.
MS. CIPPERLY-I'd like to ask a question about, if you have four
buses in there, where are they going to park?
MR. O'CONNOR-I would presume they could park in the back parking
area that's very seldom used by motel customers. The motel parking
area was designed for off-road clientele. For the most part, when
they have a good occupancy, it's not off-road clientele. It's
motor coach clientele. One other point, maybe the Board's more
familiar with this than I am. Part of this site was decreased at
the request of the Town some time ago. I think about the same time
the site plan review was done, Mr. Kenny deeded a strip of land
along the northerly boundary of the property to a back land owner,
with the idea that the Town was going to build a road back there
and do something with the traffic. So he, in fact, decreased his
property at the request of the then Town fathers. That never came
to be. I'm not sure exactly why, because I think development of a
30 foot road to a potential subdivision back there that was not
accepted, because they were then going to go through the County
center, and that never materialized.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
Not to interrupt you, but apparently we do not
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
have an agent form on file?
MR. HILTON-We have one right here.
MR . CAR V I N - You h a v eon e the r e ? Ok a y . All rig h t , I ad i e s and
gentlemen, are there any other questions of the applicant.
MRS. LAPHAM-To me, as long as the concern (lost words) low in
density, but it's already on that property, and then we re adding
to it. I'm not sure that there's any alternative. I mean his
business is a major investment.
MR. GREEN-Just doing some quick figuring, he's about eight percent
over maximum density now. With the addition, he's going to go up
to less than another additional percent to just over nine percent.
I don't have a real problem with it.
MR. FORD-Density is obviously the issue, or at least it is for me,
and I'm just concerned that if we approve an increase to nine
percent over the allowable, what is the potential for other owners
in that already heavily impacted area to come in and say, but you
gave this individual nine percent, in addition to what was allowed,
and that's dangerous.
MR. THOMAS-I don't have any problem with the addition. The green
space I'm confused about. Is it 25? Is it 26? Is it 27? And
other thing, since Mr. Kenny owns the parcel south of the Days Inn
Motel, is there a possibility they could do a lot line adjustment
to the south, to get the required square footage for their density
and for their green space?
MR. CAR V IN - 0 k a y , i sit tot h e sou t h , and who 0 w n s the 0 net 0 the
north?
MS. CIPPERLY-Isn't that owned jointly by Mr. Brock and Mr. Kenny?
MR. O'CONNOR-As I understand it, the south is not the same
ownership of the property, the property to the south or to the
north is not the same ownership. They're separate entities, and
not something that Mr. Kenny has control over. I would differ a
little bit with you saying that you're approving nine percent.
You're approving perhaps one percent. It already is the eight
percent, and that was because of a change in Ordinance. It was not
because of the action of the applicant.
MR. FORD-Good point, as long as others don't feel that nine percent
in addition to what is accepted.
MR. o 'CONNOR-I mean, in 1988, and I don't know if there isn't some
potential that maybe some day we're going to go back to 20 percent.
We went back to 20 percent in shopping centers, and we did all of
30 percent throughout the Town, and they changed it back to 20
percent.
MR. CARVIN-George,
impact on parking?
if this is approved, is that going to have any
Are we going to need more parking spaces?
MR. HILTON-Right now their parking with this addition would be
sufficient.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, and is that based on what we're looking at here,
or what's actually out there?
MR. HILTON-It's based on the plan that we have before us.
MR. CARVIN-Here. I'm pretty confident that this plan that we have
here is not what is out there.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. HILTON-The overflow parking was taken into consideration also,
for that, for this request.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
MR. FORD-Can we have Staff confirmation that when we talk about the
permeability issue that apparently is a non issue in this, I just
want to, I want confirmation of that, that in fact that took into
consideration the green space that is currently there, or did it,
was it based upon that as a paved area, anticipated this design, or
what's the status?
MR. HILTON-The existing conditions are such that we have building
area and paved area. Green area is separate. The overflow parking
is not counted as an area of green space, and presently we have a
green area of 25.6% on site.
MR. GREEN-So it's not pavement, it's counted as pavement, as far as
your figures are concerned?
MR. HILTON-As far as our figures are concerned, yes.
MR. O'CONNOR-But that's a paved area that we're going to build on.
MR. CARVIN-I guess that leads to me next question. When we look at
the parking, does it just have to accommodate it, or does it have
to actually be there? He can show here that he can have the
parking, but does that mean that he has to have the parking?
MS. CIPPERLY-That's a prerogative of the Planning Board, really.
As long as you can show that you could provide that, if it became
necessary in the future, you don't have to pave it right now. In
fact, we'd rather not have it paved, if it's not needed.
MR. CARVIN-I agree.
MS. CIPPERLY- I would 1 ike to point out this 800 square foot
addition that went on in 1995 probably should have had a variance,
also, but we didn't catch that, because that also exceeded the
density.
MR. CARVIN-I'm glad you brought that up, because that was going to
be my next question.
MS. CIPPERLY-Well, what happened there was a terrace was put on.
They came in and got the variance for the handicapped ramp, which
had to go on the front, then built a terrace, which didn't even
require site plan review, and then came in and enclosed the
terrace, which did get site plan review, because it became interior
s pac e, but s om e w her e i nth e pro c e s s, rea 11 y a va ria n c e for t hat
other 800 square feet should have probably been sought.
MR. O'CONNOR-Did they get a variance for closeness to the highway,
because nobody raised the issue of density.
MS. CI PPERL Y -They go t a var i ance for the hand i capped ramp, bu t
nothing was ever done for this terrace. It was treated as a site
plan modification. That was just last year. So you're actually
talking 1600 square feet of additional, since the site plan was
first approved.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. So, in other words, the 60,000 square feet that
you're indicating does not include the two additions, if I might?
MR. HILTON-It includes one of the additions.
MR. CARVIN-It includes one of the additions. Well, I don't know.
What do you folks think? What do you want to do here?
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(Queensbury Zon'ng Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. THOMAS-To m , I think we ought to get all the figures straight
here before we ake a decision. What about this 800 square foot
addition that we didn't see, this permeability thing? Density? I
mean, you know, Staff did this today, I guess. It's still not
right.
MR. CARVIN-I think I agree. What's everybody else feel?
I don't know wh t I'm really looking at here.
I mean,
MR. HILTON-Well, we would be happy, if the applicant would provide
us with some ac urate figures on density and parking, that's fine
to us. We could work wi th it and present you wi th an accurate
application. I
MR. THOMAS-Yes'vbecause we need those figures in order to give the
relief for the ariance.
MR. O'CONNOR-I d n't know what the applicant has supplied the Board
or the Staff th t's not accurate. I understand that there was a
process of review for the 800 foot addition last year, and at that
time, the appli ant was told that he could proceed by a site plan
modification, a d that was all that was required. He did, I
presume, get a uilding permit from the Town, and he did get an
occupancy permit from the Town, and he went through the process.
He went through he hoops. Why that is an issue this evening, I'm
not sure. I also bring, and I'm sure the Board's aware that I
think that this has to go to site plan review.
MS. CIPPERLY-Yes, it does.
MR. O'CONNOR-So the Planning Board is also going to look at the
issue of parking, drainage and that type thing, but we can't even
start that proce s, we can't even start that application, until we
find out whethe or not a one percent differential here is that
significant. If you could bring this to a conclusion tonight, I'd
like to try and urge you to do that.
MR. CARVIN-Do you still want more information?
MR. THOMAS-I wa t to know if that 800 square foot from last year
was added into these figures or not.
I
MR. HILTON-I addtd the initial addition, the one shown on the south
side of the builring was added into those figures.
MR. THOMAS-Okay.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, but there
required for that extra?
is a question whether a variance was
mean, is that your question, too?
MR. HILTON-It's y understanding that a variance was required that
somehow was not ought.
I
MR. CARVIN-Okay, I well, again, then that kind of leads me to, do we
have a legal str~cture or do we have an illegal structure?
I
MS. CIPPERLY-Le s put it this way, it went through site plan
review. I don't know what the distance is to the road. I think it
was an oversight on somebody's part. Well, it was sort of, when he
came in for the handicapped ramp, he had to put it on the front
because for some reason he couldn't use this side, and after the
handicapped ramp got built, then the terrace went on, which didn't
require review. I'm not sure that it got a building permit or not.
I haven't looked at that. I don't know whether it meets the 75
feet. '
I
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MR. CARVIN-All r~ght. I think I'd like to refer this back to Staff
until we get somr of these issues cleared up. I really do.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. O'CONNOR-Mr.
addi t ion, which I
that as an excuse,
think you have an
application.
Chairman, if you're talking about the last
was not part of, and I don't necessarily make
but isn't that an enforcement issue? If you
enforcement issue, it's not part of thi s
MR. CARVIN-Well, it has a bearing on this application.
MR. O'CONNOR-You're talking about an 800 square foot addition to a
60,000 square foot building.
MR. CARVIN-Is it 60,000, or is it 59,200?
MR. O'CONNOR-My calculation is at 58,400, and I would say it's a
little less than what Staff has, and I didn't think, whether they
said it was 60 or I said it was 58,400 was that substantial,
initially. This is a building that has been built, managed in
accordance with what they've been advised is proper. They're
trying to get ready, before they get into their sunmler season,
which is sometimes a problem there. You tell us what we've got to
do.
MR. CARVIN-Well, I guess I'd like to see a little bit more accurate
figures here.
MR. O'CONNOR-What is inaccurate?
MR. CARVIN-Well, I don't know. I mean, if we've got permeability
that's already at 30 percent, and we still can come up with parking
in a different concept. I mean, how old is this? I mean I know
it's a site plan thing.
MR. O'CONNOR-We're not changing permeability. This addition is
going where there's paving. You go up there, you look, you will
see blacktop.
MR. CARVIN-Well, I went up and I looked and I saw that this is all
green area, too.
MR. O'CONNOR-Well, where the yellow is, next to the building, where
this is going.
MR. CARVIN-But the point is that this is not a, as far as I'm
concerned, an accurate reflection, and we don't even know if this
is a legal addition. I mean, I realize it's on the other side, and
I'm not saying that I'm opposed to this.
MR. MENTER-Fred, wouldn't it be accurate to say that the
determination was made, I guess, at the time, that there was not a
variance required, therefore, it was built as applied for, and
therefore it's legal?
MR. CARVIN-Well, I'm not sure if that's accurate. I mean, there's
the classic case of New York City. I mean, they keep saying how
they built that extra five stories. It was built, and they made
th~n tear it down.
MR. O'CONNOR-That's overflow parking area, and that's, because you
didn't see paving, you think that the calculations are incorrect.
MR. CARVIN-Well, I don't know.
MR. O'CONNOR-George has checked the calculations and said that he
did not include that in the nonpermeable area, and that's a
representation that we make to you.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
Well, I'll leave it to the Board.
Has anybody
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(Queensbury Zon~ng Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
got thoughts he:e? I mean, what are we going to do with this? Do
you want to move it? If you want to move it, lets move it. If you
want to table i and get more information, we'll table it.
MRS. LAPHAM-All I have is that the area is aLready dense, and I'm
not sure if you 'Ire applicant is adding to the problems, actually,
if he is puttin the addition on area that is already paved, and
the type of bu i nes s that he's engag i ng in is motor coach, as
opposed to indi idual cars. There may actually be less traffic
than a lot of ot er businesses along there. People will walk back
and forth to the other outlets, which is where the congestion comes
from. I
I
MR. CARVIN--Oka~. So your feeling is that this is not an
unreasonable reluest?
MRS. LAPHAM-Yes, I think I could say that.
'-"'
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MR . CAR V I N -A 11 i g h t .
around on this.
Bill?
Again, I don't want to keep going
MR. GREEN-No. have to stick to my first decision here. First,
I don't think we can really make the other side an issue here. It
might be an en orcement issue, but if the other addition was
incLuded in thel square footage, and our figures are apparently
correct, accordiþg to George, I don't have a problem with it, with
the figures as tlhey stand.
MR. FORD-This addition from last year, I think, is an enforcement
issue. Perhaps it should have been an issue before this Board at
an appropriate t me, but it obviously was determined that it wasn't
an issue at that time, and therefore didn't come before us. The
only thing I'nl c ncerned with and continue to be concerned with is
the increase in ensity. I'm trying to balance that with the good
points that have been made about the current use as opposed to the
potential use 0 the property, and trying to lure in additional
coach lines and 0 forth. It continues to be an issue with me, but
I guess I could 0 toward an approval.
MR. THOMAS-Like II said before, I don't have any problem with the
addition. What II do have a problem with is trying to formulate a
motion to find Jut exactly what we're giving relief to or from,
with the figures. So far, you know, I've heard about four
different total square footages. Which one's right? I mean, we
have to give relief. We should give relief on this one, but lets
get the figures ight.
MR. FORD-I agree with Chris on that.
MS. CIPPERLY-Ano her point that we really haven't discussed is the
front setback i sue. I was wondering if maybe, aside from the
symmetry issue, ould this addition be pulled back a little bit and
ma y b e w rap a r 0 u r d the cor n e r, ins tea d 0 f nee din g qui t e s 0 m u c h
relief in the fr nt.
MR. O'CONNOR-Isn't there a proposal under consideration to change
that setback? This is a superimposed setback because of the nature
of the highway t at passes there, and that's why you get into the
request for relief, and isn't there a proposal before the land
study comnlittee 0 change the setbacks in that area to 50 feet?
MS. CIPPERLY-Not to my knowledge, but it could be, but we have to
deal with what wþ have on the books right now.
I
I
MR. O'CONNOR-I think there is. I mean, as far as impact.
MR. CARVIN--Well, I again, I looked at that. I thought I might have
a problem with i't originally until I went out and looked at it,
because there is no really traffic through there, and it appears to
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(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
be blocked up in the front. I really don't see where that's going
to be an issue. It looks like that there's a barrier on this side
here, so that, I mean, the traffic, there is no connection from
here over to the other side I as far as I can remember. So, I
didn't have a problem with that. I looked at that and I thought
that that was adequate. All right. Well, then I think Chris has
got some valid points. I mean, what figure are we giving relief
from or to?
MR. GREEN-Could we possibly get George to just double check these
figures tonight?
MR. CARVIN-I don't know. That puts him under an awful lot of time
constraint here.
MR. HILTON-If I have a plan in front of me that has accurate square
footages and parking counts, from the applicant, that makes my job
that much easier to compute. If there's any question at all, you
think you'd want to see a plan, and I would welcome a plan,
actually, because then we would have a definitive answer,
definitive number. If you feel that you want to see that, maybe
the applicant can provide it to me, I'll be more than happy to
figure it out.
MR. THOMAS-Doesn't the applicant have to provide a plan for the
Planning Board, for site plan?
MR. HILTON-Yes.
MR. THOMAS-Why can't we see the same one?
MR. HILTON-You have the same one.
MR. THOMAS-This is the one that they're going to use for the site
plan for the Planning Board?
MR. O'CONNOR-We think it's accurate, and we're wondering, why can't
you just approve the 800 foot addition as shown on the plan, where
located on the plan, subject to site plan approval.
MR. GREEN-George,
61,021 square feet
you're
now?
confident
with
the
standing,
current
MR. HILTON-Yes, I am.
MR. CARVIN-Well, make a motion.
MOTION TO APPROVE AREA VARIANCE NO. 8-1996 DAVID KENNY THE
MEETING PLACE REST., Introduced by William Green who moved for its
adoption, seconded by Bonnie Lapham:
Applicant seeks to add a 720 square foot addition to the northerly
side of an existing restaurant. The addition requires relief from
density requirements of Section 179-23A, also Section 179-28C,
Street Setback Section. The property currently has a total square
footage of 61,012 square feet. The additional 720 square feet
would bring that up to 61,732 square feet. The benefit to the
applicant would be that it would allow him a greater restaurant
business, due to the increased seating capacity of the additional
restaurant space. There does not seem to be any feasible
alternatives which could provide a lesser amount of relief from the
Ordinance. The relief may seem substantial, since the existing
building is already over the allowed maximum square footage, but
this small increase of 720 feet on a 61,000 square foot building
constitutes approximately
one percent increase over what is there now. The front setback
would be 55 feet, 20 feet off the 75 foot requirement. It does not
appear that there would be any negative affect on the neighborhood
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
and community. The difficulty is not self-created, due to the fact
of the change in the Zoning Ordinance in 1988. It's a Type II
Action, needing no further review.
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
MR. FORD-I just have one additional question that's come to mind.
MR. CAR V IN--Okay .
MR. FORD-They appear symmetrical, but have different measurements.
Could you address that? We're asking for approval of the 800
square feet, but on the map it refers to enclosing 720 square feet.
MR. O'CONNOR-My notes in the conversation was 720 square feet, 270
square feet of ki tchen and 450 feet for seating. I don't
understand, myself, the 800 feet, okay, but that's the way that
everything has been framed. Part of this, I think, was that he
came in thinking that he was going to complete a site plan
modification, and like the environmental thing, people kept adding
things that he should be requesting relief from. My understanding,
my stipulation would be, and maybe this is the simplest way to do
it. We are requesting to build, as shown, per scale, on the map
that's submitted. I will verify, for the Board, exactly what that
is.
MR. FORD-So go by the map, as opposed to the application?
MR. O'CONNOR-The map is part of the application. The map more
clearly shows exactly what is permitted, that is symmetrical to the
building.
MR. FORD-But it appears synunetrical, but one side is 800. The
other is 720.
MR. O'CONNOR-One side wraps around the corner of the building. Is
that what you're speaking of? The south side wraps around the
corner of the front.
MR. GREEN-The south side's a little bit longer. There's a jut off
the bottom.
MR. FORD-So are we being asked to approve 800 square feet, or 720
square feet?
MR. O'CONNOR-720 square feet.
It's enclosed 720 square feet.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
Bill, do you want to amend your motion?
MR. GREEN-Yes. I would amend that to 720 square foot addition,
bringing the total up to 61,782 square feet.
MR. FORD-I'd like to have Staff react to that, in as much as your
calculations were based on 800 square feet.
MR. HILTON-The applicant provided Staff with a sheet that indicates
that he's increasing the total square footage by 800 square feet.
I have it right here.
MR. MENTER-Maybe that came as a result of just wanting to match the
other side. Maybe he thought 800 square feet was what it was, but
when the architect actually did this, or whoever drew this up, that
side of the building is shorter.
MR. O'CONNOR-It's my understanding that the request is not stated
as 720 square feet. It should, by stipulation, be understood to be
720 square feet, and nothing further would be built.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MRS. LAPHAM-Maybe you could amend the motion to "not more than 800
square feet".
MR. O'CONNOR-I would stick with 720. I have no problem with that,
because I can see the Board is concerned.
MR. GREEN-I would amend that to 720 square feet, with a total, I
don't know if my figure was correct before or not, 61,732 square
feet.
AYES: Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Green, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas, Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSTAINED: Mr. Menter
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
MR. O'CONNOR-I thank you for your patience.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
USE VARIANCE NO. 12-1996 TYPE: UNLISTED SR-IA LC-IOA
WASHINGTON COUNTY SPCA, INC. OWNER: JOHN H. SULLIVAN COUNTY LINE
ROAD, APPROX. 3 MILES NORTH OF DIX AVE. ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE.
APPLICANT SEEKS A USE VARIANCE TO ALLOW AN ANIMAL SHELTER ON
SUBJECT PROPERTY. THIS REQUEST REQUIRES RELIEF FROM THE USES
ALLOWED IN SECTION 179-19D. WARREN COUNTY PLANNING 3/13/96 TAX
MAP NO. 109-4-2.1 LOT SIZE: 26.62 ACRES SECTION 179-190
RICHARD JONES, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT
JEAN GRANT, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT
STAFF INPUT
Notes from Staff, Use Variance No. 12-1996, Washington County SPCA,
Inc., Meeting Date: March 20, 1996 "PROJECT LOCATION: County
Line Rd., approx. 3 miles north of Dix Ave. on left hand side
PROJECT DESCRI PT ION AND CONFORMANCE WITH THE ORD I NANCE: Ap p Ii can t
proposes to construct an animal shelter on the subject property.
The property is currently zoned SR-IA and LC-I0A. Animal shelters
are not listed as permitted uses in either district. USE VARIANCE
REVIEW CRITERIA, BASED ON SECTION 167-b OF TOWN LAW: 1. IS A
REASONABLE RETURN POSSIBLE IF THE LAND IS USED AS ZONED? This lot
is located near the Warren County Airport and directly south of
land zoned LI-IA. The FAA has restrictions on this property which
limit the height of any buildings on this lot. Existing conditions
are such that even wi th no development on the property, a large
amount of the lot already conflicts with the FAA restrictions. The
only portion of the lot which appears to have no restrictions is
the area which is proposed to be used as an animal shelter. This
area is directly adjacent to land zoned LI-IA and would be a
difficult location for single family development. 2. IS TliE
ALLEGED HARDSHIP RELATING TO THIS PROPERTY UNIQUE, OR DOES IT ALSO
APPLY TO A SUBSTANTIAL PORTION OF THE DISTRICT OR NEIGHBORHOOD?
The hardship is unique to this property due to the fact that FAA
restrictions effecting this particular piece of property are not in
place on other properties to the south and east. 3. IS THERE AN
ADVERSE EFFECT ON THE ESSENTIAL CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD? It
appears that this proposal could be objectionable to the property
owners to the east of the subject parcel, however no comment has
been r ece i ved to date. The I and to the nor th is zoned Li gh t
Industrial (LI-IA). 4. IS THIS THE MINIMUM RELIEF NECESSARY TO
ADDRESS THE UNNECESSARY HARDSHIP PROVEN BY THE APPLICANT AND AT THE
SAME TIME PROTECT THE CHARACTER OF THE NE I GHBORHooD AND THE HEALTH,
SAFETY, AND WELFARE OF THE COMMUNITY? It appears to be. SEQR:
Unlisted, short form EAF review needed."
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. THOMAS-nAt a meeting of the Warren County Planning Board, held
on the 13th day of March 1996, the above application for a Use
Va ria nee for the con s t rue t ion 0 fan ani ma 1 she 1 tel' to h 0 use
approximately 80 stray, unwanted animals on a daily basis was
reviewed, and the following action was taken. Recommendation to:
Approve Comments: The WCPB concurs with the local conditions."
Signed C. Powel South, Chairperson.
MR. CARVIN-Are there any questions of the applicant?
MR. FORD-I have some, but I'll give them a chance to answer them
before 1 ask them.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
applicant?
Does anybody e 1 s e have any ques t ions 0 f the
MR. MENTER-Not at the moment.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. I guess I'll open it up to the applicant. Is
there anything that you'd care to add to your application?
MR. JONES-My name is Richard Jones. I'm the architect working with
the SPCA, and we've been working on this project with them for
about a year and a half, and we finally found a parcel of property
that would sui t the faci 1 i ty for the SPCA. In looking at the
parcel, if I might, the parcel itself, what we've tried to
delineate on the map for you, these are the transitional surface
lines that the FAA has actually put on the property itself. There
are additional transitional lines coming this way on the property,
which we have no shown. This is Queensbury Avenue, County Line
Road, heading north. This is approximately north on the property.
The Light Industrial zone is in this general area. There is an
easement, right now, for clear cutting, which has been exercised,
and it bisects the property in this direction. The Queensbury
water tower sits over in this general area. The Animal Hospital is
down in this general area. There is a single family residence in
this little inset, which is about 1,000 feet from our property, or
our location on this property. There are several single family
residences on this side of the street as well. We have identified
a spot elevation from the partial map that we have gotten from
Warren County. There is a spot elevation in the road of
approximately 368 feet in this general area. This transitional
line running right here is at 430, and the way these work, the
center line of the runway is back in this general area, and as you
come off of the runway, these step up approximately 10 feet in
height as you're going across the property. In this general area,
we could not construct anything which exceeded the 430 foot
elevation. The property elevation in this general area is around
400 feet. This is actually the only part of the property that does
not have a height restriction by the FAA. Once we hit this line,
which is about the back corner of where we're proposing to place
the building, the transitional lines step down and actually, in
looking at the map that you have there from Warren County, there
are elevations which give you the top of tree elevations, and they
are actually exceeding that height elevation for the transitional
surfaces. By placing the building in this general area, we feel we
have sufficient buffer to the residential zone to the south. We
are setting approximately 100 feet off the road. So that we're
àctually maintaining as much of the tree line as possible on the
property. Itis very heavily treed on this end. We're providing
a 50 foot buffer to the Light Industrial zone, and we feel that
this is actually an adequate or very good transition from that
Light Industrial to a residential area. That's basically what
we're looking at. This gives you an idea of how the building would
be located on the property. We're looking at parking for
approximately 33 vehicles, based upon the zoning requirements for
that parcel, and in working with the SPCA, we've actually come up
with a schematic fLoor plan, at this time, and this, basically, is
- 15
(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
what we're looking at. It's a facility of about, I believe, 5800
square feet, which is on the application. It consists of a series
of small exam rooms, meeting rooms, offices. We have a general
reception area. We're looking at the kennel area, which would be
on the northwest corner of the building, furthest away from the
residential areas. The building itself would be residential in
character. We're looking at something that has the scale of the
residential neighborhood. We've put together a conceptual
elevation on that as well. We're looking to try and utilize gabled
roofs on the bui lding. We want it to be something that's,
basically, maintenance free for the facility, so that they do not
have to spend a lot of money on maintenance, because they have a
bare bones budget in that regard, but it would carry through the
gab 1 e roo f con c e p t s 0 f the res ide n t i a 1 f am i 1 i e sin the g en era 1
area. It would be an energy efficient structure. It has sealed
heating and cooling throughout the building. We're not looking to
use windows for ventilation. The facility itself would have
certain filtration systems, with certain types of filtration, to
minimize the potential for germs and that type of thing entering
the building. So there would not be any reason for noise filtering
out through open windows, that type of thing. It's basically a
sealed building. As the application had indicated, any exercising
of animals on the property would be supervised. They would not be
left alone to run loose on the property. I'd be happy to answer
any of your questions at this point.
MR. CARVIN-Does anyone have any questions?
MR. FORD-What is your heating/cooling source?
MR . JON E S - We' rei nit i a 11 y pro b a b 1 y 1 00 kin gat LPg as for the
heating, because the gas line, I believe, is a quarter of a mile,
half a mile from the site.
MR. FORD-Will there be any fenced in area?
MR. JONES-Yes. There is a small fenced in area. If you look at
the site plan that was provided to you as part of the application,
in the upper right corner of the building, there's a little fenced
walk area, which sits behind, there's a two car garage in that end
of the building for the services to come in. This would be for the
50 foot buffer zone to the right hand side.
MR. FORD-Would that area be used exclusively for walking purposes
with a human in attendance, or would that be used for turning
animals loose on their own?
MRS. GRANT-That area would be for a volunteer or a caretaker to
take a dog out, and exercise a dog, be with a dog, that would be
fenced in. They could run a little bit. There would be somebody
with the animal. The rest of the 26 acres, there are trails for
people to walk the dogs. We want to have the dogs inside. It's
temperature controlled and noise controlled as well. They won't be
barking, disturbing neighbors, and also they won't have to deal
with cold weather and hot weather and so on. So the animals would
be inside, except for an area that they're going to be used, to
take their dogs out in the fenced in area. Someone would be with
the animals at all times.
MR. CARVIN-We're going to need your name for the record.
MRS. GRANT-I'm sorry.
County SPCA.
Jean Grant, Treasurer for the Washington
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
MR. FORD-And at no time, then, would animals be in that fenced in
area alone?
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MRS. GRANT-No.
MR. FORD-Eight or ten dogs milling around, something like that?
MRS. GRANT--No.
That would not be allowed.
MRS. LAPHA~-You're not going to have any of the traditional kennel
runs, like one dog to a run, and so many feet outside?
MRS. GRANT-No.
MR. JONES-The plan that we've developed actually has a kennel run
in it, and it's internal space. We actually have 20, there's 10 in
each row, 20 kennel runs in this general area. This is an
enclosed, temperature controlled space. It does not have operable
windows, that type of thing. So these are kennels, or runs that
are a p pro xi ma tel y 1 4 fee t, 1 5 fee t Ion g . Sot hey' ref air I y goo d
size, basically one animal per run. So they would all be indoor.
MR. CARVIN-Any other questions?
MR. FORD-Will there be any means for disposal of animals on the
property?
MRS. GRANT-No. Any animals to be euthanized would be done by a
local veterinarian, at the animal hospital. We don't do that now.
We have no intention of doing it in the future.
MR. FORD-Okay. Noise within the neighborhood is one issue, but
noise of the neighborhood is another. In other words, has due
consideration been given to the potential for aircraft and their
impact and that noise on the animals in your shelter? In other
words, if we've got jets cooling into Warren County Airport, as we
do, and jets taking off, that can cause animals a great deal of
disruption.
MRS. GRANT-We've discussed that. I don't have any concerns. The
building is very well insulated, and they're going to hear, my dog
would hear a jet going over our home on Ridge Road. My dogs don't
get upset by that either. I don't think there would be a probl~n.
I don't think it's going to be any problem at all.
MR. FORD-But 80 animals there, and the frequency with which they
fly in and out of there, that could pose a problem. In addition to
that, I mean, I know that there are practice flights in and out.
They practice their landings and take offs, so there are days, and
into the evening, when there are a large number of flights, and I'm
concerned about the difficulty that might pose for those animals.
MRS. GRANT-[ don't think they're going to hear it that much.
don't think it's going to be a problem. I understand where you're
coming from, but we have the trains go by the shelter where we are
now, the railroad is not that far away, and it doesn't cause a
problem, and planes flying over, and it's not a problem.
MR. CARVIN-Your kennel area, is that going to be extra insulated or
soundproofed of any type?
MR. JONES-Yes. It actually entails an extensive insulation system
in the entire building, plus we also have continuous mechanical
ventilation. So it's almost like a small medical type center,
w her e you' ve got con tin u 0 usa i r vol um e run n i n g 0 n a con tin u 0 u s
basis. It is running 24 hours a day, whether it's heating or
cooling, because we're continually exchanging the air within the
facility.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. CARVIN-All right.
hours a day, or is
operation?
Is this going to be manned by somebody 24
there going to just be certain hours of
MRS. GRANT-We anticipate having the shelter open to the public
probably between the hours of maybe 10 and 4. There would be paid
caretakers there beginning at 7 a.m., last person probably around
7 at night taking care of the animals at that time.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. So for a period from seven to seven, about 12
hours, they would be unattended would they?
MRS. GRANT-Yes. Well, from seven in the morning to seven at night,
there would be somebody there. From seven at night to seven in the
morning.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. So, okay, and that's currently what you do now, is
it?
MRS. GRANT-Right now, we have staff working until three, and then
we h a v e a p pro x i ma tel y t h r e e vol un tee r s t hat t a k e t urn s go i n gin
eve n i n g s tot a k e car e 0 f the ani ma Is. We' d 1 i k e toe x ten d the
caretakers hours and then eliminate the need for volunteers going
down at night.
MR. FORD-How many would this be able to house, as compared to your
present facility?
MRS. GRANT-Basically the same number, maybe a few more.
we have 80 animals, and the building was built for 35.
a daily basis.
Right now,
This is on
MR. FORD-And this building is built for?
MRS. GRANT-Approximately the same number, about 80. The new
proposed building will hold between 80 animals, 85 animals.
MR. FORD-Okay. If we used the same logic, if you have 80 animals
in a building designed for 35 currently, might we look at the
possibility of 175 animals in your projected building?
MRS. GRANT-No. It's enough to take care of 80 animals a day, and
we cannot, we may go between 80 and 90. If you have a litter of
kittens, that's 10 kittens in a cage that a large cat could fit
into. We cannot take care of that many animals. We have to have
restrictions. We could take an animal every day. There simply
isn't enough room for all of them, and we can't take care of them
all. We have to turn people away. There just isn't enough room,
and we can't have enough room for all of them.
MR. FORD-But do you see where I'm coming from?
MRS. GRANT-I know where you're coming from.
MR. FORD-You've got 80 that you're housing now with the potential
for 35.
MRS. GRANT- I under stand that.
can't take care of them all.
There would be limi tat ions.
We
MR. CARVIN-Well, that leads me to one
Does Warren County, in their motion,
80. In other words, a use variance
animal shelter to house approximately
a daily basis. Is that a limiting?
of the questions that I had.
limit them to approximately
for the construction of an
80 stray unwanted animals on
MS. CIPPERLY-I think they were reacting to what was proposed.
That's the description that the applicant gave, so they're sort of
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
self-limiting, I guess.
your prerogative.
If you want to limit that also, that's
MR. MENTER-I don't know if they have the teeth to do that, do they,
if they wanted to?
MS. CIPPERLY-Warren County?
MR. MENTER-Yes.
MS. CIPPERLY-As I said, I think the resolution was just a
reflection of the project description.
MR. MENTER-Yes.
MS. CIPPERLY-If it's a use variance and you want to limit the scope
of it to a certain level of activity, I think the Zoning Board has
that right. I also, listening to Tom talking about all the
airplane:;; going over, I was thinking, that is really a very good
argument for why it's not usable as a residential piece. know
that wasn't your point at the time.
MR. FORD-No, it wasn't. They fly over my house all the time, but
I might object less to that than would to 80 animals next door.
MR. MENTER-I have a question. You mentioned
property. Describe that for me. What were your
long did you, where were you looking?
searching
criteria?
for
How
MRS. GRANT-All right. For the past two years, our commi ttee' s been
looking for property, and we started in Washington County. We
wanted to be in the Town of Kingsbury, because it's more centrally
located to the areas served. Even though it's called Washington
County SPCA, we take in animals, animals are adopted out to the
Tri-County area and beyond, and we receive donations from beyond
Washington County, and service the whole area. We have
investigated at least, this is the 16th area we looked at. There
have been sites on Vaughn Road in Kingsbury, Lake Road in
Kingsbury. We even approached the IDA to purchase land from the
IDA, but because we're not a Light Industrial, we weren't able to
purchase from them. Different land owners thought maybe they would
either donate or sell us land, but they changed their minds they
didn't want to develop their parcel of land Dix Avenue for the
site. We really need to be where there is water, because the
shelter is sprinklered, and want to have access, or future access,
to natural gas lines, because of the lower cost for utilities on so
on. Nobody ever turned us down because there was going to be an
animal shelter. They just didn't want to develop their land at
that time. That was basically the issue. I could give you a list
of names of people we spoke to, and they have land on Dix Avenue,
and at one time they said yes, we'd like to develop it, lets talk,
and then they said, 1 guess we don't want to get a financial
investment going, and they changed their mind. (Lost words) the
land and increase, the other side increase, but it was just so
expensive, up to $40,000 an acre. So, we have looked very, very
hard. We've spoken to people personally and written letters.
We've had phone calls, spent a great deal of time at the Kingsbury
Town offices finding out what land is available, and grant it,
there's a lot of land in Washington County, but for us to build a
shelter in the middle of Argyle or Cambridge or whatever, it would
not be practical for us to do that. We're serving a larger area,
and many of our animals are coming in from Queensbury and Warren
County and going out to Queensbury and Warren County. So we're
serving that area as well, and we do work with Warren County SPCA.
MR. MENTER--So, in all this, you haven't gotten to any approval
stage with anything, or anything beyond just talking1
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MRS. GRANT-No.
MR. MENTER-You've just been looking, trying to find something.
MRS. GRANT-We've been talking, but we nobody plans to go through
with anything yet.
MR. MENTER-Okay.
MR. CAR V I N - 0 k a y . How ma n y 0 the r f a c i lit i e s I i k e t his, I k now we
approved something for the, what was it, the Kennel Club was it,
just recently.
MR. THOMAS-The Glens Falls Kennel Club.
MRS. LAPHAM-The GI ens Fall s Kenne 1 Club.
different type of facility.
That was a completely
MRS. GRANT-There isn't anything in that area that would meet this
design. In Scotia, there's a $1.3 shelter, and we've visited them
quite a bit to get some ideas for our design of our building, to
make a state of the art building. There's nothing in our area,
even toward Plattsburg, that would even resemble this, or serve the
public like this. There is a Warren County SPCA. They house their
ani ma I sat the G I ens Fall s An i ma 1 H 0 s pit a I, but the rei s no t a
facility for the Warren County SPCA.
MRS. LAPHAM-I have a couple of questions, the first one being, what
type system have you planned for waste disposal, and the second
question is, are you confining yourself to dogs and cats, or will
you take horses, or any other animals besides dogs and cats,
because there's animal abuse and neglect of all species.
MRS. GRANT-I'll answer the second question. There would be dogs,
cats, kittens, puppies, and that would be it, no large animals.
MRS. LAPHAM-And you'll be encouraging spay/neuter policies?
MRS. GRANT-We do already. All of our animals, if they're six
months of age or older, are already spay or neutered before they've
been she 1 tered, and people have to pay us an adoption fee that
includes spay or neutering, to a local veterinarian. They have to
be spay or neutered, and they also have their shots. They have
rabies shots, tests and so on.
MR. JONES-As far as the waste disposal, what we're looking at in
the kennel area itself is, basically almost the entire facility has
floors that are readily easy to clean. They would almost be like
a small medical type facility, so that you could wash them down
with disinfectants, that type of thing. We have a trench drain
system that we're looking at in the kennel area that is similar to
the facility that we looked at down in Schenectady, and it's a
pressure type system where it is washed into a gutter and then
forced into a septic type system. We would be settling out the
solids and disposing of those in a normal solid disposal type
facility for waste. As far as any solid waste on site, we are
looking at an on site dumpster for papers, that type of thing,
which would be on the garage end of the facility, be totally
screened, with a fence enclosure. As far as on site septic for the
facility itself, we would have a small on site septic field which
would conform to Town of Queensbury standards for septic disposal
on site.
MS. CIPPERLY-Another point here, this really is a split zone
parcel. The rear portion is LC-I0, where a dog kennel would be an
allowed use. The front part is Suburban Residential, where kennels
aren't an allowed use. So part of the problem here is the split
zoning on the parcel. So if somebody could, if they were able,
absent the FAA regulations, they could put the kennel or the
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
facility on the back part of the land. They wouldn't be here. So
it's kind of a physical constraint.
MR. CARVIN-Anyone else? Then I'll open up the public hearing.
PUBLIC HEARING OPENED
SUSAN BAYER
MRS. BAYER-I'm Susan Bayer, and I live at 224 Queensbury Avenue.
I guess one concern I have, aside from the building, and that would
be the animals, dropping off animals in the middle of the night,
when no one can see them, and just wondered. That would be a big
concern for me.
MRS. GRANT-Animals being dropped off?
MRS. BAYER-At night when there are no people there to accommodate
them, particularly in the cold weather.
MRS. GRANT-Animals are not dropped off as much as they used to now.
I can't guarantee that they won't be dropped off, nobody can. No
building in our area has 24 hour staffing. There's nothing you can
do about it, other than educate the people not to do that. I can't
guarantee they won't.
MRS. BAYER-I just, I would like to voice that concern directly. I
think have two concerns, and the other one is to the animals, and
that would be, what the gentleman here mentioned, the loud'noise
from the airplanes. When a volunteer or someone planning to adopt
an animal takes it for a walk, and the animal bolts. I think that
would be a concern.
MRS. GRANT-They'd be on a leash. I live on Ridge Road, and we hear
them taking off all the time, over Ridge Road, and our animals have
never shown any concern, and I realize it's much close. I
understand that.
MRS. BAYER-We've observed when people bring their dogs to the
Balloon Festival, and the noise from the propane of the balloons
has just made animals go berserk, and they stand there just going
nuts on that leash.
MRS. GRANT-The facility IS Schenectady is right next to (lost
words) it's very close, and it's a legitimate concern and question,
and we would never do anything to jeopardize the welfare of the
animals, obviously.
MRS. BAYER-Aside from the obvious objections from the folks who
live right near it, I can understand their concern (lost words),
this all seems to be satisfactory.
MRS. GRANT-Wherever you build a shelter, no matter where it is,
there's always going to be concerns of somebody abandoning animals,
and they abandon them anywhere and everywhere. So I don't, as a
matter of fact, at least there are people nearby, instead of out in
the middle of nowhere. It will be well lit, with the outside
lighting, that could deter people from wanting to abandon animals.
Again, if they're going to abandon them, they're going to abandon
them anywhere.
MRS. BAYER-I would prefer to have them do the right thing by an
animal and bring them to a place like this where they could get
good care. I just worry that on a January night when it's 27
degrees below zero, that there's no one there at that hour of the
night.
MRS. GRANT-But there wouldn't be anywhere.
I'm just saying, this
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(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
is something we have no control over. No matter where the
shelter's built, and all we can do is try to educate the public.
There's just nothing you can do about it. We have had very few
animals abandoned during the past year or two. I don't know why.
I'm just grateful there hasn't been.
MRS. BAYER-I'm just concerned that if someone were to drop an
animal on that street, and it were to get loose, causing a problem
for traffic.
MRS. GRANT-It's no different than where we are now.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Anyone else wishing to be heard either in support
or in opposition?
COLLEEN KIMBLE
MS. KIMBLE-Hello. My name is Colleen Kimble. I am the Queensbury
Animal Control Officer. I have a, kind of a personal and
professional interest in the Washington County SPCA. I'd like to
encourage the Board to consider approving this application for the
Washington County SPCA. It's an organization that's sorely needed
within the communities in Warren County and Washington County. The
facility they have now is very small, and they do have 80 animals
or they can squeeze them in, and the facility that they're trying
to bui Id would house them more comfortably, heal thier, and be
easier for the workers. It would be a better facility. I just
think that the benefits outweigh any potential problems. The only
problem that seems to be coming up is noise, and the dogs are going
to be on an inside run, and insulated. I don't think that the dogs
barking would be a problem, as far as any aircraft going over.
There's going to be noise in the kennel anyway from the dogs
barking and cats meowing, that they may be distracted from any
outside noises, and like I said, I just wanted to urge you, prompt
you, to please consider approving this application.
STAN RYMKEWICZ
MR. RYMKEWICZ-My name is Stan Rymkewicz. I own property directly
across where this wants to be. I have a signed petition with six
people's names, so far, that are against it. I was not notified by
mail. I don't know how many of my neighbors were. It's exactly
1 .2 mi 1 es, not 3 mi 1 es. Everybody though tit was nor th of the
airport. It's not. It's Queensbury Avenue, not County Line Road.
County Line Road starts at Dix and goes north. My family owns four
houses on this road, plus we own a farm with 180 acres. We pay our
taxes. On 180 acres, we paid $12,000 last year, unused. That's
$1,000 a month. The Washington County SrCA, I was told, has a
value of about $50,000, 2.80 acres, and they absolutely pay no
taxes. I was told the building was going to be different from
this. I was notified by the lady that just spoke that it was going
to be a flat roof. It was going to be cement block. If you know
where I live, the next place from me is all cement. It's a cement
dump. We've been to the Town Board with this guy before. Nothing
seems to be done. A picture's worth a thousand words. There's
what happens to cement. This guy gets free cement, keeps adding
and adding and adding. That's to my north. This is where I live.
This is a cement dump. He also has a blacktop dump down below, but
that's in the other County. That's a cement dump, both sides of
that building is cement. There's cement allover the place. I
have to look at that to my north. It's zoned differently. Can't
do anything about it, apparently. I have a raised ranch house.
I'm going to be looking right down into this property, which is
cement block. You got stuck next door, where my sister lives,
Number 284, is going to be directly across from this also. We got
stuck with a water tower, the Town of Queensbury. My mother lives
a half mile down the road, bought her house, Niagara Mohawk put an
electrical station there. Just had it re-appraised, we lost
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
$20,000 on that house. We used to own part of the airport. That
was taken away from us. I think my family has had enough. Leave
us alone. This is not in the area with the rest of the houses. I
don't want to look at it. There's this, this is residential,
that's mine. This is my sister. This is next door, go right down
the liIH~. As far as the 33 cars. Last April I was ill. I was
home for a couple of days. I counted from quarter of eight to
quarter after eight in the morning, one car everyone and a half
minutes, going either way. They want to have a parking lot of 33
cars across the street. I don't want to look into that ei ther.
Septic tanks. That means there's going to be a sewer truck in and
out. Have you ever smelled a sewer truck after it left the
premises, for about an hour later? Talking about dropping off
animals. Monday night I came home at six o'clock, a cat ran from
my back porch. Somebody dropped off a cat at night. Maybe you
heard publicity of this on the radio. It's been on, I guess, all
day today. We also have a vet. Dogs, cats, and kittens are
dropped off at night. Maybe not so much in Fort Edward because the
people have a long way to go. Now they can do it a mile off Dix
Avenue. In fact, they can take a bus. We have buses going by the
house now. You have tractor trailers going by the house. We have
cranes going by the house. A cousin of mine visited the place in
Fort Edward, there's a dumpster right out front by the road, and
it's not enclosed, and if you're familiar with volunteer workers,
I do auctions, volunteers, well, they can and they can't. Nobody
brought up the idea about a sign. What about a sign? Do I have to
look at a sign in a residential area? There's a sign in the
picture. A cousin of mine visited this place. It was packed. He
said it stunk so bad inside, he had to hold her breath and left
without getting anything. You can't tell me that all the trees in
the back, all that wouldn't come across the airport, and we're not
going to get the smells. Somebody has to go in and out of that
building. I took that picture the other day, and I could hear dogs
barking from the front door. They had a storm door and two windows
were open. I'm sure the help is not going to be without air. I
was told the area was not kept up. There was dirt allover the
place, dog runs, and you could see the dumpsters were half on the
road. There's another truck that's going to be in and out of
there. When it gets 90 degrees this sunm1er, am I going to have to
smell that stuff that's in that dumpster? I think so. The other
neighbors have complained about the traffic also. They can't even
send their kids to the mailbox because of the traffic, and like I
say, it sounds like it's going to be even worse, and that's our
main objection is traffic, and I don't believe it belongs in a
residential area. There's another picture of a place there on
Maple Street that's for sale, for the last five years. I asked the
neighbors about that. I said, how about these guys moving down
here by the transfer station? They said, don't even tell them
about it. Washington County doesn't want it. So, as I said, I
have a six person petition. If other people want to sign, I'll
give it to you at the end of the meeting. We object. I object
because of the cement blocks. 1 don't want to look at a long
cement block building. I've got cement to my north, as I said.
There is going to be smells. There's going to be sewer smell, and
as far as the airport, if you've ever heard a jet take off from
that airport, and there's a dog coming in or leaving that building,
it's going to be right out in my yard. Thank you.
MR. CARVIN-Anyone else wishing to be heard either in support or in
opposition?
CHARLIE NASSIVERA
MR. NASSIVERA-Charlie Nassivera, County Line Road, Queensbury
Avenue, whatever. I '01 not close enough to experience any of the
problems which Mr. Rymkewicz has, but I think the County Line Road,
Queensbury Avenue, whatever, needs a rest. We have a water tower.
We have a Niagara Mohawk substation, and we have a noisy airport,
-- 23 -
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
but that's been there forever, and we have tractor trai lers,
whatever, going up and down. I don't really think we need anything
else. I'm not against the shelter. I just don't think the road
can stand much more, and it doesn't bother me, personally, because
I'm too far away. I'm probably three quarters of a mile away, but
the road is busy. So cons ider it. Thank you.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Anyone else?
MS. KIMBLE-I bring this to the attention of the Board. Apparently,
this is the type of textured, cement block building, moss colored,
that they're planning on having for the SPCA, and I would like to
just address a few things Mr. Rymkewicz said.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, before we get the rebuttal, lets get all the
current comments In, if you don't mind. You'll have plenty of
opportunity, but lets get it all out on the table first.
MS. KIMBLE-I'm sorry. Certainly.
MR. THOMAS-Ready?
MR. CARVIN-Yes.
MR. THOMAS-A letter dated February 28, 1996, from the Washington
County SPCA. "Dear Member of the Zoning Board of Appeals, As a
private, non-profit organization, the Washington County S.P.C.A.
provides shelter to stray and unwanted animals from the tri-county
area and beyond. In addition, the S.P.C.A. 's by-laws include the
need to protect animals wi thin Washington County. Al though its
present shelter is in Fort Edward, the by-laws do not specify the
location for a shelter in which to house such animals. Since
January of 1994, the Washington County S.P.C.A. has investigated at
least 16 locations on which to build its new facility. The goal
has been to build in Kingsbury, which would be a more central
location between Washington and Warren counties. (Over 40% of the
S.P.C.A's donors, admissions, and adoptions come from Warren
County.) Despite repeated efforts to seek three to five acres of
land either through donations or direct payment, the S.P.C.A. has
been unable to obtain a site for construction. Washington County
Board of Supervisors offered three acres near its transfer station
in Kingsbury, but the land was not suitable for construction.
Other sites were priced from $25,000 to $40,000 an acre. When the
S.P.C.A. attempted to purchase land from the Warren-Washington
County I .D.A., it was turned down since it was not a light
industry. The S.P.C.A. 's new facility will require municipal water
for its sprinkler system, as well as access to natural gas. The
site on Queensbury Avenue (County Line Road) in Queensbury would
provide a rural setting with space between the shelter, neighboring
homes and businesses, as well as allow easy access for people in
Washington and Warren Counties and beyond. This location is also
accessible for area students to benefit from the shelter's humane
education program. In regards to its title, the Washington County
S.P.C.A. plans to change its name to one that does not specify a
given location. Many people assume the S.P.C.A. receives funding
from Washington County due to its name. Since this is not the
case, it has been decided that a different name should be chosen
after the new shelter is completed. The Washington County S.P.C.A.
is seeking the approval of the Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
to create a variance that will allow the construction of a new
ani ma 1 she 1 t e r 0 n Que ens bur y A v en u e . The S. P . C . A. 's 0 f f ice r s ,
board of directors and members thank you for your consideration on
this matter. Sincerely, Jean S. Grant Washington County S.P.C.A."
MR. CARVIN-Okay. No other correspondence?
MR. THOMAS-That's the only one I've got.
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(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. CARVIN-Okay. This gentleman over here, you said you had a
petition. Do you want to enter that at this point, so we can read
the names into the record, please. Okay. Is there anyone else
wishing to be heard, either in support or in opposition?
HELEN SKELLIE
MRS. SKELLIE--I'm Helen Skellie, and I live in that little one
residential they just pointed out. Number One, my husband feels
there isn't any natural gas on the road at all. He wonders where
they're getting this from. Number Two, you can't tell me that on
a hot summer night that we're not going to hear 80 animals and
they're not going to have at least one window open. I can't
believe this, and Number Three, they told us it was three miles up
the road on County Line Road. It's Queensbury Avenue, and it isn't
even three miles up the road that they're going to do this, and
it's right next to us, and I just don't think it's fair.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
Thank you. Anyone else?
MS. KIMBLE-I have some additional conm1ents I'd like to make, if you
please. As far as traffic on the road, I don't believe that the
S.P.C.A. would really be creating that much additional traffic.
The traffic is already there, and as far as, he had mentioned the
condition of the old building, or the present building that the
S.P.C.A. is currently at. That's the reason they're trying to
build a better building. What they have is small, and they have a
lot of animals there. The volunteers are there often to do the
best they can to clean up and care for the animals. The officers
for the S.P.C.A. are there getting their hands dirty, bending over
backwards to take care of them. They're not neglecting the animals
at all. They do what they can to maintain a healthy environment
for the animals. The new building would provide a heal thier
environment for the same number of animals. They don't want to
increase the number they've got. They're doing what they can to
take care of what's already there, and I really feel that the dogs
wouldn't be 80 dogs. It's 80 animals. Most of them are adult cats
and kittens, and some puppies. I think currently they have maybe
16 dogs, which is not 80 dogs barking. Again, it's going to be
inside an insulated' run. I agree if they say someone is going to
go outside to the fenced in area to get acquainted with the dog
they've got to keep it on a leash, even on a fenced in area, and
one thing I want to say, kind of in conclusion, rather than keep
repeating myself, the people who work for and volunteer for the
Washington County S.P.C.A. really do care for the animals. They're
doing the best they can and are trying to do better for the animals
that they are accepting from three different counties, to place
them in decent homes. They're not trying to be a scourge on the
neighborhood. They're trying to comply. This is a nice looking
building that they've got there. It's not a run down dump they've
got proposed, and they just want to have a good public relationship
with the neighborhood, and as I said, do the best they can. Thank
you again.
MR. THOMAS-What's this a picture of?
MR. CARVIN-That's the type of material they're going to be using.
MR. FORD-Maybe you ought to show that to Mr. Rymkewicz.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Are you all set Mr. Rymkewicz? Okay. Thank you.
MR. THOMAS--A peti tion dated 3/20/96 "Peti tion against a possible
Use Variance to allow an animal shelter on subject property TO:
Town of Queensbury Zoning Board RE: Use Variance to allow an
animal shelter LOCATION: County Line Road, Approximately 1.2
miles north of Dix Avenue WE, THE HOME RESIDENTS OF QUEENSBURY
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
AVENUE, STRONGLY OPPOSE THIS VARIANCE FOR AN ANIMAL SHELTER. THIS
IS ZONED RESIDENTIAL, AND WE WOULD PREFER TO KEEP IT THIS WAY TO
ALLOW FOR OUR OWN PRIVACY. WE HAVE LIVED ON THIS ROAD FOR MANY
YEARS, AND WOULD LI KE TO PRESERVE THE NATURAL BEAUTY OF THE LAND AS
MY BROTHER, STAN RYMKEWICZ, AND MYSELF, BEV BENWAY WOULD BE THE
ONES MOST AFFECTED BY THIS VARIANCE. THERE IS A LOT OF WILDLIFE IN
THIS AREA, ESPECIALLY DEER AND DIFFERENT KINDS OF BIRDS, AND WE
FEEL THAT PUTTING THIS ANIMAL SHELTER IN THIS AREA WOULD EVENTUALLY
KEEP THE ANIMALS AWAY. PLEASE STRONGLY CONSIDER OUR REQUEST TO
KEEP THIS ANIMAL SHELTER FROM BEING BUILT. ATTACHED PLEASE FIND
SIGNATURES FROM OTHER HOME RESIDENTS OF QUEENSBURY AVENUE. Stan
Rymkewicz, Jr. 6300, Bev Benway 6284, Keith Benway 6284, Richard
Rymkewicz 6138, Barbara L. Frenyea 6248, Stan Skellie 6247, Suzanne
T. Nassivera lt148, ChasM J. Nassivera, Walter Fisher lt333" And
that's it.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Any other public comment? Okay.
hearing none, the public hearing is closed.
Seeing none,
PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED
MR. CARVIN-Any questions?
MR. FORD-I have no further questions, at least at this time.
MR. MENTER-I don't have any questions.
this both ways.
You could probably argue
MR. CARVIN-Yes.
It's a tough one. Questions or thoughts?
MR. GREEN-The veterinary clinic, are there any animals housed there
at this time?
MS. KIMBLE-Actually, the Countryside Veterinary Clinic is the
shelter for the City of Glens Falls. Whenever they have stray dogs
brought in, they bring them over to Countryside Veterinary
Hospital.
MR. GREEN-I'm curious of the neighbors if they hear those dogs?
NEIGHBOR-Yes, you do.
MRS. LAPHAM-They have indoor/outdoor runs, as opposed to the
completely sealed kind. I don't have any questions really. I just
have some thoughts. It seems to me that one of the major issues is
that the person that owns the land, you know, the front part is
residential, but it's not desirable for residential living because
of the planes and because of the proximity to, you know, other
commercial development, and the back part, which the S.P.C.A. could
go without a variance they're not allowed to because of the FAA.
Therefore, what does the person that owns this property supposed to
do with it, and it's not a self-created hardship. So, I mean, that
seems to me to be the biggest issue for us. The next thought I
have is that someone had mentioned the idea of, you know, dropped
animals and this sort of thing. Well, there's organizations like
the S.P.C.A., that are trying to change that by taking decent care
of the animals, by rescuing them, by putting them up for adoption
in responsible homes and encouraging spay and neuter policies, and
we're never going to see it change unless organizations like this
are, you know, allowed to educate the public.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Chris?
MR. THOMAS-I have one question for Mr. Rymkewicz. Why is there a
picture of the Price Chopper parking lot on that strip of?
MR. RYMKEWICZ-That's the mauve color building with the flat roof on
it.
- 26 -
'--
---
(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. THOMAS-Okay.
So that's comparing.
MRS. GRANT-Excuse me. told you it was going to be a mauve
colored textured concrete block. That there was a pitch to the
roof. I did not say a flat roof.
MR. RYMKEWICZ-Okay. Well, I understood you as saying it would be
a front, pitch from the front to the back. So you'd see a pitch
from the side.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Any other questions, Chris?
MR. THOMAS-I was going through the four questions for a Use
Variance, the first one being, the applicant cannot realize a
reasonable return provided that the lack of return is substantial
as demonstrated by any competent financial evidence. Well, we
haven't seen any financial evidence. Number Two, the alleged
hardship relating to the property is unique and does not apply to
a substantial portion of the district. This is unique, because of
the zoning and the airport. Number Three, that the requested Use
Variance, if granted, will not alter the essential character of the
neighborhood. Well, I think it will alter the essential
neighborhood character, and Number Four, the alleged hardship has
not been self-created. No, it hasn't been self-created. The FAA
took care of that for them. So, it looks like it's a two-two split
on this, and it's going to be tough to come up with a good answer
for this one.
MRS. LAPHAM-What was the one In the middle again?
MR. THOMAS-The requested Use Variance, if granted, will not alter
the essential character of the neighborhood.
MRS. LAPHAM-If you look up and down the neighborhood, do you really
think it would change it that much?
MR. THOMAS-To me, on that end, it would.
MRS. LAPHAM-There's already the airport.
MR. THOMAS-There's the airport there, but then it's all residential
on that end of Queensbury Avenue. Once you go over the hill and
past the airport, well that's where the industrial park is. So, to
me, that end of Queensbury Avenue, starting with Mr. Rymkewicz's
house, and going south, is residential. I mean, it's all houses in
there, but once you go past the airport entrance, and right across
the airport, that starts the industrial, or the commercial end of
that part of that road.
MRS. LAPHAM-Yes. You have the high speed traffic all along there,
though.
MR. THOMAS--Well, when they put the industrial
increase the traffic up in there, but that was a
don't even think the industrial park is filled
yet, either. So I think when it does, there's
traffic on that road.
park In, it did
long time ago. I
to its potential
going to be more
MR. CARVIN-I agree.
MR. THOMAS-So, I'm having a tough time with Questions One through
Four, especially One and Three.
MR. CARVIN-Well, I don't have a problem with One, because I don't
see how that this can be ever used as a residential lot.
MR. GREEN-Their assessment changed there, too, because of the FAA.
-- 27 -
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. CARVIN-Yes. So I don't have a problem with the first part. I
don't think a reasonable return can be a single family one acre.
You might be able to lop out maybe, what, one acre there, out of
the whole lot, if this is a one acre thing here, because the rest
of it is all tied up.
MR. THOMAS-Yes, well, it's Suburban Residential One Acre zoning in
that front part.
MR. FORD-Who owns it?
MR. CARVIN-I don't know who the owner is. They're looking for the
use.
MR. MENTER-I agree, the neighborhood impact is the issue.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. I think it's the neighborhood impact. Will it
alter the essential character of the neighborhood, and is this the
minimum variance? We have to balance the hardship proven by the
applicant, at the same time to preserve, protect the character of
the neighborhood and the heal th, safety and wel fare of conmJUni ty.
So those are the issues.
MRS. LAPHAM-Well, I don't know how it would impact the health,
safety and welfare.
MR. CARVIN-Well, it could. I mean, if somebody, and aga1n, it's
not their fault that somebody drives by and dumps off a dog or a
cat. I mean, if that dog or cat is running across the road and
you're going home from work and you run over it, we're creating a
possible situation there in a residential area.
MR. GREEN-Wouldn't that be a characteristic of no matter where this
goes, though?
MR. CARVIN-Yes.
MR. MENTER-It's more rural, is the thing. Essential character is
the issue, I mean, the essential character, in addition to health,
safety and welfare.
MR. CARVIN-We have, technically, a residential area, and we're
putting, essentially, and I don't want to use the term a
"commercial" venture, but it's not a residential in use. On the
other hand, like you say, if the FAA didn't have their fingers in
the p1e, I mean, they could put it in the back of the lot and there
you go.
MR. GREEN-Where does a dog kennel fall? What other uses are 1n the
same category as a dog kennel that would be out there?
MS. CIPPERLY-LC-IO, in the LC-IO zone itself, the permitted uses
are single family dwelling or hunting and fishing camp. Site Plan
Review uses include game preserve, sportsmans club and firing
range, campground, group camp, dog kennel and riding stable,
professional office, conmercial boat storage, produce stand,
Agricultural use, clear cutting of an area greater than an acre
would require site plan review, conmercial greenhouse, planned unit
development, private boathouse and dock, bed and breakfast, Private
sand and gravel extraction.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Well, lets kick it around, folks. This 1S why we
get paid the big bucks.
MR. HILTON- I would also I ike to point out that in the Rural
Residential zones, RR-3A and 5A, dog kennel and riding stable are
a Type II Site Plan Review use.
- 28 -
-
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. FORD-I applaud the work of the S.P.C.A. support it, but when
it comes to the impact on the character of the neighborhood, I
can't help but feel that it does exactly that, in this proposal.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Dave?
MR. MENTER-I'm certainly leaning the same way. I think there's,
just in weighing the two things, what sticks out in my mind is the
residents there have no place to go. With the zoning in the area,
I don't think things are going to be getting any better there for
you. I'm not sure that this is the worst thing that could or will
end up on that property, but I think in this case there would be an
effect on the area, and although it's difficult, and I agree. I
commend you. I think there's got to be other places to go.
MR. CARVIN-Bill?
MR. GREEN-Now I'm confused.
MR. CARVIN-Well, what part are you confused about?
MR. GREEN-I guess, I'm going along the same way. We have some
concerns from the ci tizens, the neighbors there. If this was an
existing building that wasn't built and designed as a kennel, like
maybe they were going to convert, I may tend to have a little more
feeling about noise escaping the building and fumes and things of
that sort. It appears that an awful lot of planning has gone into
to protect against those things. I still am not certain what I'm
going to do, though.
MRS. LAPHAM-Well, for me it goes back to the issue of Mr.
Sullivan's property. We've already agreed that it's not suitable
for a residence, and the FAA won't allow much to go on in the back
part. I also agree that I don't think this is the worst thing that
could be there. As an appraiser, this is what we call a
neighborhood in transition. I do agree that they could end up with
something far worse, and what happens the next time Mr. Sullivan
has a buyer for his property? Are we all going to be back here
tossing around the same thing, with people saying, boy, I wish I'd
thought more about the S.P.C.A.
MR. THOMAS-I was just looking at the Type II uses in Suburban
Residential One Acre. Day Care center pops up. There's a lot of
traffic on that. Hospital, nursing home, or health related
facility, a lot of traffic there. Church or synagogue, Sunday,
Friday nights. Planned Unit Development, you could have a whole
bunch of apartments right there, looking at a bigger building.
MR. CARVIN-If they could meet the height requirements.
MR. THOMAS-Well, hey, if they can get it under 30 feet, if
where they are, funeral home, professional office, multi
dwelling project. It's not the worst thing that could be
but there is a lot of neighborhood opposition. I'm still
up. I don't know.
that's
family
there,
tossed
MR. MENTER-Chris, you said 30 feet. You're referring to what?
MR. THOMAS-Height of the building.
MR. MENTER-They don't have 30 feet though, do they?
MR. THOMAS-No, but that's as high as they could
particular place, according to the FAA steps. See,
away you get from the runway, the higher it can go.
go in tha t
the farther
MR. MENTER-You could go 30 feet at that location?
- 29-
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. JONES-We could.
I think our building's 22 to 24 feet high.
MR. THOMAS-Yes. See, it depends on how far from the center 1 ine of
the runway it is.
MR. MENTER-Yes.
misinterpreted that.
MR. THOMAS-See, in fact, those trees out behind that are in
violation. It's like Mr. Jones said.
MR. CARVIN-Does anybody know if the Warren County Airport's going
out of business right away so that the FAA loses it's jurisdiction?
Think about what happens if that happens.
MS. CIPPERLY-Fred Austin didn't seem to think they were going out
of business soon.
MR. CARVIN-I don't think they are either, but.
MR. MENTER-It won't be any less a problem, I'll tell you that.
MR. CARVIN-Well, you won't have the restrictions.
MR. MENTER-Yes, but it's still a split zone. You're still going to
be dealing with the exact same question.
MR. GREEN-You could just move it back into the other zone.
MR. CARVIN-Yes.
MR. MENTER-There would be no change.
MS. CIPPERLY-The ability to move it back could have some impact,
lessening of impact on the neighborhood, except for the traffic
concerns. Personally, I don't know that the rate of dropping
animals off would exceed what it is now. I live on a nearby road,
and animals get dropped off already. So I don't know if it would
increase or not, but people see a rural area and think you need
more animals. At least it would be a nearby place to take them.
MR. CARVIN-Well, I think the Board has touched upon some very, very
good points, and this is, I think, Bonnie, you've got a very good
point. I think this is a neighborhood in transition. I think
we've got a piece of property here that has got some severe
limitations. So, I mean, obviously, the owner/applicants have got
some pretty good arguments as far as the use relief. My biggest
concern comes down to, I guess, is the drop off aspect, the 80
animals, and I realize that this is probably going on right now,
but the unsupervision of those 80 animals for quite a period of
time. I don't know what other questions to ask, and I really
haven't made up my mind. That's the whole problem, which is
unusual. I normally can come down pretty solid one side or the
other. All right. Our options are, we've closed the public
hearing. I believe we have, what, 60 days, 62 days to mull this
over, or does anybody feel strongly one side or the other that they
want to move this? Because this one is a very tough one, because
you've got some justifiable neighborhood opposition here, but on
the other hand, you've also got some pretty virtuous arguments to
allow this to go in.
MR. GREEN-I've got a
goes to the runner.
the middle, is there
more?
question for Staff. Like in baseball, a tie
Is there any sort of, if you're strictly in
any sort of guideline as to who has a little
MR. CARVIN-Yes, on a seven Board panel, the Chairman gets to
through the deciding vote.
- 30 -
--
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. MENTER-It would be nice, wouldn't it?
MR. HILTON-I have a question of the applicant. The concerns that
were raised by the residents, do you have any mitigation measures
for such concerns? I mean, do you have any things that you might
be able to do that would lessen the impacts or the concerns that
were raised?
MR. MENTER-Sight, sound, odors?
MS. CIPPERLY-One question that did come up was the dumpster. Is it
possible to locate that inside the building somehow?
MR. JONES-It could be located inside the garage area of the
building. There's definitely that option, because it's basically
a two car garage on that end. In reference to the noise aspect, as
I had indicated, it's a totally enclosed building. The windows are
not operable. It's totally cooled and totally heated in the
winter. It has a continuous air exchange going on in the building
for cleanliness. So it's not appropriate to open doors and attempt
to open windows. The faci J i ty that we've looked at down in
Schenectady is a state of the art facility. It has been designed
as a shelter, which is what our intent is. The building that
they're in at the present time is basically a building that was
designed as a shelter. It's a two story raised ranch type
facility. Improperly insulated. It was built 25 years ago, and is
certainly not the type of facility that we're proposing in this
location. I can't stress it enough. Our attempt is to make the
thing residential in character. I think we passed around a picture
of the other facility, and we are not looking to build a concrete
structure. We feel that we're leaving as many trees on the site as
totally feasible. It would be our intent to add landscaping to the
property, and we are required to go through a Site Plan Review. So
we still have another hoop to go through, as far as our approval
process on this project.
MS. CIPPERLY-Another question have is do you know what the
current practice is, for instance, at veterinary hospitals or other
shelters as far as night time supervision?
MRS. GRNH--At Glens Falls Animal Hospital, everyone is gone at
eight o'clock. The shelter at Scotia, the last staff person leaves
at, I believe, six o'clock, and if there are any animals in
emergency care or emergency medication, they pay them to go in over
time in the evening hours to administer medications. Other area
veterinarians in our area, there's not anyone on duty. Once
they're closed, they go home. There's no one there. Not only will
the shelter be sprinklered, I mean, we are, the animals welfare is
obviously our main concern. We want to go the extra expense of
having it sprinklered. There would be security lights. We don't
want anything to happen to the animals, but 24 hour days don't
happen anywhere else in our area. Area veterinarians don't do it.
Dr. GI endenni ng doesn't do it. Dr. French does not do it. You
want the abi 1 i ty to take care of the animal s when they're not
there.
MR. JONES-One thing that I may also add about the parking.
requirement for the 33 spaces is a requirement of the zoning.
not our requirement. We would prefer fewer spaces, but
requirement was for 33 on the property, and that's what we
provided for at this point. We feel we could probably get
with 15 to 20 spaces, tops.
The
It's
the
have
away
MR. HILTON-I have another question. There was a concern raised
that, with a septic system, there may be trucks on the site. How
would you compare that to a single family home? I'd like to know.
I don't know if there would be any more trips generated than if it
were a single family home and they had their septic being worked
- 31 --
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
on.
MR. JONES-Normally a single family residence is either a thousand
or a fifteen hundred gallon tank. We would be looking at something
probably in the neighborhood of thirty-five hundred to four
thousand gallon holding tank for the feces from the animals. We
would have an on site septic system for the domestic use of the
property. We would probably be pumping on the average of probably
every six months. The other work that we have done similar to
this, which is more of an intense, almost an adult care type
faci 1 i ty, we normally go wi th something in the neighborhood of
around three thousand gallons in septic tanks, and running nine
months before they get pumped out. So you're probably looking at
something (lost words).
MS. CIPPERLY-So you're saying that all the animal waste is
going to be handled in a septic system, not thrown into
dumpster as newspaper?
also
the
MR. JONES-Not on site, no. The dumpster
cardboard, paper debris, that type of thing.
disposing of animal waste in that dumpster.
wi 11
We
be used
will not
for
be
MR. CARVIN-Okay. What do you want to do here?
MR. THOMAS-I myself, I'd rather table it and kick it around a
little bit.
MR. CARVIN-Do you want to go the 62 days?
MR. THOMAS-I wouldn't go the 62.
MR. FORD-I have no objection to tabling it.
MR. CARVIN-{ don't know if we can table it, because we've gone
through all the loops and hoops, here. I mean, the meter starts
running for the 62 days. I mean, we have to make a determination,
right, one way or the other.
MR. FRIEDLAND-If you've closed the public hearing, you have 62 days
to make a decision.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. I don't think there's anything significant. I'm
going to keep the public hearing closed. I mean, we've really
heard all the mitigating arguments. All right. Is that the
Board's feeling? Do you want to really mull this around, or do we
have enough, I mean, if the motion is made, are we going to have a
split decision, I guess? I mean, what factors, at this point, need
to get resolved in your minds, one way or the other? We've got to
come to the trough, folks.
MR. GREEN-The more I think about it here, I have to kind of go
along with it, just on the simple basis that I think, one, it's the
S.P.C.A. They're going to do everything right. I mean, if it was
someone doing this on a private level, I would possibly have more
of a concern. You have the Animal Control Officer here that is in
very much support of this, and it seems like, as I said earlier,
they've built the most state of the art complex that's possible,
taking, you know, trying to prevent any outside impingement on the
neighbors, and I would vote for it.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. I've gone through this several times, and the only
one I keep tripping over is, will not alter the essential character
of the neighborhood, and I'm kind of kicking around in my mind that
if we limit it to no more than 80 animals at anyone time, that
when we refer it to Site Plan Review, that extraordinary efforts
are made, as far as the insulation and the soundproofing, that the
exterior be maintained in some sort of material that is uniform to
- 32 -
'--
--"
(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
the residential nature of the community, so that we don't end up
with a cement block situation. I mean, try to mitigate as much of
this impact of the neighborhood or conmlllnity, I think we can move
forward, because I think everything else does fal1 under the
granting of this request, and by stipulating some of this, I think
we can, we would be granti~g the minimum relief necessary, without
upsetting the neighborhood health, safety and welfare.
MR. FORD-I think the concerns expressed by the people who live in
the neighborhood are not unlike those of anyone that might live in
a similar neighborhood might come before this Board and express,
including the Board members.
MR. CARVIN-All right.
or do you want to mull
So, again,
it over?
do we have enough to move this,
MRS. LAPHAM-I don't need to mull it over, but if the rest of the
Board would like the time, I'm not against it.
MR. MENTER-Why don't you make that a motion, Fred, and we'll see
what happens.
MR. FRIEDLAND-Mr. Chairman, this is a Use Variance.
through SEQRA before you make a decision on
application.
You have to go
the variance
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Yes.
MOTION THAT A REVIEW OF THE SHORT ENVIRONMENTAL ASSESSMENT FORM
WOULD INDICATE A NEGATIVE DECLARATION, Introduced by Fred Carvin
who moved for its adoption, seconded by Chris Thomas:
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote;
AYES: Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Green, Mr. Menter, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas,
Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
MOTION TO APPROVE (* TABLED) USE VARIANCE NO. 12-1996 WASHINGTON
COUNTY SPCA. INC., Introduced by Fred Carvin who moved for its
adoption, seconded by William Green:
The applicant is proposing to construct an animal shelter In an
area currently zoned SR-IA and LC-I0A. Animal shelters are not a
listed use as permitted under the SR-IA zone classification. I
believe that the applicant has demonstrated that a reasonable
return off the land is not possible because of existing conditions
in relation to FAA restrictions which are imposed due to the
closeness of this parcel to the Warren County Airport, and that any
single family development in this zone would be extremely difficult
to achieve. Obviously, because of these FAA impositions, the
hardship is unique to this property. In regard to the adverse
effect on the essential character of the neighborhood issue, there
has been neighborhood opposition to the location of this animal
shelter in this parcel. However, I would like to mitigate the
change of character in the neighborhood by conditioning this
variance that at no time shall there be in excess of 80 animals on
the property. That this application be referred to site plan
review with emphasis placed on unique and extraordinary sound
dampening materials and that adequate sewage and animal waste
disposition be careful1y looked at and considered. I think the
applicant has also gone to extraordinary lengths by the design and
proposed construction of their building. That also emphasis should
be concentrated on the outside material. That any of the building
material be con1patible to the residential nature of the community
- 33-
-
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
and the area. I think by conditioning this variance with these
conditions, that this would be the minimum relief necessary to
alleviate the difficulty that's been confronted by the applicant.
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
AYES: Mr. Green, Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Carvin
NOES: Mr. Menter, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
MR. CARVIN-So that's a No Action, in which case, we're back to
Square One, folks. All right. Then I'm going to move that we
table this for consideration under the 62 day limitation, so that
the Board has an opportunity to address any of the issues that it
needs to address to come to a decision. So, we'll have to get back
to you with some kind of decision, and we have exactly 62 days to
do that. All right. So do I need a vote on that, or is that just
automatic?
MR. FRIEDLAND-You have 62 days in which to decide it.
MR. CARVIN-All right. Do we have to publically announce when we
bring that decision out? What is the procedure there?
MR. FRIEDLAND-No.
had and closed.
agendas.
There's no notice. The public hearing has been
What eve r yo u no tic e yo u ' d no r ma 11 y pro v ide to
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
that is the case.
So it would be just an agenda item.
So we'll let you know in 62 days.
Okay.
Then
AREA VARIANCE NO. 13-1996 TYPE II SFR-IA TUOMO S. NYKANEN JULIE
N. NYKANEN OWNER: SAME AS ABOVE EAST SIDE OF OAKWOOD DRIVE AT
INTERSECTION WITH WINCREST DRIVE APPLICANT PROPOSES A BOUNDARY
LINE ADJUSTMENT OF A NONCONFORMING LOT RESULTING IN AN AREA OF
.9569 SQ. FT. IN A SFR-IA ZONE (1 ACRE). THIS ADJUSTMENT REQUIRES
RELIEF FROM THE AREA REQUIREMENTS OF SECTION 179-20C. TAX MAP NO.
66-1-5.1 LOT SIZE: 0.96 ACRES SECTION 179-20C
MICHAEL O'CONNOR, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT
STAFF INPUT
Notes from Staff, Area Variance No. 13-1996, Tuomo S. Nykanen
Julie N. Nykanen, Meeting Date: March 20, 1996 "PROJECT LOCATION:
East side of Oakwood Drive at Wincrest Drive PROPOSED PROJECT AND
CONFORMANCE WITH THE ORDINANCE: The applicant is seeking to adjust
a boundary line of a nonconforming lot. The present area of the
lot is .9846 acres, the proposed area is .9569 acres. A driveway
belonging to the adjacent property owner is located on the
Nykanen's land. This adjustment is being made in order to remove
this driveway from the Nykanen's property. CRITERIA FOR
CONSIDERING AN AREA VARIANCE, ACCORDING TO CHAPTER 267, TOWN LAW.
1. BENEFIT TO THE APPLICANT: This relief would fix ownership
patterns so that the adjacent owner's driveway would not be on the
Nykanen! s proper ty. 2. FEAS IBLE ALTERNATIVES: Ther e does not
meet to be any alternatives which could provide a lesser amount of
relief from the Ordinance. 3. IS THIS RELIEF SUBSTANTIAL RELATIVE
TO THE ORDINANCE?: The required area for a lot in the SFR--1A
district is one acre, the applicants proposed lot would be .9569
acres. 4. EFFECTS ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR COMMUNITY?: There do
not appear to be any adverse impact associated with this request.
Additional comment may be made at the public hearing. 5. IS THIS
DIFFICULTY SELF-CREATED?: No. At the tin1e of the sale and survey
of this lot in 1992 it was discovered that the neighbors driveway
ran across this property. PARCEL HISTORY: This property was
- 34 -
-- -'
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
purchased by the Nykanen's in 1992, and their home exists on the
property today. STAFF COMMENTS AND CONCERNS: Staff feels that
this is a small adjustment to the property. The difference between
the required and existing area is a minor amount. SEQR: Type II,
no further action required."
MR. THOMAS-It appears this did not go before Warren County.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Does everyone understand what the applicant is
requesting? Any questions of the applicant? Okay. I understand
full y w hat ish a p p en i n g her e . 1ft her e ' s no add i t ion ale omm en t
from the applicant, then I'll open up the public hearing.
PUBLIC HEARING OPENED
NO COMMENT
PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED
MR. CARVIN-Any questions of the applicant?
Then I'd ask for a motion.
Everybody satisfied?
MOTION TO APPROVE AREA VARIANCE NO. 13-1996 TUOMO S. NYKANEN
JULIE N. NYKANEN, Introduced by Bonnie Lapham who moved for its
adoption, seconded by Fred Carvin:
East side of Oakwood Drive. The applicant is seeking to adjust the
boundary line of a nonconforming. The present area of the lot is
.9846 acres. The proposed area is .9569 acres. The driveway
belonging to the adjacent property owner is located on the Nykanen
plan. This adjustment is being made in order to remove the
driveway from the Nykanen's property. This relief would fix
ownership patterns so that the adjacent owner's driveway would not
be on the Nykanen's property. There do not seem to be any feasible
alternatives that could provide a lesser amount of relief from the
Ordinance. The required area for a 'lot in the Single Family
Residential district is one acre. The applicant's proposed lot
would be .9569 acres. There do not appear to be any adverse
impacts associated with the request. The difficulty is not self-
created. It occurred at the time of the sale and survey in 1992.
This property was purchased in 1992, and their home exists on the
property today.
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
AYES: Mr. Menter, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas, Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Green,
Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
Area Variance No.
I'm going to change. The next one IS going to be
17-1996, Joseph Guerra.
AREA VARIANCE NO. 17--1996 TYPE I I WR~ lA CEA DR. & MRS. JOSEPH
GUERRA OWNER: SAME AS ABOVE CLEVERDALE ROAD TO SEELYE ROAD,
OPPOSITE DUTCHESS OF LAKEWOOD SIGN APPLICANT PROPOSES TO CONSTRUCT
A SECOND LEVEL ON A SINGLE FAMILY HOME. THIS ACTION REQUIRES
RELIEF FROM THE ENLARGEMENT OF NONCONFORMING STRUCTURE REQUIREMENTS
IN SECTION 179-79A2. ADIRONDACK PARK AGENCY WARREN COUNTY
PLANNING 3/13/96 TAX MAP NO. 16-1-32 LOT SIZE: 0.63 ACRES
SECTION 179-79A2
JOSEPH & ROSE GUERRA, PRESENT
STAFF INPUT
35 -
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
Notes from Staff, Area Variance No. 17-1996, Dr. & Mrs. Guerra,
Meeting Date: March 20, 1996 "PROJECT LOCATION: Seelye Rd. off
Cleverdale Rd., opposite Dutchess of Lakewood sign. PROPOSED
PROJECT AND CONFORMANCE WITH THE ORDINANCE: The applicant is
proposing to construct a second floor addition to his existing
home. This action requires relief from the enlargement of a
nonconforming structure requirements of Section 179-79A2. The
applicant is proposing to expand the building area of his home by
more than 50% of what the original structure was. The original
square footage of the home is listed as 1618 sq. ft. (Assessor),
and the proposal is for a second floor addition of the same size.
CRITERIA FOR CONSIDERING AN AREA VARIANCE, ACCORDING TO CHAPTER
267, TOWN LAW. 1. BENEFIT TO THE APPLICANT: The applicants state
that this relief is necessary to renovate the home because it will
eventually be their permanent home. 2. FEASIBLE ALTERNATIVES: It
does not appear that there are any alternatives which could provide
a lesser amount of relief from the Ordinance. 3. IS THIS RELIEF
SUBSTANTIAL RELATIVE TO THE ORDINANCE? This 25,000 square foot lot
currently has 2254 square feet of living area. This request would
increase the overall living area to a total of 3872 square feet.
4. EFFECTS ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR COMMUNITY?: There may be some
effects on the lake and other properties due to stormwater runoff
associated with this addition. Additional comment may be made at
the public hearing. 5. IS THIS DIFFICULTY SELF-CREATED?: No.
This lot contains 25,000 square feet in a WR-1A zone which requires
a minimum lot size of one acre. Almost any type of expansion on
this property would require a variance. PARCEL HISTORY: All
assessor's records indicate this property has been owned by the
Guerra's. Currently, there is 2254 square feet of living space on
the property. The Guerra's applied for a variance in 1985 to
expand their home. This request for side setback relief was denied
by the ZBA. STAFF COMMENTS AND CONCERNS: The Zoning Board should
determine what visual impact this addition would have on the
neighborhood. Staff has concerns about stormwater runoff onto
other properties and into the lake. The height of the structure is
not indicated on the provided elevations. The overall height of
the building cannot exceed 35 feet as required in the WR-1A
d i s t r i ct. S EQR : T y pel I, no fur the r act ion r e qui red. "
MR. THOMAS-"At a meeting of the Warren County Planning Board, held
on the 13th day of March 1996, the above application for an Area
Variance to construct a second level addition to existing structure
and new roof. was reviewed and the following action was taken.
Recommendation to: No County Impact" Signed by C. Powel South,
Chairperson.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
I'm gOIng to move the Short Environmental Form.
MR. MARTIN-It's Type II anyhow, Fred.
MR. CARVIN-So we don't have to.
the applicant is requesting?
Okay. Everyone understand what
MR. FORD-Yes.
MR. CARVIN-Any questions of the applicant?
MR. GREEN-I've got a question here, on Site Plan 3-93, that was the
site plan for the second story, and you just never did it? The
site plan was approved on?
DR. GUERRA-It was approved in 1992?
MR. GREEN-Well, it says '93 here, February 23, 1993.
DR. GUERRA-Well, I just ran out and never got to do it, and
didn't like the design of the roof.
- 36 -
-
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. GREEN-Did you get a variance at that time?
MRS. GUERRA-I don't think a varu:.trlce was necessary because the roof
was not being changed that much.
DR. GUERRA-Actually now I want to put a completely pitched roof on
it. Before, they were leaving the flat roof.
MRS. LAPHAM-This is what you're doing this time?
DR. GUERRA-Correct.
That's the type roof we want to put on now.
MR . MART I N - I t h ink , Bill, t hat pro pas a I in' 9 3 did n 't nee d a
variance, because it was under the 50 percent requirement, but any
expansion of a nonconforming structure requires site plan review.
So, should this be approved tonight, that's the next place it would
go.
MR. GREEN-I just saw the site plan was approved, and I was curious
why it didn't go ahead then.
MRS. GUERRA-(1ost words) my dad's very ill, and we were not
interested or thinking about doing anything more. Now my husband's
getting toward retirement, and I'm getting kind of itchy to get
this house done so we can move up here.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Do you have the height from the front elevation,
or the lakeside?
DR. GUERRA-It would be the same height as the existing roof that we
have there.
MR. FORD-You're going to add another story and maintain the same
roof?
DR. GUERRA~Actually, the second story of it
pi tched roof, and then there' 11 bf~ room for
bathroom.
is go i ng to be the
two bedrooms and a
MR. CARVIN-Well,
before, but this
I'm looking at this, and we've gone through this
is the view from the lake, is it?
DR. GUERRA-Right.
MR. CARVIN-All right. Well, do you know what this height is going
to be?
DR. GUERRA-This IS just a sketch of what we're going to do, but I
took it from the last time. Do you have a picture of the old roof
there? I have some photographs of the old roof.
MR. CARVIN-Yes.
I've got this.
DR. GUERRA-Well', I'm under the understanding that it wouldn't be
any higher than that pitched old roof.
MR. CARVIN-I'm looking here, and this is from the lake, and it
would appear that you re going to have a substantially larger roof,
and this is what I'm wondering.
MRS. GUERRA-It's going to be a second story.
DR. GUERRA--Yes, but still, I was under the understanding that the
peak wouldn't be any higher than the peak of that roof there now,
because originally he said he was going to extend it over. I don't
have any measurements of that right now.
MR. THOMAS-Well, it's got to be.
If you look at the old roof, from
- 37 --
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
the lake side, and it shows the glass across the front, okay, and
then you go over to the lake side elevation, you're putting two
dormers on there, with the windows, and the roof above that. You
can see that it's going to be higher than the existing roof.
MR. CARVIN-From the lake, it's now one of these three story things.
MRS. GUERRA-That bottom is a cellar.
MR. THOMAS-Yes, it's a walk out cellar.
MRS. GUERRA-Yes.
MR. THOMAS-And then there's the first floor, and then there's no
second story on there now?
MRS. GUERRA-Right.
MR. THOMAS-Okay.
It's just a hip roof on there.
MRS. GUERRA-Yes.
MR. THOMAS-Okay. What you're going to do is put a second story on,
and then bring the roof down and the eave of the new roof will be
at the same level as the eave of the existing roof. That's the way
it looks between the elevation from the lake and the existing
picture, but the existing roof now doesn't look like you could
stand up inside it.
DR. GUERRA-You can.
MR. THOMAS-But only in the center of it.
DR. GUERRA-Right.
MR. THOMAS-Okay. So in order to get more room toward the overhang,
you would have to go up higher, in order to get those dormers in.
That's the way 1 see it.
DR. GUERRA-If you take a picture of this, there's a flat roof in
front of that pitched roof on the side and in the back. So,
really, I was under the understanding that originally they were
going to try and extend that roof straight across and then come
with a pitch toward the front and back, and then put the dormers
on.
MR. THOMAS-I don't see how they're going to do that.
MR. CARVIN-In 35 feet.
MR. THOMAS-Yes. I've seen a lot of renovations around the lake,
and, to me, that roof has got to go up. Do you have a contractor
or something, somebody that?
DR. GUERRA-Being that we were approved before, I just thought we'd
want to get it approved now. Then we were going to have the plans
drawn up.
MR. THOMAS-Yes. If you had a contractor in here that could tell us
all this stuff.
MRS. GUERRA-What do you need to know?
MR. THOMAS-How high that roof is going to be above the existing
roof, for how high, from ground level, to the peak of the roof.
MRS. GUERRA-Okay, but our house sets down, so we're not obstructing
- 38 -
"--
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
anyone's view.
MR. CARVIN-So it still has no bearing, it still can't be any higher
than 35 feet, and what we're saying is; I don't think you're going
to be able to put a third story up here and come underneath the 35
feet, because you've probably got, what, 10 foot here and 10 foot
there. You've probably got 20, 25 feet, probably 30 feet now. I
mean, is that a rough estimate? That's probably a close estimate.
DR. GUERRA-On the plans that were submitted in '93, probably that
height would be on that. I thought that you would have that in the
file. Well, okay. I can get those things.
MR. THOMAS-Do we have the plans from '93?
be here.
mean, they might not
MR. MARTIN-We have them back in the office.
DR. GUERRA-Yes.
original plans.
know I'm not going any higher than those
MR . MAR TIN - W 0 u I d you h a v e a arc hit e c tor con t r act 0 r who co u I d
provide you with that?
DR. GUERRA-Well, after this step, we were going to go to an
architect.
MR. MARTIN-I understand that, but I mean, at this step, could they,
could you get somebody to supply the Board with that information?
DR. GUERRA-Yes.
MR. CAR V I N- Yes. I'd I i k e to see, I t hi nk , a lit tIe bit mo r e
detail, as far as what's projected there.
MR. MARTIN-And I'm not saying go out and get your whole plans all
drawn and go to that expense, but at least, you know, I think an
architect or contractor could give an idea as to what the height
would be.
MR. FORD-I have another issue.
MRS. GUERRA-Okay. Is th is wha t you wan t? You jus t wan t to know
how high this building is going to be, is that correct?
MR. THOMAS-Yes.
MR. MARTIN-And bear in mind, height is figured from the lowest
point on the grade to the highest point on the house. So in this
particular case, it's figured from the grade down by the lakeside
to the highest point on the house.
DR. GUERRA-And this can't be any higher than 35 feet?
MR. CARVIN-Currently, and I think that may, I don't know how this
would bear.
MR. MARTIN-Well, that's the current standard. There is a proposal
before the Town Board to amend the Zoning Code down to 28 feet, and
that is being heard May 6th.
DR. GUERRA--If I was just going to change my roof, not the room
upstairs, because basically I want a pitched roof. I mean, then
could just go from the peak where I am now, is that correct?
MR. CARVIN-Well, I think you'd probably have to consult and come up
with the measurements.
-- 39
-~
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. MARTIN-Just as a bit of advice, and I just mean this totally as
advice, we've had applicants come before the Board who come with a
sketch similar to that, thinking, you know, this is what I want to
do, t he Board r eac t s and we've had them approved, and then they
take it out to a contractor or architect, and they change that,
once they apply their knowledge to it, and we get in a bind, and we
get in a big problem because, there may be some practical reason
why you have to change your roof line, and it doesn't match your
approval, and it's caused big problems. So I think if you can get
as best a handle as you can, from a practical point of view, as to
what that design is going to be, and then come back to the Board,
because I just don't want to see you get an approval, and then
have, you know, problems down the road.
MRS. GUERRA-Now, what are you saying, then? We have to come back
with the figure of how high this building will be?
MR. MARTIN-Yes, and I '01 just advising you go to get some
verification of that from your contractor or from your architect or
whoever you're going to have do this for you, and make sure that
that is, in fact, what you envision and what can actually be built.
Because sometimes that can vary.
MRS. GUERRA-And actually this has to be done, probably, before May
6th, if you're changing the standards here.
MR. MARTIN-Well, yes. I don't know if that's going to go into
effect that night or not, but that's what's proposed.
MRS. GUERRA-You see, we didn't want to go up. We didn't want to go
up at all, but we were told we could not go out, because we had to
go up. Going up is not to my liking at all.
MR. M.ARTIN-No,
don't blame you for that.
MRS. GUERRA-All right. Then do we come to this next meeting next
week or do we notify you?
MR. MARTIN-That's up to the Board.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Well, we've got that issue on the table.
MR. FORD-I'm trying to reconcile some
footage. It's listed as 1618 square
2254 square feet, existing building.
if either one of them is accurate?
differences in the square
feet. It's also listed as
Which of those is accurate,
DR. GUERRA-Actually, all I know is the existing building is 48 by
47 and a half.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. How long have you owned it?
DR. GUERRA-Since 1966.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Did you put an addition on it at any point?
DR. GUERRA-No. We never really put an addition on it.
MR. CARVIN-So you bought it as is?
DR. GUERRA-Yes. We improved the original structure, but we never
added.
MR . CAR V IN - Th at' s w hat I' 01 ask i ng .
original structure".
When you say "improved the
MRS. GUERRA-We didn't put an addition on.
porch.
We enclosed the front
- 40 -
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---
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
DR. GUERRA-Enclosed the front porch.
MRS. GUERRA-But the structure was there.
MR. FORD-When you
square footage is
considering living
up with the 3872.
come back, we'd like to know what the actual
and how that is determined. What are we
space, and then where do we go from that to come
MR. CARVIN-When you enclosed the space, what was the space? Was it
a deck or a porch?
MRS. GUERRA-It was a porch, a screened porch.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, and now is it living area?
DR. GUERRA-·Yes.
MR . CAR V I N - 0 k a y . We 11, t hat's an ex pan s ion, you see, and t hat's
what I suspect, because you probably had a 1618 square foot
original cabin, and if you had a deck, and enclosed that, that was
probably where they come up with that extra four or five hundred
square feet.
MR. FORD-That's good supposition.
verification.
I'd just like some sort of
DR. GUERRA-Originally, it was an open porch.
MR. FORD-And when did you do that?
DR. GUERRA-We did that in 1970.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Any other questions of the applicant? Okay. I
just have one. Now, this is going to be an addition. You're not
going to be tearing this whole thing down? You're just going to be
taking the roof off and building up?
DR. GUERRA-That's right.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
MRS. GUERRA-And there's not going to be any more people in the
house. I see here where there's a concern about the runoff on the
lake. Actually, there'll probably be one less person.
MR. THOMAS-We L I, when they're talking about runoff, they're talking
about stormwater, rain water. Just because there's one less
person, doesn't make a difference.
MRS. GUERRA-Right.
MRS. GUERRA-So where do we go from here?
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Well, we normally, I think we re going to table
this, until we get some additional information.
MR. MARTIN-We'd be happy to sit down with you and try and resolve
a lot of these issues and get this application in a little bit
better shape, at no cost. What I could recommend you do is, this
is George Hilton. You could call him and schedule a time. We'll
sit down with you and put in layman's terms what is actually needed
here for you, and try and get you on a better footing here.
MRS. GUERRA-Okay.
Very good.
MR. CARVIN--Okay, but
table this, we have a
should point out that
60 day tabling policy.
if we're going to
So don't know
- 41 -
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
whether, if they're going to be longer than that.
MR. GUERRA-Well, would the meeting be, are they every month?
MR. CARVIN-Well, the meetings are every month, but it becomes a
scheduling. In other words, if we don't hear back from you within
60 days, this application is null and void.
DR. GUERRA-We can get back.
MR. MARTIN-Yes. We can meet with you in the next few days and give
you a list of things that you need to get done and get on your way.
MR. CARVIN-We better open up the public hearing. All right. I'm
going to open up the public hearing on this application.
PUBLIC HEARING OPENED
MR. CARVIN-All right. I'm going to leave the public hearing open,
because we don't have to re-advertise, is that correct, if we leave
the public hearing open?
MR. MARTIN-That's correct.
MR. CARVIN-All right. So the public hearing will remain open.
MOTION TO TABLE AREA VARIANCE NO. 17-1996 DR. & MRS. JOSEPH G.
GUERRA, Introduced by Fred Carvin who moved for its adoption,
seconded by Thomas Ford:
To allow the applicant an opportunity to work with staff and to
address some of the height and stormwater runoff issues and
dimensions, and make this application complete.
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
DR. GUERRA-Could I ask one question? Now the reason that this was
approved the first time, was it because we left all that flat roof?
MR. CARVIN-I don't know what, I can't give you an answer. I can
tell you why it's not moving ahead tonight is because we don't have
the answers. Okay.
AYES: Mr. Menter, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas, Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Green,
Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
AREA VARIANCE NO. 14-1996 TYPE II WR-IA CEA ALFRED E. & MARY E.
KRI STENSEN OWNER: SAME AS ABOVE FITZGERALD ROAD APPLICANT
PROPOSES MODIFICATION OF PRE-EXISTING LOTS PARTIALLY WITHIN A CEA.
THIS ACTION NEEDS RELIEF FROM THE AREA REQUIREMENTS IN SECTION 179-
16C AND THE MERGER PROVISIONS OF SECTION 179-76E. APPLICANT ALSO
PROPOSES TO CONSTRUCT AN ADDITION TO A PRE-EXISTING STRUCTURE WHICH
WILL REQUIRE RELIEF FROM THE SHORELINE SETBACKS OUTLINED IN SECTION
179-60(15)(c). WARREN COUNTY PLANNING 3/13/96 TAX MAP NO. 41-1-
21.1, 21.2, 21.3, 25 LOT SIZES: 0.34, 0.49, 0.22, 0.59 SECTION
179-76E, 179-60(15)(c)
MICHAEL O'CONNOR, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT
STAFF INPUT
Notes from Staff, Area Variance No. 14-1996, Alfred E. & Mary E.
Kr is tensen, Meet i ng Date: March 20, 1996 "PROPOSED LOCATION:
Fitzgerald Road PROPOSED PROJECT AND CONFORMANCE WITH THE
- 42 -
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--
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
ORDINANCE: Applicant proposes modification of pre-existing lots
partially within a CEA. This action needs relief from the area
requirements of Section 179-16C and the merger provisions of
Section 179-76E. Applicant also proposes to construct an addition
to a pre-existing structure which will require relief from the
s h 0 rei i n e set b a c k sou t1 i n e din S e c ti 0 n 1 79 - 60 ( 1 5 ) ( C). CR I TER I A FOR
CONSIDERING AN AREA VARIANCE, ACCORDING TO CHAPTER 267, TOWN LAW:
1. BENEFIT TO THE APPLICANT: The benefit to the applicant would
be the ability to develop single family homes. 2. FEASIBLE
ALTERNATIVES: The applicant could split Lot C, giving area to Lot
B and Lot D. The result would be three lots which come closer to
conforming to the area requirements of the WR-IA district. 5. IS
THIS RELIEF SUBSTANTIAL RELATIVE TO THE ORDINANCE?: The minimum
lot area for the WR-IA zoning district is one acre. The largest
lot will be . 6 1 acres , the small est wi 11 be . 4 9 acres . The
shoreline setback is 75 feet, the applicant is seeking a setback of
35 feet for the proposed addition. 4. EFFECTS ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD
OR COMMUNITY?: These nonconforming lots which are located in a
CEA, could have a negative impact associated with stormwater runoff
into Glen Lake. Additional comment may be provided at the public
hearing. 5. IS THIS DIFFICULTY SELF-CREATED? Lots B, C, & D were
all under one ownership at one time. The Zoning Ordinance states
that lots which do not meet the area requirements of the zoning
district that are in a CEA will be considered one lot for zoning
purposes. PARCEL HISTORY: According to the Assessors office
files, the lots which make up Parcel "A" have been owned by Don &
Kathyrn Maynard. Parcels "B", "C", & "D" have been shown as being
owned by Mary Ellen Kristensen. On October' 27, 1994 a portiorl of
Parcel "B" was split and is now under the ownership of multiple
members of the Kristensen family. STAFF COMMENTS AND CONCERNS:
This application seeks to merge lots which according to the Zoning
Ordinance are considered to be one lot because they are located in
a CEA. If merged, these lots would not meet the area requirements
for the WR-IA district. The applicant is also seeking shoreline
setback relief to construct an addition to a pre-existing
structure. The existing shoreline setback for that lot shown as
Parcel "D" does not conform to the required setback of 75 feet.
SEQR: Type II, no further action required."
MR. THOMAS-"At a meeting of the Warren County Planning Board, held
on the 13th day of March 1996, the above application for an Area
Variance for the modification of pre-existing lots partially within
a critical environmental area. was reviewed, and the following
action was taken. Reconm1endation to: Return Comments: The WCPB
agrees with the merger of the lots, but no action could be taken on
the proposed addition since a majority vote could not be achieved."
Signed by C. Powel South, Chairperson.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Does everybody understand what the applicant is
requesting?
MR. FORD-Yes. I have a technical question, just for the
appropriateness of accepting applications where documents have
supposedly been read and attested to an accepting an undated stamp
of an applicant's signature? It appears four times on this. I
mean, if that's acceptable and appropriate.
MR. O'CONNOR-We had all ten copies prepared, but we couldn't get
the signature, ahead, on one to photocopy the signature. So what
we did was have the original signed, and Staff has the original, or
somebody has the original. There was an original signed, and we
used a stamp on the balance.
MR. FORD-Thank you.
MR. O'CONNOR-Next time I will have it signed before.
MR. CARVIN-Do you have the original of Dr. Kristensen's signature?
-- 43 -
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. THOMAS-Yes, do.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. On all of them? Because we have just a stamp
her e. Does S taf f wan t to make any corrunen t sin add i ti on to the i I'
corrunents?
MR. HILTON-Just what's in the notes, and if any questions arise,
I'll be happy to answer them for you.
MR. THOMAS-Do you want me to read Jin1's letter to Mr. Price, about
the three lots?
MR. CARVIN-Well, it's part of the record. Okay. Any questions of
the applicant? Okay. Am I to understand, in 50 words or less,
that this is where you want to end up?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes, it is.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, and am I to understand that as it is right now, we
have a lot here, a lot here, a lot here, a lot here, and a lot
here, is that correct?
MR. O'CONNOR-That was our understanding, without this merger
business.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, and what you are looking to do
construct a two car garage, as opposed to the four,
the closet here, requiring a setback from the lake?
is actually
and then pu t
MR. O'CONNOR-And can I correct one thing?
that's 45 feet from the lake, that closet.
That's not 35 feet,
MR. CARVIN-Okay. So that this is an incorre~t figure?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes. The relief requested is 25 feet on the closet.
MR. MENTER-The actual distance to the closet?
MR. O'CONNOR-From the outside edge of the closet is 45 feet. If
you take a look at the front of the house that's shown to be 30
feet, it should have been picked up before.
MR. CARVIN-There's a deck there, too.
house, but what's it to the deck?
So tha t' s 30 feet to the
MR. O'CONNOR-That's not shown on here, but just as a matter of
scale, that line couldn't be 35 feet, Mr. Carvin, that closet back
there (lost word). Relief requested from the closet is 25 feet.
It's 30 feet. My apology. It presently is 45 feet, and the relief
requested is 30 feet.
MR. CARVIN-Okay.
it's just the,
currently?
Am I also to understand that there is, I
shed is the only thing that is existing
think
there
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes. The shed will be removed.
MR. THOMAS-Yes, that does scale back to 45 feet.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. What is it from the front of that deck, existing
camp, I guess I don't know what that abbreviation is, something or
other deck.
MR. THOMAS-I have 18 and a half feet, existing concrete deck.
MR. CARVIN-Concrete deck. Now is that a patio, is it?
be a patio, then. Is this a concrete deck, then? I
just a patio?
That must
mean, it's
- 44 -
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
ALFRED KRISTENSEN
DR. KRISTENSEN-No, it is raised.
MR. CARVIN-It is raised. It's only 18 feet. That's been there for
a while, I take it. Right? All right. Now you also have a new
garage that you are proposing, or is that?
MR. O'CONNOR-That is proposed. There are no variances required for
that, I'm advised.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, and then this IS an existing residence here.
Okay. So I guess, if memory serves correct, the four car garage
was conditioned that this line actually move 25 feet, or something
like that, so that you have 175 feet?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. So, actually, you don't have a four car garage
until you get that moved. Is that correct?
MR. O'CONNOR-Right.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Now, does a variance have a time limit?
MR. MARTIN-Yes.
MR. CARVIN-And is it one year?
MR. MARTIN-Yes.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Are there any anticipated, all right, now I guess
these would all be common ownership, or would these all be in
family ownership, different family members?
MR. O'CONNOR-Individually owned.
MR. CARVIN-Okay, and this has got no part of this application,
technically?
MR. O'CONNOR-It has no part.
MR. CARVIN-That's Maynard. All right. Does everybody understand
what they're requesting? This is kind of a spaghetti situation
here. There's a lot of lines running all over. Let me take a shot
at this, okay, Mike?
MRS. LAPHAM-I think I've got it, but I don't know.
MR. CARVIN-Well, this is where they want to end up. This is the
bottom line, I guess. What has happened here is that there has
been a number of combinations of purchases and lot line adjustments
and so forth, but, essentially, we have a lot here, a lot here, and
two lots here. In other words, this line here is actually a lot.
For zoning purposes, because it's a common ownership, it's all
considered as one lot. Now. When we granted the variance for the
four car garage, back a couple thousand years ago, we conditioned
that variance that this line be moved this direction, so that they
had, they've got 150 feet, 149.xx, but we wanted 175 feet, and in
essence I think we were going to subdivide this lot, is that
correct, Mike? I may be wrong on that.
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes. We were going to subdivide that lot.
MR. CARVIN-And end up with, essentially, two lots?
MR. O'CONNOR-No, three lots.
- 45-
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. CARVIN-Three lots, with this one being a little one?
MR. o 'CONNOR-I 've got about five different configurations of lots.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Well, I really don't want to get bOlged down in
it, but, essentially, we were going to move this line this way.
MR. O'CONNOR-We were going to change the boundary line, but still
keep three building lots.
MR. CARVIN-Right, and essentially I think all they've done is just
even this up, so that they still have, essentially, three building
lots, and my guess is that these lots, I don't think we would be
giving up anything if we did this, because any building on this lot
or this lot would have to be in compliance with any setbacks and so
forth, so that if they were closer to the lake, that we would have
to review that.
MR. FORD-Or come in for variance.
MR. CARVIN-Or come in for variance. All right. So the bottom line
is, do we want to end up with this type of configuration, and is
this, I think, detrimental to the overall aspect of the conmunity.
Because I think we are creating, we're creating, what,
nonconforming lots, essentially. Now, Staff has indicated that,
well, gee whiz, instead of having three lots, why don't we just
split it in two and we'll have two lots that are a little bit
closer to conformance, and I think that surmnarizes Staff's
position, in ten words or less?
MR. HILTON-That's a feasible alternative. Yes.
MR. CARVIN-Yes, that's one of the alternatives that we're looking
at. That still doesn't address this issue, but it addresses
whether we want to have three lots here or two lots. Okay. Does
that succinctly clarify? All right. Having said that, are there
any questions of the appl icant? I f not, then I'll move to the
public hearing. I'll open up the public hearing.
PUBLIC HEARING OPENED
MR. O'CONNOR-A couple of points I'd like to make, okay. One
particularly as to the character of the neighborhood, and I don't
want to bog you down and get you all confused, but we have gone
through just about every type of configuration that you can think
of to go through. Eventually, the Kristensen family is going to
con t r 01 the Maynar d proper ty and wha t we s how on her e as be i ng
three family lots, okay, and then they are going to sell,
immediately, Lot D. We have a fellow who says, for reasons of his
own and our own, he says he will lease it until November, and he
will buy it if we get permission to do the closet and the two car
garage. This is, I once did a, in the same file, did an
application with regard to assessments, and I got copies of various
portions of the tax map. If you take a look at this portion of
Glen Lake, which is across the lake from what we are talking about
here, probably 75 to 90 percent of the lots are actually 50 feet
lots. They're the same lots as what we have here, and I say that
simply to talk about the character of the lots, the reasonableness
of the applicant when you come to balance what everybody is trying
to accomplish. I'll show you the tax map of this particular area,
and I will note that I speak not with tongue and cheek. I own that
lot right there. My mother owns these two lots. My mother's going
to be very surprised to find out that those two lots now are
considered one lot, but that's an issue. I don't know. This
merger business was never applied to Glen Lake before, and I'm not
sure how it came up in this particular instance. It was accepted
as being applied to APA lands, but it was snuck in, or not snuck
in, but in 1988, it was put in with regard to Glen Lake lots, at
- 46 -
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
least the first hundred feet of those lots. Okay. So the back
lots aren't merged either, if you want to talk about uniqueness and
other different aspects he had. In this particular area, there
are, other than the Maynard parcel, which was three 50 foot lots,
and the Kristensen lot itself, there really are no lots as big as
what we're proposing, 125 feet and 130 feet. If you talk about
practical difficulty, you talk about area variance, you talk about
a balancing. One other thing you talk about and can talk about,
legitimately, from the area variance, is substantial economic
impact. I have records, and I wi II submi tit as par t of the
record, that right now the investment in this particular property
right here, Parcel D, I say this with the permission of my client
who is present with me, is $440,000. The market value on that
property is $330,000. At least that's what we have been able to
generate the best that we can. To follow Staff's comment and add
some frontage to it, out of what we've bought from Price, we will
not get a reasonable return. I almost think I have enough proof to
actually merit not only an area variance but a use variance if that
was what I was applying for on this particular thing. We've talked
about taking tl1e 50 foot lot and adding it to the Maynard parcel,
but then you've got all kinds of probl ems there, because then
you've got two principal residences on a one lot. You also have an
investment on the Maynard parcel alone of, close to $550,000. It
just doesn't make reasonable, economic sense, in the sense of
reasonabl e return, not making a prof it. I don't know how many
parcels on Glen Lake are even comparable to that. We talked about
leaving the 50 foot lot and creating two 100 foot lots. We've
talked about adding 100 feet to the 50 foot lot and making one lot
the other way. When we tried to come back to, say, where did we
start this whole mess? We started it when Price gave an idea to
us, and we verified it with Jim Martin, that he had a 125 foot lot
adjoining Kristensen's main home. He had an 80 foot vacant lot
next to that, and he had a 50 foot lot. I didn't think I was going
to sell it to the eskimos, but that I was going to keep the three
lots, and you talk about, we came in looking, thinking that we had
three lots, and basically we're still keeping three lots. We came
in thinking we had four. We thought we had the Kristensen family
home, and three from Price. We are asking to go out of here with
three lots, the Kristensen family home, the 125 foot vacant parcel,
we've thrown the 80 foot parcel with the 50 foot parcel, to come up
with 130 foot parcel. Out of curiosity, when I saw this map, and
then I saw this map, I also went to the County Clerk's Office,
because, if you have an area variance, this other land's available.
Okay. There is no other land available coming this way, because
you've got Maynard. There's no other land going that way, because
you've got Parcel D that's fully developed. There is shown here a
strip of land along the back of the parcel. Okay. You research
that, Davey Fitzgerald owned that. He owned all that. In fact, my
family probably had, my fan1ily, cousins, relatives and everything
else, have owned probably 15 of these. They were all 50 foot lots,
regardless of what you show. We bought 50 foot lots up there, all
the way over to the Point, except the Point. Pioneer Point was
bought as one pie, and Bill Barton, Bob Hughes, and Phyllis broke
it up, in the way that they broke it up. D.J. Fitzgerald owned
that. I found in the County Clerk's Office that his son, Daniel
Johnson, and the wife of his other son, George Johnson, still owned
that strip. I took a deed, this afternoon, from them. It took me
a little bit of time to sort it out and whatever, but this is the
strip that's there. It's the only way of mitigating anything I
co u 1 d t h ink 0 f . So, we' v ego n e 0 u t, and I' lis u bm ita cop y 0 f
this, we've got the strip behind it. That adds another 3.2 of the
acre to the pie. So, I can give you, and it's also in answer to
the question that somebody asked, do you have frontage on the road.
Glen Lake has got a history. We used to come in next to the house
on the gully, as you go across Country Club Road, and somebody shut
that off because it was a private road. We then used to come
through the Country Club, and then they shut that off and they
built Mannis Road coming in, directly at the end of Country Club
.- 47
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
Road. When they built Mannis Road to connect to us, the Town built
this road, because they were somehow involved in the shutting off
of the right-of-way, because what they did is they raised the grade
as you go across the Newton's, there, you go across that gully.
When they came in here to do it, the people on this end of the road
wouldn't let them take down some trees, and in those days, they
wen tar 0 un d them. So, the y , r e r 0 a din her e i s by pre s c rip t ion.
They never took a deed, never took title to it, and it never met
the back of the lots. So that's what created that. Specifically
what we are looking for is a 30 foot setback variance on this
piece right here, a 13 foot setback on that piece. If we add the
piece that's behind Lot D to Lot 0, we have .687 of an acre. We're
looking for a variance of .313. We have a lot width of 150. So we
meet the lot width. On Lot C, we're talking about a lot of .535.
We're looking for an area variance of .465. We have 125 feet.
We're looking for a 25 foot lot width variance. On Lot ß, we end
up with 7.45 of an acre, and that's a little convoluted, but all
you're doing is talking about the square foot density. This piece
will actually come out and come to the back of this corner here,
but it gets it closer to your acre, and we'd be talking about .255.
That has 130 feet width. We would need a variance of 20 feet width
on that lot. I can show you all the things where we tried to add
this to this piece here, why we tried to change this in here. If
you take a look at the frontage, the entire frontage of the lake on
that side, there isn't a lot as big as those. We're not impacting
it in any manner. We've also had Tom Nace look at the site, and he
says that we can put septics on there without any problem. Staff
raised the comment about runoff. I'm willing to stipulation, as a
condition to the approval, that any additions or new construction,
because there's currently a distinction within the Ordinance, be
subject to site plan review. So that we will show the Planning
Board that we do proper drainage, as well as proper septic. We
think that the applicant, trying to balance things, has come out
with a fairly decent proposal. The problem that we had before is
that we're segmenting it. We kept coming in with this, this, this.
You've got the full package.
MR. CARVIN-Any questions?
MR. FORD-This portion here, you say you ve gotten deeds to that, to
extend each of those properties out?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes.
MRS. LAPHA~-So they would come back more this way?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes, and when we go for site plan, we will show a site
plan map showing.
MR. MARTIN-Point being, you have frontage on the road?
MR. O'CONNOR-I have frontage on the road. In all honesty, from a
good planning sense, my question might be, if you think I'm window
dressing, I might appreciate the fact that you told me that this
one could go straight back. If you go up Fitzgerald Road, and you
start right at the corner of, Mannis comes in and the first right
is Fitzgerald Road. You notice all those funny fences and all
those driveways? See, when we built, there used to be a big ridge,
when those people built, there used to be a big ridge through
there, and the back of the property didn't go the same way the
front of the property went. People didn't draw straight lines back
to their road, but that minimizes our request for variance, and I
would state as part of the public record, in this particular thing,
we now have 420. We pai d $203, on the bas i s tha t we had thr ee
lots. This camp is not much of a camp. This thing here is now
going to go some place close to 550.
MRS. LAPHA~-All right. So this is going to be like this, and then
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
this line comes out, and somewhere like here?
MR. O'CONNOR-This line goes back to there, okay. This line will go
there, and that lines goes to there.
MRS. LAPHAM-And what's this line?
MR. O'CONNOR-That was just for me to know how much variance I was
requesting.
MRS. LAPHAM-I must be thick, Mike, but, one, two, three, four,
where?
MR. O'CONNOR-Okay. This is not ours. I thought, when I got this,
okay, I thought I could combine this somehow and make it a better
deal, but then I end up with more (lost word) because then I've got
two.
MRS. LAPHAM-I was going to say, you wouldn't want to do that, but
if you combine those two, or take something out of here. I don't
know. I t does get to be a conundr urn.
MR. O'CONNOR-I can't add anything and make any sense to it.
MRS. LAPH~~-Right, because this makes it economically unfeasible,
if you start doing that.
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes, and there's no other piece over there that's got
255 fee t 0 f fro n tag e . You t a k e a 1 00 kat the map t hat I h a v e
there, they're all, and the average lot size on Glen Lake, whether
we like it or don't like it, is probably 60 feet, if not 50 feet.
Basically, we're talking about area variances. We're talking about
what is the impact, and we're willing to prove that we will not
have any impact by runoff. It will not have any impact on septic.
I'd like to submit the accounting statements to show that I've got
$420,000 in that. I'd like this to be confidential.
MR. CARVIN-Well, it's confidential to the fact that you're on the
public record.
MR. O'CONNOR-Well, you have the right, I think, when you submit
things of a financial nature to, even on the public record, to ask
that they be, there's a different level 01 ability to look at them
if they're of financial nature.
MR. CARVIN-Well, we have a public tape here.
MR. O'CONNOR-Dr. Kristensen is here, if you've got a question of
him.
MR. CARVIN-I'm going to continue with the public hearing. Anyone
else wishing to be heard in support? Anyone opposed?
MR. O'CONNOR-One other corrU11ent, too. I did speak to Chris Mozel
who is the President of the Glen Lake Association, and I spoke to
Don Milne, who is Chairman of the Septic Committee and told them
what we were proposing, and they had no problem with what we were
proposing, based upon what they've seen, and the applicant knew as
other lands.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Any correspondence?
MR. THOMAS-No.
MR. CARVIN-Any other publ ic conmlent?
the public hearing is closed.
Seeing none, hearing none,
PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED
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(Queens bury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. CARVIN-All right. Any comments or questions on this, folks?
MR. MENTER-No. I pretty clearly understand what we're doing here.
I don't really have a problem, in terms of the specific lots. I
think, relative to the rest of the area, it's reasonable. How
large is your house, at this point?
MR. O'CONNOR-It's on the building deed, are you talking about?
MR. MENTER-Yes.
MR. O'CONNOR-Building deed, the existing is 1128 square feet, the
proposed is 1744 square feet.
MR. MARTIN-That's with a garage, Mike?
MR. O'CONNOR-That's with the garage.
DR. KRISTENSEN-The shed is a trade off. We're just removing 120
from the shed and we're adding 120 to the closet.
MR. MARTIN-What was it with the four car garage that was approved?
DR. KRISTENSEN-2700, with the four car garage.
MR. CARVIN-And we're going to?
MR. O'CONNOR-1744.
MR. CARVIN-Now the garage, compl iance, as far as height and all
that, is it 16, 18 feet from the garage?
MR. MARTIN-Just a single story garage.
CURT DYBAS
MR. DYBAS-Sixteen feet. For the record, my name is Curt Dybas.
The garage height, there's a small elevation BB on the site plan,
and the ridge height is 16 feet.
MR. O'CONNOR-Which is less than the other garage. The other
garage, if you remember, was 17 feet, and we had some stipulations
about not using the area above the car storage.
MR. CARVIN-As I remember that other garage, it had kind of a dormer
type of thing there with glass in it, if memory serves correct?
MR. DYBAS-It had an offset ridge.
MR. CARVIN-Something like that.
MR. THOMAS-It conforms to the same roof line of the building.
remember that.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. Okay. Any anticipated uses of Lot C or B, as far
as constructing houses?
DR. KRISTENSEN-Not at the moment.
MR. MARTIN-But you would stipulate to site plan review for?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes, we would.
DR. KRISTENSEN-That proposed garage on Lot B, which is not part of
this application.
MR. O'CONNOR-But we would go for site plan review for that, if you
want us to.
- 50 -
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. FORD-Can you show the drainage off the two car garage roof
line?
MR. CARVIN-He's got it right here, Tom.
MR. FORD-I see that.
just would like it described.
MR. MARTIN-You mean you haven't received site plan approval for
that four car garage? Did you ever go for that, for the addition
of a nonconforming structure?
MR. O'CONNOR-No. We never applied. I don't want to sidetrack from
the Board's question. After we got the four dar garage approval,
the Kristensens said, if they're going to make that investment,
they're going to change the lot line. We started a proposal for a
one story addition, and then Whetl they found out that the Maynard
property was going to be available, rather than try to live with an
addition upon an addition, which is basically what they're place
is, they said, why don't we try and handle the whole thing, and we
will vacate the Maynard property as soon as we can find that will
come to our property, and we will show you what we're doing.
MR. DYBAS-The garage, as you can see from the elevation BB, drains
from the simple gable. On the back side, on the upslope (lost
words) through there is very high perked soil, and we back-filled
with gravel and take the runoff on that side. The side facing the
lake is presently a drainage ditch, low area that receives the
water off the existing house roof and has that drywell noted, and
there's some question whether or not that drywell can handle it,
we'll no doubt gutter that roof on that side and drain it into
another drywell, and probably combine it with the roof off of the
closet. The plans are to tie that roof line with the existing
house.
MR. FORD-You anticipated my next questions.
MR. MARTIN-See, I think, as a practical matter, the more important
site plan would come, maybe with the addition to the exi9ting
house, in the form of the two car garage and the closet. The site
plan on that stand-alone garage, I don't know what we're really
going to accomplish. I mean, if you'll stipulate to some drainage
control there in the terms of eaves trenches or something of that
nature.
MR. O'CONNOR-I'm trying to answer Staff's comments. Part of when
we did this division and everything else, Al wanted to be sure that
he had sufficient area for septics and that they would work, and
that's why we had Tom Nace look at it, and we will do the same
thing with this drainage. We would stipulate whatever you want.
MR. MARTIN-I think it's a good idea on the site plan, if there was
an addition to the existing residence on Lot, is it B, and then
certainly for any development on Lot C. I mean, I could see where
that would be appropriate. The position of that new garage being
so far back, it's 24 by 36. What's the height on that, on that
particular garage?
MR. DYBAS-Sixteen feet. There's a small elevation sketch. We
tried to make it blend in with the existing aesthetics.
MR. MARTIN-I see it. Yes.
MR. CARVIN-Is that garage going to be for the Maynard residence, is
it? Is that the thinking?
MR. MART IN--No.
MR. CARVIN-They've got their own garage, don't they?
- 51 -
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. MARTIN-It's got an attached garage there.
MR. O'CONNOR-The Kristensens own the people's place next door to
them. In the middle of the winter, you may find some of the
Kristensens parents' cars up there. If you've been to the
property, you've seen the driveway, you may know why they have some
cars up there.
MR. CARVIN-Which is something that I think I addressed when we came
before.
MR. O'CONNOR-But I think that's permitted. The kids can park there
cars there in the winter.
MR. CARVIN-Well, the existing residence, I guess, is an existing
residence. So you're allowed a garage. It doesn't matter whether
the garage is bigger than the residence, but I think we've had a
bigger problem with just a garage on Lot C, with no existing
residence. I mean, that tends to be more of a problem. All right.
Any questions, Bill?
MR. GREEN-No. I think an awful lot of thought has gone into this,
and I oan't see any real advantage of splitting that lot, other
than I'm sure you're going to end up with a couple of lots that are
a little bit bigger, but I think that's just kind of overkill,
almost.
MR. CARVIN-How about you, Tom?
MR. FORD-Well, understand it. I don't really have any major
problem with it, but I haven't spent the hours that these people
have looking at alternatives. I've come up with one or two, but I
think this is probably the best package solution that we would see.
MR. CARVIN-Bonnie?
MRS. LAPHA~-I pretty much agree with Tom and Bill. I don't have a
real problem with it, plus the fact that it's obviously bigger than
what they started with, and a lot of thought has gone into this.
It just seems like it was better than what it was originally when
it was four different lots.
MR. CARVIN-Chris?
MR. THOMAS-I've been sitting here reading this Section 179-76(e),
about the Critical Environmental Area, that they're adjoining lots
treated as one lot, and that was thrown in in 1988.
MR. MARTIN-It would be at whatever time the Town filed with the
State for the Critical Environmental Areas. I think that came at
that time.
MR. THOMAS-It says here in Item A, it says, adoption October 1,
1988, Amendment to the Town Zoning Ordinance.
MR. MARTIN-I
You recall,
submitted?
think they did those, virtually, at the
Mike, when those Critical Environmental
I think it was right in that timeframe.
same
Areas
time.
were
MR. O'CONNOR-No. In honesty, I don't think the Glen Lake, when
that was put in the Zoning Ordinance, it was 1988.
MR. MARTIN-Yes, that was put in in '88, yes.
MR. O'CONNOR-And that's a technical question. I don't think Glen
Lake then was designated Critically Environmentally Sensitive at
the time that that was put in.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
MR. MARTIN-If it was, it was shortly,
'89 or so thereafter.
MR. O'CONNOR-I actually think it was '91, and I think the areas
that were actually Critically Environmental Sensitive in that area
were in here. So I don't, you've got an Ordinance in place that
says that if a certain thing is, this is what happens. If when
that Ordinance is there, does it apply to other areas later? And
I'm just taking from this thing, yes, it did, and that's why we're
here. I don't know if that answers your question.
MR. THOMAS-What I was thinking was, the Price property wasn't owned
by the Kristensens back then. So the lots weren't contiguous, but
they are now.
MR. O'CONNOR-Those are all owned by the two Prices, and
contradictory to not only Jim's letter, they got a letter from, the
Assessor has a program here that if you own contiguous parcels, you
can ask them to join them for tax purposes, but preserve your right
for zoning purposes, and I know that that was done after the re-
assessment, and probably after the '88 thing, and nothing was ever
said to the people.
MR. MARTIN-My only problem, and I've said this to the applicant,
with this joiner clause, is, I've talked to a couple of the Board
members on the phone today, is properties convey in and out of
ownership all the time, across this lakeshore, and we're not
apprised of it, and that's my only, because we're not, you know, a
part of that process. So this mayor may not happen, and we're
just not aware.
MR. CARVIN-Well, Jim, does this clear up a lot of the confusion out
there? I mean, is this a sensible plan? That's probably a leading
question. That's probably something that we should be asking
ourselves, not you, but, okay. Any other cOlmnents, Chris?
MR. THOMAS-No.
I'm set.
MR. CARVIN-Okay. Did I miss anybody? All right. I don't have a
problem with it. I mean, I think it makes probably the most sense.
I guess we have the power to do it, so lets do It, if somebody
wants to make a motion.
MR. O'CONNOR-Can I ask a question? Do you care, does it make it
better to tail behind Maynard with Lot A?
MR. CARVIN-Well, let me ask you this, Mike. Kristensen is buying
the Maynard lot. So, I mean, essentially it's going to end up, so,
personally, I think a straight line makes the most sense, instead
of creating another land.
MR. O'CONNOR-I would rather have it, and then also A has frontage
on the road.
MR. CARVIN-Yes. I think the straight line makes the most sense.
MR. O'CONNOR-Okay.
MR. CARVIN-So that adjusts it down some, does it?
MR. O'CONNOR-That means that
as I just said it would be.
out. Prior to that, Lot ß
acre.
Lot B is not going to be quite as big
I didn't have the surveyor break that
was, we needed relief of .255 of an
MR. MENTER-Okay. That's going to be something greater?
MR. O'CONNOR-Yes.
MR. MENTER-The relief.
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(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals 3/20/96)
MR. O'CONNOR-We'd
within two weeks,
acreage.
have the map amended and submitted to Staff
having the lines come back with the correct
MR. MENTER-So the relief would be?
MR. CARVIN-Yes. I think, caveat it, use approximately, with the
actual figures to be determined by survey, at some point, within
two weeks.
MR. MENTER-Okayw
I
MOTION TO APPROVE AREA VARIANCE NO. 17-1996 ALFRED E. & MARY E.
KRISTENSEN, Introduced by David Menter who moved for its adoption,
seconded by Thomas Ford:
The applicant proposes modifications of pre-existing lots partially
within a CEA. This action needs relief from the area requirements
of Section 179-16C, and the merger provisions of Section 179-76E.
Applicant also proposes to construct an addition to a pre-existing
structure which will require relief from the shoreline setbacks
outlined in Section 179-60(15)(c). The benefit to the applicant
w 0 u 1 d be p rima r i 1 y the uti 1 i z at ion 0 f pro per tie s t hat he has
purchased, a~ well as seeing a return on investment that he has
made in these properties. An overall benefit would be the
combining of two lots, turning four into three. Feasible
alternatives are limited. This appears to be the best solution to
the probl~n. The resulting lots are each greater in size than the
average lot in the area, and therefore would not, by virtue of
their size, have any negative impact on the area. With regard to
Section 179-60, the setback relief required for addition to an
existing residence on Parcel D, and the setback required for a
garage also on Parcel D, the 30 foot relief, I would grant 30 foot
relief for the construction of a closet onto the existing frame
residence. At 45 foot, this would be 15 feet further from the lake
than the closest corner of the bui~ding. Therefore, it would have
a minimal impact, and the garage would be granted 13 foot of
relief. At 62 feet, this would be substantially less than the
current 30 foot setback of the house also. No side setback relief
is required. With regard to the combining of parcels and the
merger provisions of Section 179-76E, we would grant relief to each
of these parcels, allowing them each to be treated individually for
zoning purposes, and with regard to Section 179-16C, area
requirements for parcels in this zone, the respectiv~ reliefs would
be granted. Parcel D would require relief of .31 acres, with the
understanding, in the case of each of these parcels, that the lot
line extend southerly, parallel and in the same line as the current
lot line to Fitzgerald Road. That would be true for Lots D, C, B,
as well as A. The resulting relief required and granted for each
of these lots would be, Lot D, .31 acres relief, and Lot C, .465
acres of relief, Lot B, approximately .3 acres of relief, of actual
relief to be determined by that required when the lot line between
Lot A and B is extended southerly to Fitzgerald Road. The granting
of these reliefs would appear to have no negative impact on the
neighborhood or the area, again, due to the fact that the resulting
lot size is considerably larger than the typical current lot size
in the area. I would require that any further development of Lots
Cor B, in terms of residences or primary structures, would require
site plan review to address runoff and other site plan issues. I
would also grant relief of Section 179-16C, lot width requirement,
for the following: Lot C, 25 feet of relief is granted for this
125 foot wide parcel, and Lot B, 20 feet of relief is granted on
this resulting 130 foot wide parcel. Another benefit to this plan
would be that the four lots involved would each have frontage on a
Town road, a condition which has not been in the past.
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
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-...
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...
(Queensbury Zoning Board of Appeals
3/20/96)
AYES: Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas, Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Green, Mr. Menter,
Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
MR. O'CONNOR-Thank you.
MR. CARVIN-We meet again tomorrow night, folks.
Executive Session.
I will go into
MOTION TOGO INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION TO DISCUSS ITEMS RELATED TO THE
MOORING POST, Introduced by Fred Carvin who moved for its adoption,
seconded by Chris Thomas:
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
AYES: Mrs. Lapham, Mr. Green, Mr. Menter, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas,
Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
MOTION TO COME OUT OF EXECUTIVE SESSION, Introduced by Fred Carvin
who moved for its adoption, seconded by Chris Thomas:
Duly adopted this 20th day of March, 1996, by the following vote:
AYES: Mr. Green, Mr. Menter, Mr. Ford, Mr. Thomas, Mrs. Lapham,
Mr. Carvin
NOES: NONE
ABSENT: Mr. Karpeles
On motion meeting was adjourned.
RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED,
Fred A. Carvin, Chairman
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