1992-11-04
SPECIAL TOWN BOARD MEETING
NOVEMBER 4, 1992
7:00 p.m.
MTG. #106
TOWN BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT
Supervisor Michel Brandt
Councilman Betty Monahan
Councilman Susan Goetz
Councilman Nick Caimano
Councilman Pliney Tucker
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE LED BY SUPERVISOR BRANDT
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Opened the Meeting-
PUBLIC HEARING 1993 BUDGET NOTICE SHOWN
Mr. CHARLES ADAMSON-I am Charlie Adamson from North Queensbury, this is just unfinished
business. About a week to ten days ago I asked you all what would happen if the Library Dist. went
through you all agreed that you would take Two Thousand, Two hundred and Twenty one Thousand One
Hundred Dollars out of this budget and go on from there.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That is correct. Two hundred and twenty thousand dollars.
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON-Oh, I am sorry, the pay is 44?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That is composed of two items. There is the Two hundred and twenty thousand
is the one for the Crandall Library...ok
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON-I miss read it, ok, the figures are very small for my...
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-And so that should come out both as an expenditure and as a revenue and it
shows up in taxes so, Two hundred and twenty thousand dollars should be eliminated from both lines in the
final budget and that is what we all pledged that we would do. I do not know that we have to do that as a
motion or what we do.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Normally, Mike, we wait, you know we listen to everybody and then we
take a few days to finalize this before you finalize the adopted and then we go through it line by line and
change every item as we adopt the budget.
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON -Yea, but you are not going to change this you are just going to take it out and
then...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-We still have to do a line item change, you have got to do it legally.
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON-Oh, why?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-So, where you see, two hundred and twenty one, one zero zero that line will
become and we will go back to our big budgets to get the right number for it and it will become One One
00 and Charlie that is for the library up by you there, Mountainside Library.
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON-That is well worth it, if you want to double that, that is fine.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That is for that library there.
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON-But you are all going to promise to do that right?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Absolutely.
MR. CHARLES ADAMSON-All right, that is my question for the moment, thank you.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I think that results in a decrease in the tax rate by $18.95 my calculation. But,
the library district tax as I calculate it should be twenty four forty four something like that.
MR. DOUG PERSONS-I am Doug Persons I live on Stephanie Lane. I am here both as a taxpayer and as a
President for the Union. Number 1 you know there was really not enough time to analyze this, it was not
available until Monday. Yesterday was a holiday for the people that I deal with and it would be impossible
to have this budget analyzed for tonight. But, I was, I am sure that some of you are going to think that I a
border line idiot when it comes to the finances here because I am not that keen. I have a few questions.
You had the adopted budget as of November 24th 1991 for 1992 but then when you get into this, this book
here the current budget all of the numbers are different, normally they are lower. What happens to this
money from the adopted budget, November 24th of 1991 and what shows as the current budget? These
totals.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-The adopted budget of91 is for the year 1992. That is our current working
budget. That budget runs out the end of December and we start a new budget which is the one that we are
looking at here for 1993.
MR. DOUG PERSON-Why are these totals different from the adopted and the current?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Because we are adopting it, we are in the process of adopting a new budget.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-He meant last years numbers.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, I think he is talking about as we do transfers it changes those numbers
the adopted budget number changes as we make transfers between funds.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-You are looking in here, all right I follow you. As we operate we amend the
budget and we delete and very often we delete amounts of money that are not being spent or that we do not
intend to spend or we add money, we transfer money to different areas and every time we do that, that is an
amendment to the budget. So, the budget keeps changing every time we make one of those amendments
and we make one almost every week.
MR. PERSONS-Where do you get this information, you know
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-At the meetings
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-At every public meeting we do this in public and then the budget is changed by
the accounting department as all those changes occur.
MR. PERSONS-Under the general budget your current budget amount was Six million twenty three
thousand and twelve dollars the actual date, to date is Three million seven hundred four thousand, seven
hundred and forty three dollars and ten cents. Does that mean that there is a surplus of two million three
hundred and eighteen thousand two hundred and sixtyeight dollars here?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-As of whatever date you were looking at.
MR. PERSONS-That's under the proposed, that is your figures, under this proposed budget.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-What number did you read?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Your reading actually to date.
MR. PERSONS-Right.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Actual to date is as of a certain date and I think that was a September figure.
MR. PERSONS-Well it says, 30 October.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I'm not sure, well I don't know if those are, but if perhaps it was 30 October. I'd
have to ask the Accounting Department how current those are.
MR. PERSONS-But that shows a surplus of over 2 million, I mean can that be right?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -No.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-What number are you reading? Just tell me what number you are reading
again, I didn't hear the number you read.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Doug, when you find it, will you give us the page number, please?
MR. PERSONS-Sixty-nine, is that right?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Page number 69?
MR. PERSONS-Yes.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Okay, and what number were you talking about?
MR. PERSONS-At the end of the job total.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-At the end of the job total, under proposed?
MR. PERSONS-No, the current budget says, $6,023,012.00 and the actual to date is $3,704,743.10. So
wouldn't that reflect the budget, the surplus?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-No because the year is not over yet. That budget, that number will still be
that same number come the end of 1992 and we will have added to that, what we actually spent to date.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Plus you also have encumbrances. Some times money is set aside for purchase
orders that have been made that hasn't been spent yet and so that will show on a different line. We also,
and your welcome to have a copy of it, we do make at the end of every month a projection of where are
finances would come out at the end of the year if everything stays at the same level that it's staying, the
spending level. Certain assumptions are made there and I can tell you the general fund budget or the
projected fund balance at year end, is projected at a million-three but it probably will be a little less than
that.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-To answer your question specifically, where you see that 6,028,012.00, a
year ago at this time, or somewhere around that time, that's what they determined the expense budget would
be for, in this case, the total. The next colunm over, actual to date, even know the date is October 30th, the
chances are these are actual expenditures to date, no better than through September. In many cases, it
might even be through August because it hasn't caught up, we simply haven't paid the bills. So that
3,704,743.00 would have to be divided by 9 and multiplied by 12 in order to get an annual figure and I'll do
that for you if you want me to. Annualized, that's about 4,939,000.00 but we don't know anything about the
encumbrances either. We have, those are, that's cash outlay and not encumbrances.
MR. PERSONS-Another thing that really stood out.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Let me, can I point something out to you?
MR. PERSONS-Yes, sure.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Of that 6 million current budget for 1992, there was a 1/2 million dollars in that
budget but there was no source of revenue to cover that 1/2 million dollars.
MR. PERSONS-Okay.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Okay, so subtract a 1/2 million bucks right off of that figure right a way to get
the current budget that we operated under in 1992.
MR. PERSONS-Okay, another thing that, gee, I've got so many figures here, this is terrible. That your
revenues, you estimated revenues, the projections are, what almost, 2 million is it, less than the previous
year? Is that right?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes, I think you'll find most of that to be in the landfill. When the budget, 1991
was made for the landfill, there were certain assumptions made that didn't work out at all and it was
estimated that the revenues in the landfill would be 2,253,000 and that's just not working out at all. It's a lot
closer to $500,000.00, so there's some major changes there.
MR. PERSONS-I also ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Excuse me Doug, a lot of that was because the bum plant came on line
much earlier than had been anticipated when the 1992 budget was done. We had been given a target date
for the bum plant, in the mean time we were acting as a consolidated landfill for the County and what
happen was, the burn plant came on line so it reduced the volume of garbage going into to our landfill and
into Luzeme Road. So that was why that figure was so out of wack.
MR. PERSONS-Yes, I notice that the, in the landfill that the difference between the current budget and the
actual to date is, there's over a million dollars difference there.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Another thing too, in the sales tax revenue, you've only got three quarters
that show here, because the fourth quarter we will get in January and then it will be accrued back into the
1992, so you don't have that figure in there either and that's quite a substantial amount.
MR. PERSONS-Then your better off than I think?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We'd be glad to share other figures with you.
MR. PERSONS-Like I say, I am no expert, this is strictly off the cuff for me. Now, you know, personally,
you are taking the $221,000.00 because of the library district thing and your applying it to the taxes right,
and you said there was net, there would be a net gain I suppose of 4 cents, I think that's what I read in
today's paper, 4 cents per assessed thousand dollars of evaluation or something like that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I think it's 5 1/2 cents, is what I calculate but it's about that.
MR. PERSONS-You know, personally, probably my net wages compared to the taxes that I pay, the ration
of taxes to my net is much higher than a lot of people and I'm not complaining but I would just as soon see
that money put back for the personnel purposes, myself and that brings me to the last point. I understand
that, according to the paper there are 14 layoffs scheduled. The best that I can do and like I say, I'm no
genius, I can come up with 12 that were listed in the paper. Are there 2 others, someplace or are you
including people that have already left? I know one at least that has left from the Highway Department.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-There are some people that left and I'd have to go through the whole list and I'm
not sure but there are people that have left employment because they knew that they were not in the budget
and they found other work and they left to take other work. So whether they are listed or not, they're in the
current budget but they aren't in next year's budget. But they've already left.
MR. PERSONS-I know of three, there maybe more. Is this, that was your assistant clerk?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yes.
MR. PERSONS-Betty Eggleston's daughter, right plus one highway person.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-The highway person was replaced so I think there's only 2 probably, that I know
of or that I can think of right now.
MR. PERSONS-Okay. When I got up Saturday and I saw the headlines on the paper, I was kind of in
disbelief of what I was seeing. If you'll remember, about 4 months ago, the rumor mill was running over
time, in fact it started as soon as you took over and I came to you and I asked you about the rumor of
layoffs. You told me, Doug don't worry about it, it's not the rank and file, we are going to do this from the
top. Now, I pick up the paper Saturday morning and I see the headlines. I mean, I paced back and forth,
mumbling, whatnot until my wife told me get out and do something in the yard because I was getting on
her nerves and Mr. Caimano made the remark that when he was talking about the layoffs, he said that's the
downside of it, the big downside of it but it also reflects the mandate from the taxpayers. I don't, I was out
and about a year ago running for an office too and I don't remember a mandate saying that you balance the
budget on the backs of employees. I know that there was a lot of discussion of cutting government cost but
I don't think that it was meant by the taxpayers to be done by employees. It almost seems like there was a
number of $400,000.00 banded about, and they say, well this equals 14 employees, let's do it. Do you
know these employees? Are you familiar with them? Do you know that one of them has been here for 17
years? He's sixty years old and he's scheduled. Do you think that the taxpayers wanted that? I don't and I
think you should really sit back and consider, reconsider these cuts.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I think, to give you an answer there, we have, we first of all, are working on a
budget and we first of all tried to look at what jobs could be eliminated. It's, as to that particular job that
you're talking about, that came to my attention today also, I think that's something we can look at carefully.
We did not look at, individuals when we did this. We looked at, trying to find a balance and we did cut a
lot more than personnel. I don't know the exact figure of what's cut in personnel. It's considerable though,
it's probably close to a 1/2 million dollars but there are major cuts other than that. It gets to a point when
you cut that, at some point, you have to cut jobs and that's not very nice but on the other hand, we've run
out of funds here. The previous budgets used a lot of surplus money to balance the budget. We don't have
a lot of surplus money to balance the budget anymore. The previous budget didn't provide all of the
revenues that it seemed, they really weren't there. We have to, we can't spend phantom money so it's a
tough budget and it's tough to cut jobs, there's no question of that and it effects who ever it is, whether
they're 25 years old or 65 years old, they're without a job, they're terminated. I think many of us have gone
through that at one time or another and it's a very, very degrading, difficult thing to go through.
MR. PERSONS-So, was this done on the advice of department heads as to were they called in and
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-All department heads, were, we discussed it, nobody said well lets cut jobs, lets
get rid of people. In fact the fight was constantly, how can we save jobs. It got down to you got so much
income and are you going to raise taxes significantly or aren't you and the choice was made in presenting
this budget to not raise taxes.
MR. PERSONS-There is no way that you can take the $221,000 dollars and dip if you will, unless you can
find other ways the budget to come up with the $400,000, you know I think that people are behind you
when you made the campaign promise to cut government, that is obviously why you are here. But, to do it
all in one year, I think is a little excessive. I am sure that under your management this surplus fund will
certainly grow and I would rather see these jobs looked at again, these employees because they
are...employees. I know of one who is getting laid off he worked two days with a broken finger before he
went to comp., then there was more after that, but I will not get into that. Also, no matter if you cut
employees you are going to cut services and there is no two ways about that and Mr. Naylor said that he
has 170 miles of road he normally paves 14 miles a year he is going to cut that back to 7, you are
automatically cutting services and if you think about that, if you start at point A and you pave the 7 miles a
year, it is going to be 25 years before you get back to point A again and they just aren't going to hold up. I
think that this really has to be looked at again and looked hard. When is this budget going to be voted on?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-By the 20th of November.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We have to adopt iLyou should know something for, so there is not miss
information about paving. We cut 2 miles of paving in this budget, it is one of the places where we
increased monies from the general fund to the Highway Dept. That is we increased it from the budget that
I proposed to the budget that is being brought to you by this town board. The big cut in paving is 5.2 miles
cut by the state budget. The state allocates normally $130,000 a year to this town for paving they totally
eliminated that.
MR. PERSONS-That is through Chips.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That is right.
MR. PERSONS-I want you to know that I had a conversation today with a person in Albany and the Chips
has not be abandoned. There is going to be money there, there is going to be a cut but there will be funds
through chips.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well, I mean if the public pays taxes every time they buy a gallon of gasoline,
state taxes for roads and that money should be coming back for roads. Not all of it is.
MR. PERSONS-I agree.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We don't control that and the people ought to raise a little hell about that, it's
their money and it's effecting their roads and in this case it's five miles of roads in this Town next year. If
that comes back in through the State Budget, then it will be added to our budget and it will turn into
payment.
MR. PERSONS-But you won't know this until April, right?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-No and we can't legally budget something that has been eliminated by the State
at this point and it has been eliminated. If they want to, if they've got the political will to put money back
in roads, I'd be delighted.
MR. PERSONS-You point me in the direction of raising a little hell and I'll do it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well we all need to.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Doug, according to Paul's figures, he figures in material alone, not men or
equipment, material alone it costs us, it cost him 25,000 dollars per mile. So 14 miles that we were doing
in materials alone is 350,000 dollars and that's why the 130,000 dollars that we're losing is a very, very
important component of that figure. We have taken some out of the other monies of the Town to make up
part of the CHIPS, but it's a little hard to make it all up.
MR. PERSONS-You know I'm not faulting Paul Naylor by any means.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, I know and I didn't mean that, that was just an explanation of the
figures that we were working with.
MR. PERSONS-So anyway, I would appreciate it if you would take a another hard look and see if you can't
save some of these jobs anyway. They're going to be, your going to be paying them unemployment.
Possibly, well no, the County will be paying them welfare but it all comes back and I think it's worth taking
another look at. I would appreciate it if you did. Will there be another chance, not for me because I'll let
somebody do that knows what they're doing to speak on the budget again before it's adopted?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We'll certainly make any chance, anybody wants.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I would say every regular meeting, you know, they could have a time.
Since these got out so late to people, Mike, I think we make a time maybe early in the evening, not at open
forum but early in the evening for any comments on the budget because these did get out terribly, terribly
late.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's fine with me, sure.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes we can do that. We want input. You say your not an expert on the budget,
none of us are either. We've done our very best to try and put a budget together to not raise taxes. If
people want taxes raised, we can raise them, that's pretty easy to do. It's pretty tough to cut spending to
avoid those raises and that's what we've taken on here. One thing you said is that it's a balanced budget,
we'll accumulate surpluses, that may not be correct. We're still using a 1/2 million dollars of surplus to
balance this budget, about 456,000 dollars. Now we may have underestimated revenues but I don't think
drastically. This year our revenues are coming in very close to what was budgeted and we're not cutting are
estimate of revenues. Can we cut expenses as we go? Possibly, we can and maybe we won't use 456,000
of fund balance to balance the budget. But if we use any of it, we'll be decreasing fund balances, not
increasing them. We've got another problem that we haven't solved yet and that's at our landfill. Our
landfill in this budget shows a break even operation. We're not running a break even operation, we're
losing money in the landfill, quite a bit of it. There's a technical discussion as in the accounting part of it
and how it should be done, but it's close to 200,000 dollars a year that we are losing. But we have to find a
revenue stream there to stop that loss, otherwise we're even further out of balance. So those are things that
we have to address yet and we're not on a down hill slide here to have a balanced budget. We've got to
start, we know what we've got to get done and we still got to be very careful in spending or we're not going
to make it.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Doug, see during the years when the economy was booming, usually our
sales tax came in much higher than projected and that's how we were able to accumulate a lot of surplus in
prior years. But in the last couple of years with the economy flat, that's sales tax is coming in just about
where it's projected. In fact, it gets a little touchy sometimes, you know, will it come in and that's one thing
that's happened. The other thing, a few of the jobs were cut because the growth of the Town is not there
now and the amount of work that has to be done inside of the building, administration type of thing, is not
as great as it used to be when a lot of new things were happening, big, bang, boom. Not the jobs that you're
talking about but some, a few of the jobs because the Town is not growing and was over staffed for what
the volume of work is flowing through here in the administration offices of this Town. But that's not the
jobs that you were referring to, I realize.
MR. PERSONS-While you mention it, the landfill, there was some discussion, I believe some time back
about accepting ash at the landfill if you got the okay from DEC. Did that ever happen?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We're looking at it. First, there's a whole bunch of questions. One, can we
legally do it? That means you have to have a consent order with, including ENCON. We haven't made an
application. Secondly, can we make a reasonable deal with the two counties that really are operating that
facility? But more important than anything, is it safe to do? We're only getting data on that now, we're
starting to get data that's meaningful data and we have to look at that. Whenever you take anything into
your landfill, there are certain hazards and I have to tell you something else that we're not addressing yet in
these budgets. We have to close that landfill because every day it rains, water goes through it and adds
nutrients of some kinds that we don't want into the ground water. So there's, we need to get a budget and a
target date to close that landfill. We need to seal it so water quits percolating through it and those are big,
big questions and sealing that landfill is a multi, multi million dollar task and we don't have the money for
that. That's one we have to face and it's a tough one. So, ash, yes we're looking at it. We're looking at
every alternative we have but we have to be realistic about it. We're not going to do something that we
don't believe is safe or right for the Town. So that's a big balancing act, it's a matter of getting all of the
data and we're trying to do that and we'll keep you, certainly have to keep the public informed of what
we're doing there.
MR. PERSONS-Okay, I appreciate your time and patience. Thank you.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Thank you. Anyone else?
JOHN SALVADORE-John Salvador. Mike you mention the fact that we've been operating the landfill at a
200,000 dollars a year deficit.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's about right.
MR. SALVADOR-And you've prepared this budget based on running no deficit next year.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -That's right.
MR. SALVADOR-How can you do that? What's going to change between now and December 31st of next
year whereby we can realize 200,000 dollars?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We're going to have to find other sources of waste stream. We're talking to the
other Towns to get construction and demolition debris. We're looking at potentially taking material from
paper mills. We're looking at the ash from the burn plant to see if that can be handled correctly. We're
looking at every possibility to find 200,000 dollars worth of material in a years time to balance the budget, I
think is realistic. I think, but we have to do more than that because we've got to gain money to close that
landfill.
MR. SALVADOR - Well isn't the way to do it, put some kind of a figure on each one of those possibilities
and some kind of a probability factor so that you can determine whether or not your going to cover the 200.
Just wishful thinking isn't going to do it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well it's not going to be wishful thinking but to put probabilities on these things,
there all negotiations. There, you know, I'm not into probabilities. If somebody knows how to do that, God
Bless him, come forward and tell us how but I don't know how to do that. All I can identify is that there's a
shortfall and we have to target a program to get that money in and we're working on it.
MR. SALV ADOR-Welllet's take one of them. Ash from the bum plant. If we were to take the ash from
the bum plant, what would it be worth to us?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We don't know that totally yet but we are working on that. We hired an
engineer to help us do the calculations. What do we have to build to accommodate ash in a safe way?
MR. SALVADOR-But Mike, if you don't know what it's worth to you, why do you even consider it?
You've got to have some, some number is better that no number, is what I'm saying. What happens if you
don't come up with the 200,000?
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Then we'll be in a hole, like we are this year.
MR. SAL V ADOR-Oh.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Then it has to come out of surplus, if that's the case.
MR. SALVADOR-You say you don't have any.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Well there's some.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We said we have, we're projecting that at the year end, we'll have about a
1)00,000, a 1,200,000 total surplus.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-And obviously the other way, as you well know John from running your
business, the other way to work on the equation is on the expense side. There's not an awful lot, save of
probabilities, that you can do about the income side. You can, in your own business hope and pray and
send out all kinds of flyers and do all kinds of expense to draw people in, but if they don't come, there's not
much you can do about that. What you can do something about, is the other side of the equation, those
things you spend money on.
MR. SALVADOR-But I can stop my losses.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Oh yes.
MR. SALVADOR-Okay, alright. What thinking have you taken toward sales tax? What have you
assumed for sale tax revenue?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I think we ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I think it was three million, nine hundred.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes, I think it's the same as this year.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It's been left the same, yes three million, nine hundred thousand.
MR. SALVADOR-The same or how does it compare with?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -It's the same and we're just, we might make that, we might make a little bit more
than that this year but not much more.
MR. SALVADOR-You think it's on the conservative side?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Yes.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes, a little bit.
MR. SALVADOR-How does the County's talk about raising taxes impact us as taxpayers in relation to this
budget?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I think what I saw of the County budget in Queensbury, the tax rate goes up two
percent or three percent or there abouts. That's what I, again I read that in the newspaper, or calculated
from something I read in the newspaper. I don't have first hand information on that.
MR. SALVADOR-Okay, with regard to the Highway fund, how can I tell from this budget, if a particular
road in the Town is going to be serviced by the Highway Department?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Serviced how? Paved you mean?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-You can't.
MR. SALVADOR-Anything. Plow it, pave it, signage, lighting, improve it, whatever it needs.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-You have to talk to the king of highways, Mr. Naylor, he's here. You know,
they make their budget and I'm not sure that they always know exactly what piece of road they're going to
pave. Normally, you look at roads in the Spring and you look at what's in the worst shape and then we take
the tour with the Town Board and Paul, he makes a suggestion of what to pave and we either approve it or
argue with him and change it.
MR. SALVADOR-But you don't know that when you prepare this budget?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -No, you don't.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-You just figure miles per road will be paved. You know you've got to plow
all the Town roads, so that's a given.
MR. SAL V ADOR- Well there's some, there's some way of past history, experience, these are the things you
use, I'm sure when you do that.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes, you'll find that you budget, your highway budget is broken into two
parts, what they call the Summer and the Winter budget. One is for paving and one is for your plowing
budget.
MR. SALVADOR-Where is, which, I don't see that. I've got one page here, is it 41G?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Your numbers that are 5110 are your summer budget, you have the code
numbers still in this one, don't you? My page is, I cannot tell you what your page is going to be in this, you
just have to look for your code numbers.
MR. SALVADORE-Specifically, Mr. Naylor do you have anything in this budget for the so called
Dunhams Bay Road?
MR. NAYLOR-Do, I?
MR. SAL V ADORE-Yes. Do you plan to do any work? Do you plan to expend any money on it?
MR. NAYLOR-No.
MR. SAL V ADORE-You do not have any plan for that. There is not a penny in here. Should there be?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I do not know, my God we certainly didn't research that in preparing this budget,
I didn't.
MR. SAL V ADORE-If you do not know the scope of work you cannot come up with a budget.
SUPERVISOR BRANDt-No, that's not true. We know how many dollars you can put into paving and you
put it into paving and which roads we choose to pave can be worked out later.
MR. SAL V ADORE-Thank you.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Part of that is how they got through the winter also.
MR. JOHN PULNICK-My name is John Pulnick and I am here to speak on behalf of the Chapman
Museum. A very small part of the big picture and certainly it does not have the gravity that the previous
speakers have spoken about, but a very important part of Queensbury. First I would like to thank you for
your past support, it has been very generous and very appreciated, has really helped the museum continue
its growth. I think most people who know the museum know that it has come a long way in the past five
years and its through a lot of hard work with volunteers, community volunteers and support of
governments, particularly Queensbury. I would like to applaud the recommendation for the level that the
Chapman's been the allocation that has been recommended. It's crucial, it is a very small part of your
budget but it is crucial to the Chapman's budget. It is not just a contribution, it really is an investment from
your perspective. Queensbury, the Chapman does serve Queensbury very well, as matter of fact dis-
proportionately. Our institutional boundaries you may know are Warren and Washington County and
Northern Saratoga County but we are dis-proportionately represent Queensbury. We have twenty one
board members, ten of those board members reside in Queensbury. We have six hundred and twenty
members and two hundred and twenty of those members live in Queensbury. over a third of our
membership. We have been hit very hard I am listening to these people speak and it is a tough time
everywhere. We have been hit very hard by government support being withdrawn from us, in 1988 New
York State provided over 16% of our budget, now it is less than 1 %. Two years ago, last year I stood here
and said last year we got 17,000 dollars from New York State next year we are going to be $2,200. the
same proportion is being done with other municipalities. I really encourage you to support the Chapman
Museum the way its written in the budget. Other things that we do that effect Queensbury directly, we are
the only organization that's protecting and preserving our cultural heritage our material culture. In the
greater scheme of things that may not sound like a lot as we are talking jobs but it is a non-renewable
resource. When these things are gone, the things that we are collecting and preserving, they're gone for
good. The support needs to be there. On a more materialistic basis, the Chapman is a destination for day-
trippers, it's also a destination for tour bus operators. We've gotten a number of tours in these tough times,
this tough year, a number of tours from New England and from down State at the Chapman, as part of their
itinerary for the day. I won't take up too much more of your time but it's not just an investment in the past,
it's an investment in the future. We had 4,000 school children and 1/4th of those school children are from
Queensbury. Until now, that's all been free services. We have a number of programs we've expanded this
year, we put up over 15 exhibits and over 40 programs free of charge, not fund raising programs. We're
trying to do more with less, your trying to do more with less. We really need the support from Queensbury
to continue what we're doing. Thank you. Any questions?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Thank you. Anyone else who would like to address us?
LILLIAN ADAMSON-I'm Lillian Adamson from Assembly Point, Lake George. I've come before the
Board in earlier years. I don't think since you've been here Mike, about the fire department and I know we
all appreciate the volunteer hours that are put in by our firemen and our rescue squads and so forth. But I'm
a little curious about the budget this year. It has a request for a 1,571,613.00 dollars, it's on page 3 but it's
page 3, way back in, it's 005 is the fund. The amount proposed is considerably more than the amount
requested and I kind of wondered why you want to give them a 1,933,000 if the amount requested is a
1,571,000.00. Back in 1987 or there abouts, the budget for the fire departments in the Town was a million
dollars. Then when we had the 1987 reassessment and the lake area was paying a very high a proportion of
the taxes in the Town of Queensbury. Suddenly, your predecessor decided it would be very nice to let all
the fire departments build new fire houses because you had somebody who was going to do a considerable
amount of paying for them and the budget jumped from 1 million dollars to 2 million dollars and we're still
up there. So, that's my first question is, why this increase?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I think probably there was an error in the requested budget. First of all, there are
five fire companies and four of them have contracts that are still running next year. Those contracts have
been negotiated in the past and there is an agreed upon amount and they are still fixed the only one that isn't
is North Queensbury. What was requested in the five fire companies is a million five fifty one and what's
proposed is a million five zero one. Actually, the five fifty one had a hundred thousand dollars that was put
in for North Queensbury as an addition to their budget. I did that and I said to everybody that is was in
there, but it had to be scrutinize. What this board did was drop that by fifty thousand so what you really
have are all the contracts as they exist plus North Queensbury as it was last year plus fifty thousand dollars.
The difference that your finding, I think is emergency medical services and for some reason that was not
carried. It's three hundred, forty five thousand dollars that probably should have gone into the requested
budget, it didn't and that's probably my error, but it was caught and put into this budget. There again, those
are contracts we have with those people and they'll be re-negotiated in the future as they come due, but
most of them come due, what negotiations start at the end or in next year as I remember it.
MRS. ADAMSON-Do you have a watchdog on that? I remember when Dr. Eisenhardt was here that was
one of the things he did. Do you have somebody now that kind of keeps track of what's going on because
this is an enormous amount? When, I tell you that the budget went from a million to two million when the
re-assessments came along our taxes for the fire department went from fifty dollars to five hundred dollars.
The Queensbury budget sometimes doesn't look like too much the fire tax goes on top of that that's a whole
separate item and we're talking big money when we talk about this. Part of the problem in North
Queensbury and on the assessments is the fact that the house plays a very small part of that. Yet you can
have a mansion in the rest of Queensbury that's three hundred thousand and the whole mansion is worth the
three hundred thousand. But we'll have a little tiny camp that's one quarter the size and it's paying the same
fire department tax because we cannot break out the value of the house from the land apparently that's
something that cannot be done. Now, a small grip and I don't want to take up your time with this. I really
would like somebody keeping a kind of a closer track of what your allowing the fire department to have. I
came before you and complained one time when, I discovered that they have lawn services down here in
the one that's on the road that goes by Moore's. I was a little perturb that they were putting the spray
fertilizer on the ground and it perturb's me to know that along with paying for fire department buildings and
very elaborate fire trucks that I am told are not necessary, the fire trucks are necessary, the elaborate
equipment that sometimes is on them is sometimes on them is not all that necessary. I think that the
buildings are and the furnishings these days are quite luxurious, certainly I can't afford to have in my home
some of the things that I'm seeing in the fire department and rescue squad buildings maybe those are
supplied by contributions, I'm not aware. But as a taxpayer, I really don't like to have to pay for a lawn
grooming service that I can't afford to have come to my home, but yet the fire departments do.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Lillian, you should not be paying for it because the law says that only those
services that are fire related may come from the town monies. That should be being done by money being
raised some other way.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Let me answer your question Mrs. Adamson. That's the fact that Mr. Tucker
and I meet regularly with the heads of each of the emergency service and fire groups. I can tell you that
they also are concerned about what's happened in terms ofPR. One of the things for example is have these
meetings, regular town board meetings at the fire stations or the MS station so that some of the innuendos
and rumors can be laid to rest because they are just that innuendos and rumors which we found out
ourselves by asking the question. I can tell you that the heads of each of these fire companies are
concerned now, very much concerned about the money they spend. They want to do two things, they want
to protect each of us and they want to do it in the best way possible, but they want to do it in the best way
economically possible too. To answer your question there is a watchdog committee and part of it is
themselves in their renewed interest in doing the best they can economically for all of us.
MRS. ADAMSON-Is it possible to get a breakdown of what's going, you have contracts with all of them is
it possible for me to get a copy of how much each of these fire departments is getting?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That's public information.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Sure, that's public information.
MRS. ADAMSON-I kind oflike to know.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Lillian, there are a couple of other things I'd like to point out. The EMS
service the amount did go down because of the way the contracts were written. The contracts for this
coming year the amount is $336,800 verses $345,000 last year. Also, there is an item in here now and you
remember we had a public referendum on it and it passed for the fireman service award program.
MRS. ADAMSON-I understand that.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-So, right now we have a figure of $90,000 in here. This year so far the
expenditure has been $87,661.95 and the consultant that keeps track of these awards and how much will go
into each account is meeting with us, I believe next week Mike?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yes.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That figure will be updated. This $90,000 may have to change a little bit up
or down, we don't know that yet.
MRS. ADAMSON-I want it understood, I don't begrudge these people.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I know what your saying.
MRS. ADAMSON-I know what a hard job they have and I know how hard they have to work to maintain
all their creditation and everything. Charlie and I, did it for a few years and I have a great deal of respect.
It's beyond my capability to do that kind of thing so, I certainly appreciate it. It's just that I'm getting very
worried these days about the luxury.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Are we going cadillac or are we going ford.
MRS. ADAMSON-Right. Thank you for your time.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Okay. Someone else, come on right up.
FRED CHAMP AGNE-343 Juniper Drive, Queensbury. I have, first of all a couple of questions and
certainly some concerns and then what I'd like to do is hold class here tonight on how to interpret this. It is
a bit confusing and I think as I talk to my friend, Jack Cushing back there we still have difficulties if you
will even on page one. Could you do me a favor and take a look at page one of the general fund and define
for me what you understand to be actual prior to, would somebody do that for me? What does that mean to
a non-intelligent semi-nonbudget person?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well, maybe we all qualify for that. Let me tell you the printout your seeing is
the same one we get. There is a change in computerization here in the town and certain data is in the
computer and certain data isn't. Prior one, means the prior year which is 1991, I guess. Prior to, should be
two years ago. Well, obviously prior to isn't in the computer in many cases.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-I'm looking at the year 1990, under prior to.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -For the most part it's not in the computer. Prior one, isn't always in the
computer either so we struggle along the best we can with this also.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-So 92, would be the current budget, I guess I would read it that way?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's correct.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Actual to date, I understand that. Now, requested proposed could you tell me the
difference between those two?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Requested is the Supervisor's budget. Proposed is what you have today. The
town board it's called proposed and it may legally be called preliminary, but on this printout and this
computer it's called proposed. It is the Town Board's budget that you have in front of you.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-So the reconciliation then leaves out the requested, can we omit the requested and just
go with the proposed? Is that what I heard you say?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-The hearing is on the proposed figures.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Okay, that's good.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-There is one other thing Fred, too. Sometimes prior one, 1991 will be a
zero because account numbers have changed and you might see that someplace else in the budget instead of
here. Audit and Control has a habit of changing numbers every once and a while.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Page 3, general fund category 0001, supervisor. Could you tell me who's included in
the proposed $80,275.00? I don't want to get into personnel matters here, but could you tell me just the
titles that would be in the $80,000.00?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I think it's the Supervisor and the Confidential Secretary.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It's the Supervisor, Town Deputy Supervisor, Confidential Secretary the
Administrative Assistant was in there that's the personnel and the rest are other expenses. Would you like
me to read the type of expenses?
MR. CHAMPAGNE-I like to go to Budget Officer, page 7, 1340. Can, I ask who's included in there?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's the Supervisor.
MR. CHAMP AGNE- Thank you. Maybe you can help me, again on page 9, the general fund. Assessor at
department 1355, that is. I know that we have a current budget of $273,000 with a propose budget of
$186,000. As, I look down through there, I see certainly a personnel cut and then we go to contractual.
Could someone explain to me the contractual piece that's coming out of that one?
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Reval.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Pardon.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-A reval of the Town.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We're contracting for work in that reval and some of it gets finished and some of
it doesn't some of it's carried over into next year.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-There are some other services that are in that also besides the revalve in that
figure.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Page, 15 of the Building and Grounds Department, 1620. It would be my
understanding that the current budget of $294,000 cut to $184,000, that's a hundred thousand dollars almost
a third that's personnel. We're taking one third of our building and maintenance folks can we make that
assumption?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Your looking at the first line?
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Yes.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-$294,000 our current budget verses $184,000, yeah there is a cut. Current
budget by the way provided for some personnel that we didn't hire there are some vacancies there.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-In building and grounds only, right?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yeah. If, I remember right cutting three people, I believe in that department.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-You've got a $100,000.00 there to last you the next two months.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Part of that is because we didn't fill jobs this year.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Again, I can relate to these folks that are somewhat unprepared here tonight. This has
not been easy to interpret and within the period of time that we had to dedicate the time it, I feel a little bit
inadequate to be very serious with you.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Your among friends. We feel inadequate and we've been at it pretty hard for a
long time.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-I notice on the contingency piece, again page 25, department 1990, contingency is
$98,000 dollars, zero expended to date and that's another 100,000.00.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Normally contingency funds are used very late in the year and usually you try
and run all your line items and if you find a real problem or a project that the Town wants to take on that's
not in the budget, that's where it's going to appear. I think we, at least this administration is trying not to
use that until late and then but we did allocate some out the other day in a meeting, I think $31,000.00 for
some sidewalks that we're building.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Okay. I raise that question because when I look at the interfund transfers and I don't
know exactly the number there that I had unfortunately, but it seemed to me as if we were looking at about
a million four of interfund transfers. That would not be contingent monies, right?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-No, that's money in particular, I think a million four is, let's see ...
MR. CHAMPAGNE-It seems like a 10 percent of a budget, it seems like a lot of money for non-allocation
directly to purpose rather than interfund transfer, unless we know what that interfund transfer is upfront.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well the interfund transfers are itemized and you have interfund transfers that
go, the biggest single one goes to the Highway Department.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Okay.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-And what your really doing is transferring sales tax to that department.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Okay, that explains it Mike, I appreciate that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Okay.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-At first I thought that was part of contingency, you know you kind of slide those
dollars around as need be. Okay and I guess my last concern that I have as we hear more about the number
of layoffs, I would just hope that somewhere in a, I don't know what you've got here, a 8 million dollar
budget I guess, that some funds could be appropriated for, I guess what we call out-placement or some type
of job counseling for some of these folks that are going to be dropped off the edge of the cliff with no place
to go. I think that the Board ought to really seriously take a hard look at that in terms of how best can we
service these folks that have been with this Town for a goodly number of years that are highly qualified,
capable but just get caught up in the backdraft of the economy.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Your right and we have talked about that in fact I've asked a company in
Town to give us the name of two out-placement services that would do just exactly that. That doesn't come
with out some cost but it's a cost that may be well spent.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-Well I guess anything of that nature costs but in the meantime, if we're doing some
good things for people it might be a major concern. In the last note I'd like to leave you with is that in
putting this document together, I don't know how easy it would be and certainly I don't understand the data
processing system here but it would make my life much easier if we were to have a 1992 overall
appropriation on your first sheet, okay your cover sheet. Let's take a look at what was expended here, I'm a
trending guy, I like to look at trends okay, not just this year and last year or maybe three years but where
we've been five years ago and as we begin to look at the future, what does that tell us. At the same time, it
would have helped me this time to have some type of a directory. Again, as a lead sheet, give me a
directory to what's in here, just by page number and budget code, would be some help, cause I found that to
be confusing. Very well done, I think we can applaud you folks for holding the line. Did an outstanding
job in terms of overall dollars we just hope that it goes to the right place at the right time. Thank you very
much for listening.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Anyone else?
GILBERT BOW AN-North Queensbury. I'd like to comeback to page 15, on Buildings and Grounds. For
prior year there is a contractual expense of $32,000 and in the current budget it says there is $163,000 and
now there is proposed $123,000. Could you tell me a little bit about what is in that?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I'm sorry, start over what page are we on?
MR. BOWAN-Fifteen.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Contractual expenses include, I believe that includes utilities, fuel oil, electricity,
telephone services.
Building and Grounds budget is a big budget and it's broken down by many buildings and each building is
separated and I'd gladly share each one with you.
MR. BOW AN-My question is the prior year was only $32,000 and then it jumped over $140,000 to this
year.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Division of Audit and Control comes in and tells you that your not charging
things in the right place.
MR. BOW AN-Okay, so you moved something.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-That one hundred and twenty three covers the court building down on
Glenwood Avenue, covers the Highway Department over here, the buildings over here, anything that's
owned by...
MR. BOW AN-But, it's all utility type things?
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Utilities, snow removal all that kind of stuff.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Fuel.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Putting in a furnace, you know, changing machinery, equipment in the building
MR. BOW AN-So there some capital expenses in there as well?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well no.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-But I'll tell you what I think the difference is. Where you see prior year one?
MR. BOWAN-Yes.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-If my memory serves me right, at one time, lets say, all the court expenses,
like their fuel oil, utilities and etcetera, was allocated into their budget. Where now, well maybe the Justice
Court is a bad one because that is off by itself maybe still. But some of these other buildings here that are
inter-related, that used to have a lot of this stuff under their own building has now been pulled into a master
fund of building and ground. So it was in the budget but only in a different section before.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -And you have more buildings than you did have. Buildings were being
constructed, I don't know the dates when they came on line but each one of those buildings increase costs
for maintenance.
MR. BOW AN-Well I guess summarizing what you're telling me, is that essentially it's all utilities.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, no, no. Okay, just let me go down 1620, but I won't swear to you that
it's, you know, it will be equipment purchases and it will be contractual both. Let me just give you some of
the items that are in one section of it, okay. That's personnel there and I think personnel shows up in a
different spot. You've got, let's see we've got some tools. We've got some signs. We've got a
miscellaneous contractual which could be for the minor stuff that you buy. We got, well that's that
contractual, that was if I remember right, a lawn mower and some things like that, that came up to quite a
bit, heavier duties stuff. You had some uniforms. You've got cleaning supplies. You've got some service
contracts. You've got equipment repair maintenance. You've got telephone, vehicle repair maintenance
and that is only the vehicles that are used in the maintenance of these buildings, not the other vehicles.
Utilities, for the Town Office Building, utilities alone, were 26,000 dollars. Gasoline, fuel oil and again,
I'm still in the Town Office Building, air conditioning and furnace repair in the Town Office Building,
electrical repair, Town Office Building. Telephone repairs and then you've got all the other buildings, the
Highway Building is part of this, the Town Court Building, the coordinator that was over at the Queensbury
Center. Telephone, a lot of those types of things.
MR. BOWAN-Okay, I get enough of the sense of.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-You got an idea here?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-You know it's a real catch all type ofa thing, really.
MR. BOW AN-Alright, now I'd like to get to page 47 which is a historical property. What is in historical
property?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's the Chapman.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That was the Chapman Museum.
MR. BOW AN-Excuse me?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-The Chapman Museum.
MR. BOWAN-Okay, that's ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Which is actually the Glens Falls Queensbury Historical Association.
MR. BOW AN-The prior page was museum.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes, that's the Hyde.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Museum, is the Hyde.
MR. BOW AN-Excuse me?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -It's the Hyde Museum.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-The Hyde Collection.
MR. BOWAN-That's the museum?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yes.
MR. BOW AN-And then the following page is historical property?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That is the Chapman Museum.
MR. BOW AN-Okay, two different?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes and then you will see a historian and that's a historian that works here
doing research, well she's more current really actually, but now under some of the planning regulations in
the State, she also has input when people want to develop a certain area for what's been there before.
MR. BOW AN-How do I find in here what you've got budgeted for snow this year and next year?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Okay, it's a Highway Department that's part of the snow budget.
MR. BOW AN-Because I'm assuming that this year is going to be worse than last year.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Don't say that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I hope you're right.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-We're going to send it all to Florida.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-The snow budget isn't itemized in our budget, I mean it's itemized but it's, there
isn't a subtotal of snow, is there?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It's under the, yes 5130.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's 5142, isn't it?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Wait a minute, no I'm in the wrong one.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Try 5142.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Wait a minute, no that's patching.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's not subtotalled.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Mr. Naylor, how much do you got in the budget for snow?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Okay, 5142 is the winter budget, right Paul?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Yes, it's the winter budget.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Am I right Rick?
RICK MISSITA, Deputy Highway Superintendent-I didn't hear you.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-The 5142 is the winter budget number code wise?
MR. MISSITA-What page is it in this one?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I don't know, it's in seven under highway in our big one.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Page 7 under your tab.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Page 7, yes.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-But not in yours, not in yours.
MR. BOWAN-Oh.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Sorry about that.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Snow contractual.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes, wait a minute, maybe we can find it here for you.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's not subtotalled.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -It's not subtotalled.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-You've got to do mathematics to get it.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Yea, it's all broken down.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Well no, I think he's got a total for that ...
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-He's got salt and stuff.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-No he doesn't.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-It's not in our print out as a subtotal.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Not a subtotal but individual.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-There's nine items on that page.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Plus the personnel benefits. It's not subtotal.
MR. MISSITA-It's the six month budget, make that 40 hours a week with around 20 percent over time
estimated for each individual employee.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-How much is it total?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Well we would have to break out the snow away from the rest of it.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Well that would be quite a thing to do.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- The point is, it's not broken out.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-And we've got it all together.
MR. MISSITA-Betty, on this I can't do it ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, ours is broken down as far as descriptions but they don't give a grand
total for snow in winter. Even our print out doesn't do a grand total, separate snow in winter.
MR. BOW AN-Well, how does it compare to last years? Can you tell us that?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Snow and winter or just the overall Highway budget?
MR. BOW AN-No, just snow.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Snow, how does it compare to last year?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Do you know Rick, the snow part?
MR. MISSITA-Not without looking at it Betty.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-We would have to break that down for you into Winter and Summer.
MR. BOW AN-What I'm trying to do is, trying to determine if there was some sort of a trend. Namely he
used last year's budget and said, well we're maybe going to have the same or more or what?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I'll tell you what we did in Highway. We looked at this year's spending level
which is about 2 million, a little under 100,000. Two million, 50,000 is what we project will be spent this
year, that's providing it doesn't snow a lot, an unusual amount between now and the end of December. We
said that we had to get down to a $1,850,000.00 dollars and we said, Mr. Naylor and your people go back
and come back with that figure and you allocate it the way you think it ought to be, but that's the figure
we're going to shoot for. We had to work like hell to find enough money to get that figure and they made
the budget and they came back to us with the breakdown with all the items. We're buying into what they
gave us but we think they made substantial changes that would result in net savings. They explained what
they did to us and how they got those savings and there tough savings, it's a matter again oflaying off
people. It's not nice, not fun. It's hard on everyone but I applaud them they did the job. In the end I didn't
try and itemized their items, they did.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-And I think when we talk about comparisons too, Rick and Paul, correct me
if I'm wrong, in October, you go into your snow budget by State Regulations. In doesn't have to be
snowing to go into snow budget. The first of October they have to go on their snow budget and the first of
April, you go on your Summer budget.
P AUL NAYLOR, Highway Superintendent right.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-So that's how they get allocated.
MR. NAYLOR -Your welcome to come over to our office and we'll show you our budget right to the
penny.
MR. BOWAN-Yea, okay.
MR. NAYLOR-Just call up and let us know when your coming, we'll put the coffee on.
MR. BOW AN-Earlier there were comments made about the unfortunate problem of laying off people. As I
look through this, that's about the only place where you can in turn pick up money, because there isn't much
in here in terms of contractual or equipment or anything like that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-There's a lot oflittle things. You'll find if you look at celebrations, it's gone.
What's celebrations? Celebrations, you're buying fireworks? It's out, it's 6,000 dollars, it's not a lot of
money. You'll find that the supplies and office supplies and stuff for all the buildings, was cut in half, from
30,000 to 15,000, it's pretty close to what our costs are running. Can we cut down on copy paper?
Probably, we're going to try. Can we cut down in other places? We'll do everything we can but it's not big
bucks. The big bucks are labor and hospitalization and all that sort of thing.
MR. BOWAN-Right, do you have a figure in terms of percentage of how much of the total budget here is
personnel versus how much is, contractual?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I don't have it in my head.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-We could get that very easily, EJ could break that out very quickly.
Another thing too, I think Mike some big purchases have been postponed we've decided not to do, I mean
we've really been pretty fugal. There is another figure that is a guesstimate in here yet and that's what our
insurance is going to cost us for another year. We hope in November before this budget is finalized we'll
have, you know maybe some truer figures on that. Those are being worked on right now to try to prepare
those right down to the bone.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Interesting number, I remember a year ago we were all beating up the old
board as they we're struggling to get down too. One of the things we've beated them up about is 1420, the
Town Attorney and everybody was making hey with that. The prior year was $220,465.00, our propose
budget this year is $169,850.00. There has been a lot of work done both by the previous board and by this
board to begin to role back things that weren't there. You are absolutely right, there is no place to pick up
$200,000.00 by giving up paper clips.
MR. BOWAN-I have 1990 figures for your total general and I see were the amount of revenue from taxes
in 1990 was four ninety four and now your five zero three. However, going back over to the appropriations
where you have seven nine eight one now at that time it was nine nine eight four so you've come down
quick a bit in a lot of these things.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -But, also understand we've got to be fair and honest about it. There are places
where we came down like in landfill, truefully the budget was in error last year and so the reduction is... .
What we've tried to do is reflect accurately what the income is and what we expect the revenues and
expenses all the way through here. There are some genuine cuts in here without any questions some major
cuts but there are also some things that appear to be cuts, but aren't. I guess we've got to be honest about
it. I like to tell you, oh boy we really did a number here, well some of it isn't true.
MR. BOWAN-Thankyou.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Rick, you wanted to say something?
MR. MISSIT A-Just to answer his question. Our budget is proposed at one million eight hundred and nine
six ninety. Seven of that nine hundred seventy six thousand six hundred and ninety seven is personnel
services and benefits.
JACK CUSHING-Orchard Drive, Queensbury. I think that you have done a pretty good job on your
budget setting, I want to applaud you on that. I think that you have cut places and that's towing the line. I
do have a couple of questions mostly for information. On page 11, on the Town Attorney's budget. The
current budget meaning what was budgeted was $193,000.00 and actual to date is $157,000.00. But going
up to the contractual expenses you are now have actual to date, $57,000.00 and your proposing $45,000.00.
The question that I've got on that is, I'm making an assumption that the Town Attorney is pretty dam busy
and that he must have 4 or 5 hands and arms in order to get his job done. Are you handicapping him by
taking away contractual things that have to be done outside the department?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Possibly, Jack, I mean we, I tell you something, we've had a tough road here.
We said this Town not only has a full time attorney, but he has contract out for help too.
MR. CUSHING-Right.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-What we've tried to do is avoid litigation wherever we can. We've tried to make
settlements, we've tried to get old litigation off the books and we're lucky we don't have a lot of new
litigation starting. We've tried to avoid litigation everywhere we can. We have been able to do some of
that and we're starting to clean up some of the back log. We basically told the attorney, your not going to
be able to contract out as much as you did, your going to have to do more of the work yourself.
MR. CUSHING-How can he, there are only so many hours in the day? I know the kind of work that he's
doing at the present time and in this kind of society we're living in, everybody and his brother sues and
we're forced into it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We're going to have to see how successful we are. We're not going to go into a
lawsuit and lose it because we're afraid to hire some help.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's an ambiguous and unanswerable question as you well know.
MR. CUSHING-Well, I wish you luck but I'm just pointing it out that you may be cutting it too much.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well, it's possible.
MR. CUSHING-Page 41.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-You didn't hear that did you Paul?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I would just like to stay on that page just a minute Mike because I've got
something here that looks crazy. My budget shows 169,850.00, the print out shows 165,550.00. I asked EJ
to do a print out of all the changes we made the other night and there's no change in that department.
Maybe you've got a change in your master budget I don't have, I don't know. But there's a discrepancy here
that I can't explain by any of the papers I've got of about 4300 dollars.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-You're talking a discrepancy in the total budget?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, a discrepancy in the Attorney's Budget.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- The total proposed.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Total of the Town Attorney's budget on 16.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-On your page 16, Mike, right there, the big one. That's 169,850.00 and what
they're giving us is 165,550.00.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-And there's nothing on these pages here that EJ did, you know that those
were the last minute changes we did to explain that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I'll go through mine with you but I think, I assume we all have the same print
out, seventy-three thousand forty-five thousand seven.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-We do but there's a difference.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-But there's a difference, there's a discrepancy for some reason. You mean
the whole Town Attorney's budget?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes. Seventy-three thousand, forty-five seven. A thousand, five hundred.
Eight hundred. Six hundred. Two thousand, nine hundred. Seven hundred and fifty.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No I've got Seven hundred and fifty.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Seven fifty.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Seven hundred and fifty.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Seven fifty.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Yea.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Right?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That's what I got.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Yes.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yea, a thousand two hundred. Three thousand, five hundred. Six hundred.
Twenty-five thousand.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-I got thirty thousand.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-That was a change.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, we've got thirty thousand.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-There's a change there, on that sheet.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yea, we dropped that the last day.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Okay but it doesn't show up on the sheet that EJ printed out for us.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Are you sure?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Yea, it doesn't.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, I mean yea I am my numbers, yes.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It doesn't show up on the sheet.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Now does that make it, is it just the difference in five thousand?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Yes, that makes it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Probably.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It's a little bit more, five thousand three hundred is the difference, so we've
got one other difference, I don't know where it is.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Do you have ten thousand on the next line?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Codification, do you have ten thousand?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's ten thousand, yes.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Right.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's the end.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes well, we're still minus three fifty, there's a three fifty difference we
don't have.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Something might be adding wrong, we'll have to look at it.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes, would you have EJ recheck that please?
MR. CUSHING-Maybe he can get a little bit more money there.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We can handle it.
MR. CUSHING-Page 41. On the QEDC budget, actual to date shows $300.16. I was, thought that we had
spent more in that particular budget for this year. I thought that the consultant's fee came out of that and I
also thought that the sewer study came out of that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's true but this is a, the item here is the general fund transfer to the QEDC
and as of this year, we've only transferred $300.16 as of that date to the QEDC.
MR. CUSHING-Do you plan to transfer more to it than?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-The QEDC, right and what we put in here is twenty five thousand, which may
not go to the QEDC but may go to the new regional marketing group which is, we don't have a name for it,
we don't have a contract for it but we put it in the QEDC budget. That's what we had committed to it and
that's, it shows here as a QEDC, that maybe a mis ...
MR. CUSHING-I'm a little confused than a little bit because transferring of funds to different ...
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well yea it's easy to be confused.
MR. CUSHING-From one budget to another budget.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -QEDC budget itself, it's operating budget is separate from the general fund.
Totally different budget, totally different monies.
MR. CUSHING-Correct.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-What we do in here is we show money that we're going to transfer to their
budget and then they spend it. Alright? So far, year to date, we haven't transferred what was in the budget.
MR. CUSHING-Okay.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's why your seeing that. But next year we did commit to twenty-five
thousand to that regional marketing concept, you know, joint county and I think that's on target from what
I've heard, everything is still moving to form that.
MR. CUSHING-Okay, I just didn't want you to forget the sewer study and the consulting fees. Both Fred
and I thought that it should have been included in here somewhere.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-They would be in a separate budget.
MR. CUSHING-I'll take your word on that. Page number 50 and this is simply an explanation on the
zoning. I assume you have added people to the zoning. I maybe the wrong assumption, but you, the
requested was thirteen thousand and your up to thirty-six thousand now.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes, there's been a bunch of reshuffling of planning, zoning and code
enforcement departments. That happened as we had a change of administration with Mr. Parisi here for a
while and then he left, then Mr. Martin. The requested were figures as Mr. Parisi had organized it and the
proposed as you see it now, is as, it's operating now and under the structure that Mr. Martin has proposed.
MR. CUSHING-You feel comfortable with that at this point in time then?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yes.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Jack, I think to make a true comparison, you've got to take those items that
are under zoning, those under planning and those under building and codes and kind of put them all
together from last year and then compare them with this year, once you put them all together because the
way the personnel flowed back and forth.
MR. CUSHING-Okay, thank you.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It's going to be probably the best way to try to compare that.
MR. CUSHING-Yea, it's very difficult if you take it line by line, I'm sure.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes.
MR. CUSHING-The last thing I want to comment on is the fire budget. I think you've done an
exceptionally good job in the fire budget and I applaud you on that. I recognize that the fire budget is one
of the largest so far as the Town of Queensbury is concerned but I want to assure the Adamsons that they're
getting the biggest bang for their buck that anybody could every get so far as the fire service is concerned.
I can only speak for Queensbury Central of which I was President when the fire house was built. I can
speak a little bit for North Queensbury because I own a home in Cleverdale and I'm familiar with the fire
company up there and I would invite the Adamsons to come to Queensbury Central and I will give them a
personally conducted tour of the facilities and we'll see if there's anything luxurious in that department. It's
very fundamental, it's very workable and as I say, I'm not speaking for the other companies but simply for
the Queensbury Central. If the people in the audience want to compare with another organization, why I
say you get the biggest bang for the buck, let's just compare just for a second and I know that the Board
knows this but I want to emphasis it very, very fully. We have two hundred volunteers in the five fire
companies here in the Town of Queensbury. Two hundred volunteers and we spend one hell of a lot of
time on this. Town of Glens Falls has forty fire fighters. Queensbury Central has more equipment than the
City of Glens Falls, both fire houses put together and their budget last year was over two million dollars.
That's because they have a paid fire company. Now if you want to go to a paid fire company in
Queensbury with five fire companies, my God, our budget would probably be about five million dollars.
So that's why I say, you've got the biggest bang for the buck because you've got so many people. We have
fifty-five people in Queensbury Central but there's two hundred in the entire district and I just want the
Town people to recognize that and there is a watch dog and Nick Caimano has worked diligently with the
fire companies. He's been to our meetings, he's been to our budget meetings and he knows that we are
trying to keep the costs down. We have working relationships with many, many of the Town contractors
and many of them do work for us gratis and or at way, way below the costs that we could get service as
individual residences because they know how important it is to keep the fire companies going and I think
the Town Board also recognizes that too. But one other factor that's causing tremendous increases in costs
are the Osha laws that are just coming into effect and all the fire companies have to have these. The HIV
shots, everything in this particular area is costing a tremendous amount of money and if we don't get those
done, we'll be fined thousands of dollars and that will come back to the Board to haunt us. So I just want to
assure everyone that the fire companies themselves are doing a job that you can be proud of.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Jack, I just want to point out one more thing and again, correct me if I'm
wrong, it's your fire company. Number one, Queensbury Central does permit other community
organizations to use their meeting room and number two, I believe your equipped to be an emergency relief
shelter if we should need one.
MR. CUSHING-That's right, our people have said that, gee, you've got an meeting room down there which
can house 150 people to eat there. But that was done very specifically and on purpose, that if there is a
major accident some place on the highway, we can put several bus loads into that center and we have
emergency lighting for any big storms. We're also an emergency center for the communications throughout
Warren County. If we didn't have that communications center and Prospect Mountain goes off, then we
have to physically man hole the fire companies and the rescue squads in the area, we can get on there and
contact them by radio ourselves from Queensbury Central. It's a state of the art station, there are no frills
attached to it and as again, I invite anybody to go down there and take a look at it. Thank you.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Thank you.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Thanks Jack.
DAVID KENNY-David Kenny, the Town of Queensbury. I guess I would just like, the QEDC I see that I
have one question. We didn't give them any money this year and we're giving them twenty-five thousand
last year. What is that current budget? Do they have a surplus balance in their budget that we don't know
about and can we get that information?
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Yes, I have it, I'm on the QEDC if you'd like it.
MR. KENNY-How much is that?
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I don't know off the top of my head, it's several hundred thousands.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's about three hundred thousand.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Jack, maybe Jack knows.
MR. CUSHING-Three hundred and fifty-four thousand.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Yes.
MR. KENNY-So there's three hundred and fifty-four thousand dollars in a budget that's not being used now
and yet we're allocating to give them another twenty-five thousand next year.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -No. QEDC is slowly phasing out I think as, maybe realistic. What's happening,
they've been at the for front to help change the organization of marketing industry to come in here and their
function in marketing has been merged together with the City, Warren County and Washington County and
the Chamber of Commerce. That new organization has not formed yet but the skeleton of it as certainly
been defined and each board is allocating their money towards it and that's really what you see here. We're
not putting money in the QEDC, it's on that line item but it will be it's successor.
MR. KENNY-Okay, what will happen to the three hundred and fifty thousand that's in the QEDC fund
now? Will that go back into the Town general fund?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well it's, I don't know the future of that.
MR. KENNY-I guess, that's my question. You know, we've got three hundred and fifty thousand dollars in
some fund that's sitting there and it's not part of the surplus fund.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Our attorney is working on it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-It's really made to attract industry and one of the things we ...
MR. KENNY-But we're saying that's dissolving. I thought Ijust heard you say that per sa the Queensbury
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-No, that hasn't been decided.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Originally Dave, part of that money, the purpose of it was, that was
accumulated was, that we have you know the Queensbury Technical Park and their lots there to be sold and
as the lots were sold in some areas, it would be necessary to put in more infrastructure, so some of that
money was being accumulated to do that work in the future. As you know right now it's hard to get
industries in. We haven't needed to use that property and that property is something that's okay for a Town
to sit on, believe it or not, you don't need to have a fire sale, because that's something you have in the bank
to use for an industry in the future that needs it. So the feeling is now though that the better way to get
industry is going to help Queensbury no matter where it settles in this region because we're also
interdependent in this area, so it's to go regional in planning to attract industry, hopefully to get some good
paying jobs into this area and as you know, we need some good paying jobs in this area. I mean when Ciba
Geigy for instance went out, it took a heck of a lot of real good paying jobs in middle management with it.
Hopefully we can find a way of attracting industry back in here.
MR. KENNY-I guess my question would be, is three hundred and fifty thousand dollars needed, if it is
fine. I don't know what's ...
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- There's some legal ramifications to it too, right?
MR. KENNY-But twenty-five thousand dollars could come out of the QEDC to go to Glens Falls, this new
group that's going to be formed instead of coming out of this Town's budget this year.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-And it maybe needed for infrastructure ...
MR. KENNY-I mean that's all I'm, I guess the point being.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It maybe needed for infrastructure in order to get industries in here. That
we don't know.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-The money that they've got, you can't do, use for promotion.
MR. KENNY-You can use for, economical development.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Yea, right.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Specifically.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well look it, this is an area where we know there's going to be change. We
know that there are, we've got some plans that they helped fund. For instance we did a sewer study to look
at how we can bring industry in here successfully and they paid for that, as a matter of fact. How we move
from here, we don't know. But we do know it's there, we're well aware of it, we're talking with the Board
of Directors of QEDC. We've got to forge a policy of how to move so that we succeed in bringing industry
here. We don't want to just take the money and bring it back into the general fund and use it for parks or
use it for something else, we want to bring jobs here. What brings jobs here, probably water capacity,
probably sewer capacity and that type of thing. So maybe that's where it's going to end up.
MR. KENNY-I agree, I don't disagree with you, I just think it's going to be put out on the table and I'd like
to see the three hundred and fifty thousand dollars go to work for the Town of Queensbury.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Yes, we're working on it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well so do we and we certainly are addressing it. But it's one of the things we
have not come to a conclusion on and members of the QEDC will ask us from time to time, well what do
you think and quite frankly, we haven't caught up to them, we're not thinking anything yet.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- There's also some legal ramifications as to how we use it too.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Oh a lot of them.
MR. KENNY-Well I do believe though that you could transfer, ifQEDC has that kind of money to spend
on economical development and if like you say, can do a study or you can also give that money to
somebody else to do a study which this new group that's going to be formed is going to be doing
economical development for the region now.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-As of the date of this budget, the answer to that question was no.
MR. KENNY-Right but you are proposing in this budget to give that group twenty-five thousand.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's correct.
MR. KENNY-That money could come from the QEDC fund also.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, no it can't legally.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-No, as of this budget, the discussions we held, we were not allowed to do it
that way otherwise we would.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-That money can't come out of there to do what we want to do here.
MR. KENNY-Until it's formed you mean?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Yes.
MR. KENNY-Once it's formed, you can though?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Well we're not sure of that.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-I don't, I think it has to be very specific and that man over there is going to
answer the question.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-He's working on it.
MR. KENNY-Okay, but then you can leave the twenty-five thousand dollars out of this budget, leave a line
out. When the group is formed, they come back for the twenty-five thousand, ahead of time you know you
have three hundred and fifty, there's you know, more than one way to skin a cat.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Not if! can't use the money.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Except that this has to be, it has to be adopted as of November 20th, if we
take it out and find out we can't take twenty-five thousand dollars out ofQEDC fund.
MR. KENNY -Well hopefully this new group that is formed, make sure their laws are written that they can
economical development money from other areas and do it so it's done properly. I mean, they've got to
form this organization so that hopefully some of that money is available to them.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yea but I'm talking about the charter for QEDC may restrict what QEDC
funds may be used for, that way.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's our charter, not theirs.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That's a charter that we formed when we formed QEDC and we made it
pretty stringent.
MR. KENNY-Hopefully when this new group is formed, they look at that charter and ...
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Not do it.
MR. KENNY-Right.
ATTORNEY DUSEK-I might just mention to what Mr. Kenny just said, I can emphasis that enough, we've
had some organizations in the past that wanted to obtain funds from the Town to do very worth while
projects but because of the way they were set up, either the organization or the project itself, there was no
legal mechanism for us to fund them. I can think of one in particular where we had a heck of a time but I
just couldn't recommend it. So what you have said is all together very true.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I think Jack wanted to make a comment on it maybe.
MR. CUSHING-The only comment that I wanted to make is that the Board of Directors ofQEDC is well
aware of this three hundred plus thousand dollars but then your totally correct that we can't do anything at
the present time until we know what's going to happen so far as the technical park is concerned. That
money is there for ... technical park. We have been negotiating with the Federal Government for grants for
infrastructure to continue the ... there, depending upon the type of company that comes in there. As soon as
we've got that squared away and this other region economic development, we'll go out of business. The
QEDC will go out of business and that money will probably revert back to the Town. So it's there and we
know it's there.
LYNN POTENZA-Hi, Lynn Potenza, Queensbury. It's so much better sitting on this side of the table then
that. I know the effort and work that you have put into budgeting it's a very hard working and difficult time
of the year for board members. I don't want to dwell on the QEDC, but that was very important to me
when I sat in your place. Any type of indication that we can give to business that we welcome business
into this Town should be stressed over and over again. I'm concerned and I hope the Board of Directors for
the QEDC looks hard and long at regionalization, I guess for these economic developments. I understand
your thoughts that jobs within the region brings money into the Town of Queensbury, but fact is fact if
Valcour was in Glens Falls they would get the property tax and they would get the sales tax from it. So it's
very important that Queensbury hold it's head high and market itself as a selective community and welcome
business into this community because we need the tax dollars to offset some of the property taxes. I, you
know, twenty-five thousand dollars on a budget item, bringing in multi million dollars of business is like
spitting in the air as far as I'm concerned. The other question I have is on engineering on page 12. The
requested budget, we've spent over twenty thousand dollars this year on engineering and because it's been
such a soft real estate market and I'm sure that things have slowed down in the planning and zoning
department, I was wondering why the additional twenty thousand dollars and what was is spent on this
year?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We're looking at actual to date?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-You mean requested versus proposed Lynn?
MRS. POTENZA-The current was thirty-five thousand, the prior was fourteen, two ninety-eight and the
current is thirty-five thousand, I rounded it up.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-I got thirty.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-We've got a different page then you've got.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Yes, it must be a different page.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-What page are you on?
MRS. POTENZA-On twelve.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Oh, I've got thirty thousand proposed.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-We've got to find it in our other budget.
MRS. POTENZA-Yes, I'm looking at the top line Nick under personnel services.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Okay, what happened there, what I'll say here is that, actually there was none
requested. This was part of the idea offorming a Town Engineer and multi departments under him or her.
There was no dollars requested there those dollars were requested in other departments under planning as, I
recall.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Except for the one twelve, one piece of it was put in this.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-But, the point is that it's not really an increase of twenty thousand dollars it's
just twenty thousand dollars that we think engineering services will spend during that year. There was
nothing in there before because there was a plan to have a Town Engineer and this was part of that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We basically separated out the restructure from...
MRS. POTENZA-I see.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Actually, if you look at the bottom line current budget sixty thousand and the
proposed is thirty thousand. The allocation of the other two lines is pretty arbitrary.
MRS. POTENZA-Okay.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-In the end we basically just took the bottom line and said we're going to find
how to do it for thirty thousand instead of sixty thousand.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Lynn, even though they've got that under personnel services some way or
other they put two lines here together and I don't really agree with what accounting has done.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's right. They did that a lot in the whole budget you well know.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Because the twenty thousand dollars we've put in here is really for outside
engineering services that might have to be called in that would not be reimbursed.
MRS. POTENZA-Okay. Do we presently have an engineering firm on retainer for this Town?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-We have a contract.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I'm trying to think how to say that, not to the extent that we used to use
them Lynn.
MRS. POTENZA-Okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-This is could also, that ten thousand down below you, you see that's for
survey work, that type of thing. The other would be as we use the person, the firm that you're talking or
any firm really, we don't have that firm come to every planning board meeting and zoning board meeting
now. There's been some cutbacks to try and hold the expenses down.
MR. POTENZA-Okay, good. Is there any thought at this stage of the game of hiring a Town engineer?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's certainly a discussion.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-A thought.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-It's a thought, we're looking at it, we don't know yet. We separated that out at
this point.
MRS. POTENZA-How is it accounted for in this budget?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-To hire an in-house?
MRS. POTENZA-Yes.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's not.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It is not, it's been taken out of the budget.
MRS. POTENZA-Okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-My feeling is Lynn, you start off, you know you start off with this figure
that you think is going to be small and pretty soon they want an office and then they want a secretary and
then they want an assistant and then they want a computer.
MRS. POTENZA-Betty, you know what, I agree with you. My feeling is after being in your place for a
while that the more you can give to the private companies, to business and the less government is involved
in it, the cheaper it is all the way around.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes, I agree with you.
MRS. POTENZA-I mean it can become a nightmare. The other question I have is on the revenue side on
page 5. This is awful guys, I mean now I know what the poor people did out here.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's combined, it's all combined, that's the problem.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-You did this for a while.
MRS. POTENZA-I know and I keep saying, why can't you understand it, it's right in front of me. Well,
only shows to go you.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-What's the title?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Real property taxes is that one, it's this one, it's our page one.
MRS. POTENZA-This is, I'm talking cemetery fund.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Oh cemetery fund, okay. Wait a minute, we've got to get to another page.
Give us a minute, would you please?
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Page 5, right at the top.
MRS. POTENZA-Now, I could make a really bad joke and say, are people dying to get into Queensbury
but ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes they are actually.
MRS. POTENZA-Yes they are Betty, your right.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Not only that but they're not using any of the other cemeteries in the other
area, they're coming into our Town.
MRS. POTENZA-Because we have a requested fifty-eight thousand and we have a proposed a hundred and
seven thousand, five hundred eighty-four in real estate, real property tax department cemetery fund. I don't
know, we've doubled it and I want to know how we could double the fund unless you know something I
don't know.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I think that's because of that glitch in the item the year before. The seventy-
five thousand.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's seventy-five thousand dollars, isn't it?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yea, there's a revenue item in this year's cemetery fund of seventy-five thousand
and none of us can identify what it is or where it's supposed to come from.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Including me.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -So it's seems to be a phantom. Since it's not going to come in, were going to
have to budget around that, that department will have no surplus, that fund will have no surplus at the end
of the year and so everything will have to be raised by taxes. We triggered a pretty strong reaction when
we said, maybe we ought to reorganize some of the cemetery functions and the cemetery commission felt
that we didn't have a right to tell them that and they maybe totally correct under the law. It's kind of a
mess. We all agree that it's a mess and what we've proposed to do is this year, dig it all out, look at the
history of the cemetery commission from the day of it's inception.
MRS. POTENZA-Bad choice of words Mike.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Does he have to say dig?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Yea, bad choice.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Dig out all the information and look at all of the expenditures and all of the
revenues and look at the total history and try and form a structure that fits the law and that we all
understand what each persons responsibility, each boards responsibility and each boards authority is.
We've just set out to do that, meanwhile we in here just gave them the operating budget that they requested.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-I'll tell you, if you can remember what that seventy-five thousand dollars is,
we would all be grateful because nobody could figure it out.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-The cemetery people don't know what it is either.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That wasn't part of their budget that they put in.
MR. SALVADOR-Maybe it was just thrown in to balance the budget.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Have no idea but it's not in there anymore.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I think that's what happened.
MR. SALVADOR-Is that a tactic?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's possible.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I could be.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-But it's also a possible not.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I don't know because it's just like one of those crazy things that maybe
something glitched in the computer or something, unfortunately, which sounds nuts.
COUNCILMAN POTENZA-It doesn't ring a bell with me. The only other question, I can't seem to find it
in this well organized budget, is the, there was an increase in the revenues in the recreation department.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yes, there's definitely a management decision that's been made here and it's a
very important one. What we basically said, we went to our recreation department and their board and we
said, we want increased revenue. So you'll find in the recreation budget some slight increases that show for
instance a turn style or some such thing up at Gurney Lane at the pool. What we basically said is we're
going to charge money to go to the pool, some way or another. There's been a study made of that and you'll
find in the revenue section, that there's about I think twenty-seven thousand dollars of net revenue coming
out of that venture.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Sixty-five Mike.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-We're going to start charging for swim lessons also.
MRS. POTENZA-That's what I assumed it probably was because there has been at some point some
discussion on that. I'm concerned because we have such a workable program with the other communities in
this area. The first example that pops into my head is the cross country skiing down at Crandall Park and
the working relationship we have with Glens Falls and the Town. I just hope that this does not put a strain
on that.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Let me tell you what we did. We also we're worried about that.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-We argued over it.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We basically said that whatever rate we have for the Queensbury residents will
be the same for the Glens Falls residents because we don't want that stir. We don't want to build a wall
between them and us.
MRS. POTENZA-Right.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We've had excellent cooperation we want to continue that and so in the
discussion of fee schedules we said when you develop them develop them for Glens Falls and Queensbury
together.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Mike, there is another mistake in this printout. Page 2, on the revenues.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-What page?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Page 2, of the revenues. In our budget page 2, of the revenues. In the big
budget Park and Recreation charges was left at forty thousand it was not increased to sixty-five thousand.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Do you want to correct them it is sixty-five thousand it shouldn't be forty
thousand, I don't know why that it.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- The forty should be sixty-five.
MRS. POTENZA-So the requested is twenty-five and your bringing it up to sixty-five thousand.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's correct.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That's because the requested would have been those programs that were
normally charged for the adult softball leagues those types of things and some of the more specialized ones
for the youth people or all ages. I don't think we firmly decided Lynn which items under recreation are
going to bare some charges we've got a laundry list that we've got to work on. But, working on the laundry
list we figured that we could make another that amount of extra charges over the twenty-five thousand that
the adults have been paying and etc., without being a terrific burden. I mean this isn't to try and have
gouging fees or anything like that.
MRS. POTENZA-The other question, I like to ask is that obviously health insurance and hospitalization is
going astronomically nuts. I know that we have an excellent program in the Town and I know it's a major
employee benefit. I know that contracts are coming up in the future and I'm wondering if this board has
thought about proposing to the unions and the employees some form of a split pay?
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I have, I thought about it. All businesses are having to raise the part that the
employees put into whatever plan they have and it's definitely needed here. We have a pretty good deal as
far as I can see.
MRS. POTENZA-We have a very good deal.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I use it a lot.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Don't forget the contract was renegotiated last year and it extends through to
next year, I think.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-But, it was renegotiated for better hospitalization on the Town.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We'll be discussing it next year, but we have to look at it.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Lynn, I think there is another alternative that I have looked at in my own
mind very closely. Do you trade off some of this for raises because it's almost cheaper for us to pay the
hospitalization premium and them not to have the raise and they're not paying the taxes on it and it cuts
down our social security, you know liability. So there's a lot of different avenues that need to be explored
in that but end up with a net result cost to the ...
MRS. POTENZA-To the employee better.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-A net ...
MRS. POTENZA-Benefit employee.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Thank you and the taxpayers.
MRS. POTENZA-There was a comment made about finding two hundred thousand dollars and maybe I
walked in on the meeting late, yesterday the library budget and special district passed and that elevates the
need for the two hundred and twenty-one.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, two hundred and twenty.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Two hundred and twenty.
MRS. POTENZA-Two hundred and twenty thousand dollars in the budget.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Remember the other one is for Mountainside, the eleven hundred.
MRS. POTENZA-Right, your right. I was here to know that that impacts about five cents per thousand on
the residents. Is it the intent of the Board to reduce the forty-four cents per thousand down to thirty-nine
cents or is it this intent to use the two hundred and twenty thousand dollars for other needs, perhaps holding
onto the employees?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It's more than five cents. It's twenty-four point four, isn't it?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-The intent is Lynn ...
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-It's eighteen point nine five reduction, eighteen cents.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-To reduce, I don't want to put it in cents because you know, until we make
sure we get the right assessed valued face, the intent is to reduce the expenditure line of the budget by two
hundred and twenty thousand dollars and therefore reduce the amount that has to be raised by taxes. In
other words, on your face sheet here you've got amount of revenue from taxes, five hundred and three,
seven hundred six?
MRS. POTENZA-Yes.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Take two hundred and twenty thousand dollars off that.
MRS. POTENZA-Oh, okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-And I won't, I'm not going to say to you what it's going to do in pennies or
cents until we get all that stuff from the Assessing Office.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Well the latest number we got Lynn was one billion, one sixty-one three
eighty for assessments to divide into that.
MRS. POTENZA-Okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Now but that maybe a different ...
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-It might change.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Wait a minute, are you using, because the tax base for the library will be
different than the tax base for the general town because that's a special district and tax exempt doesn't work.
MRS. POTENZA-Right.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I can tell you what it is. I can tell you what the tax assessed value for the library
is one million, one hundred sixty thousand.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I don't think that's right Mike.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Wait a minute, one billion, one hundred sixty million, eight hundred and
seventy-five, one three one.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Ifyou remember we looked it up the other night and that's right.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yea but that's the one for the general fund isn't it? Not the one for the tax
exempt, for the ones that don't, special districts that don't have tax exempt property. So you've got to go to
the gross value of the Town.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's what was given to me by the Assessor today or through the accountant.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-What Betty is saying, we may have to count the exempt in that too because
of the special district.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes. What do you think about a library district, will anybody be exempt
from that? A library tax that's got tax exempt property or will everybody pay it? Like we pay, the Town
pays the water tax.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-At any rate it's not going to change that much.
ATTORNEY DUSEK-I don't know the answer to that question Betty.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-May the Town per say will be paying...
MRS. POTENZA-Library tax.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-The library tax these pieces of property.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I think special districts everybody pays.
ATTORNEY DUSEK-No, usually the special districts it's the capital side you pay only.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Right.
ATTORNEY DUSEK-Now, the library district that's kind of a odd ball one, I'd have to look it up to see
how they ruled on it.
MRS. POTENZA-You've lost me when your talking, does the board intend to reduce?
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Yes.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-The amount to be raised by taxes by two hundred and twenty thousand
dollars.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-It's being taken out of our budget.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-What, I don't want to tell you is what's that's going to amount to in cents
because of this tax exempt...
MRS. POTENZA-But it will reduce the forty forty cents per thousand to something?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-I believe it's going to be twenty four cents.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-By whatever two hundred and twenty thousand dollars would of brought in
on the general fund taxes.
JOHN SAL V ADORE-The answer to her question is not necessarily.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's correct because of the exempt status. But, the number is going to be a
penny or two here or there it's not going to be nine cents or ten cents.
JOHN SAL V ADORE-The answer to her question is not necessarily.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-What do you mean?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-What you mean?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-We said as a board we are going to remove that from our budget one hundred
percent.
MR. SAL V ADORE-That isn't the question.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-What's the question you'll have to repeat it.
MRS. POTENZA-I thought that was the question.
MR. SAL V ADORE-The question you asked is if the forty forty cent per thousand was going to be reduced.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-It is.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-It is to twenty four cents.
MR. SAL V ADORE-Oh it is, again please.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-If you take out the two hundred and twenty thousand and hold this budget the
way it is which is my intent, I think the tax rate will be twenty four cents.
MRS. POTENZA-Thank you.
ELEANOR OUDEKERK-Taxpayer, Bay Road. I think, I would echo Fred Champagne is saying it would
be wonderful to have an explanatory cover and a directory to the budget, but we've made it this far. Ijust
had a few things I wanted to have clarified, I'm not challenging anything. Some of the questions I have
have all ready been answered. One is under Code 1680, page 18, data processing.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Wait a minute Eleanor until we catch up with you.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Page 18.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I can tell you.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Ijust want to know are we buying new equipment each year is that what we're doing?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-What were proposing to do in data processing is to buy a map system to put into
our computers so that all our real property will be on maps in the computers and we think that we have to
move in that direction if we're going to be with the real world today.
MRS. OUDEKERK-So that's mainly for the assessment department?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Planning, Zoning, it be like the GIS series.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Building, Zoning, everybody. You plug it in you can see what happens on any
individual property.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Right. You can super-impose highway, you can super-impose water, planning,
zoning all those things in different data bases on top of that mapping system.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Fire districts, etc.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Frankly, what we did is we started with a budget there and when we got into the
last hours of the budget we just said, well we still got to cut. We just arbitrary cut and we said, we may not
get it all done in one year and if that's the case so be it, but we had to cut and we cut some there.
MRS. OUDEKERK-I assume the four thousand dollars under personnel services is for related training?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, part ofE.J's salary shows up there.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-It doesn't all show up on the accounting budget. But, his salary remains the
same as it was last year.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Moving ahead to page 40, 67772, Programs for the Aging could you tell me what's in
that? What is the current budget being nine thousand of which sixty five hundred and something has
already been spent what's the proposed fourteen thousand?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Programs for the Aging as we understand it
is funded by federal programs. We said, why do we have nineteen thousand in it after it's really done
through the recreation program. After a study of the federal funding for the last couple of years we found
that fourteen thousand is probably more realistic so we put it in as it actually happens at about fourteen
thousand. That's funding coming from the federal government then being spent out.
MRS. OUDEKERK-On what?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -It's recreation programs and it's through...
MRS. OUDEKERK-But, this is programs for the aging. I would assume it be programs in somehow related
to the elderly.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-That's correct and it's done through the recreation department.
MRS. OUDEKERK-The transportation program is part of that?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -No.
MRS. OUDEKERK-No.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Not the bus. The bus that you might be using for special programs for the
seniors, wait a minute.
MRS. OUDEKERK-That's the one the Town provides in a contractual arrangement.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, it is not. It's not the contract with CWI, that's not the contract.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Harry Hansen could answer your questions for you on that stuff.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-This is all the money that would flow through Harry's department to benefit
the seniors and it's an in and out.
MRS. OUDEKERK-I was just wondering what it was. I'll see Harry regarding this.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I know what your saying.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-There are programs that are done, I know are handled through the county which
programs....
MRS. OUDEKERK-Through the county, okay.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -But, it's federal money that comes through.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Under the recreation administration page 42, personnel services has increased to some
extent. Is that a reflection of people hired in the summer time, just the extra people or is there? Current
budget is roughly two hundred thousand, one sixty-five to date. Two hundred and six eight proposed. Is
that just kind of a standard percentage increase for the people that are there?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, no.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- There's no increase of any kind, to be very honest with you.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Well I think Harry did put in some increases for the Summer help.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-There's increases in union people but there area no increases in anyone else.
Alright, so, I'm looking at the master budget on that one, trying to follow it.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-So am I and there's not a single increase, in fact there's a decrease under
youth services director from requested to proposed. There's an decrease under recreation specialist.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-That's because his salary is going to stay what it is.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-But the point is that there's no way that you could add up the requested and
come up with two thousand dollars more, a little less than two thousand dollars more than proposed.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Wait, that's not what I said, no.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Recreation attendant, there's eight thousand goes to twelve thousand.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Where's this?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -In the master budget it's ...
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Sixteen ninety?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Yea, sixteen ninety.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-I have eighty-five zero nine.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I did too Nick.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Well then mine is not ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-What do you guys got?
MRS. OUDEKERK-Is that under personnel?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Eighty-five zero nine.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Remember the one we were questioning?
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-On what?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-On recreation attendant.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-On page 54 in the big budget?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Yes.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Isn't that one of the ones we increased because of the revenue side.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's right.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-There were certain increases that were made to show the costs that would take to
run the revenue producing part of it.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Where did you pick that twelve thousand?
MRS. OUDEKERK-Oh, okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-No, you know I think that's a mistake because I'll tell you why, you see in
the printout that EJ sent to us today, page 54, the item that he's got, twelve zero zero nine?
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Yea, I do it's on this sheet.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Twelve zero zero nine, that's right.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-One six nine zero ...
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-It looks weird.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I find one six nine zero.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's supposed to be twelve zero zero nine.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-It's recreation attendant.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I have twelve zero zero nine.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- That's right.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-What?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -I have twelve zero zero nine.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-In your big budget?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yes.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-I had it changed to thirty-five hundred?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Where do you got it?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Under recreation attendant.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Yea, did you have it changed to thirty-five hundred?
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-No, I had eighty-five zero nine.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-No?
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-There was a deduct of thirty-five hundred there because we took out one
position.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Remember, the summer recreation something.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-And I hope that that deduct is showing up here.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-But then Mike went back through and added, when we did the plan to have,
pay as you go there was a need to balance that off with some additional attendance and that's when Harry ...
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-But I'm not sure if we did add additional personnel, I think most of that was
equipment.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-All I know is that Hansen gave us the breakdown, both the revenue side and the
expense side and we went back in and used his printout to correct this and that's what he shows. To tell you
exactly what it is, I can't.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Okay.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Eleanor what's in that figure that you've got there, I canjust give you a run
down and unfortunately ours are not added up in the same way so I'm not quite sure which ones they put in
personnel. But that includes the umpires for the softball say and that's an in and out because the leagues
pay for that before they get done. The youth services director, it's a recreation specialist, it's a recreation
maintenance people, it's Steve Lovering, Harry's assistant. It's the play ground leaders, it's the attendance at
the locker room. The lifeguards are in that. The, I'm trying to think who else, oh the senior typist is in that
and it would be any of the winter personnel that works with the programs.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-But there was also some people that you had to staff if you were going to collect
money, you had to staff some kind of a system to do that and that was reflected in the budget. What the
bottom line, I know that we looked at, we said, what's the net revenue out of it and that's what we were
looking at and then we made a correction to show it in both the expense and the revenue side. Although, I
guess the revenue side didn't show it, we caught that error tonight.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-We put somebody on hourly rate to be on the turn-style to at all times.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Whatever.
COUNCILMAN TUCKER-Yea, whatever.
MRS.OUDEKERK-Okay. Page 57, what community services are, what does that mean? Twelve five for
proposed, just various groups locally, this reflects?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Yes.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO-Big Brothers, Big Sisters, those kinds of things.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Literacy Volunteers.
MRS. OUDEKERK-So this just kind of reflects pretty much what your spending right now.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Yes.
MRS. OUDEKERK-Okay, thank you.
COUNCILMAN CAIMANO- Thank you.
COUNCILMAN GOETZ-Thanks.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Anyone else?
CONNIE GOEDERT-Centennial Drive. I don't want to delay this any longer. I just have a question on the
recreation revenue. Being someone who has worked with the recreation department as far as transporting, I
hope that your being very concerned about the fact that the children that are getting the advantage of the
recreation department are probably getting that advantage because there is no charge. The swimming at
Gurney Lane is probably one of the most with the, I don't want to categorize situations with low income
people in the Town of Queensbury, I know that people use it as babysitters and that's why we offer the
program. We start charging these people, I can see a lot of our children not being able to have this benefit
even if it comes down to learning how to swim, but I'm sure your taking this all into consideration as your
setting up this charge turn.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Connie you bring up the thing that I always been concerned about. I've
always been concerned frankly that everyone in the Town of Queensbury learn to swim because we've got a
lot of natural bodies of water around here and I just think it's a safety thing that you do. Hopefully those
charges would be kept low enough or family passes for summer that they will not keep anybody from doing
that type of activity that would be my hope. The ones of what I call the more glamour type of activities that
aren't so necessary the golf, the tennis and etc., maybe would bare a higher portion. That's one persons
opinion on this board and we haven't done the laundry list yet.
MRS. GOEDERT-I also think that you have to take into consideration that your taking children and giving
them something positive and keeping them off the streets and possibly from doing something negative.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Smashing tombstones in the cemetery.
MRS. GOEDERT -If anything, I would gladly pay for my child to go and I would gladly pay for somebody
else's child to go. I just feel if you have to cut anything that's probably the thing that you should cut. My
next comment is Betty, I'm with the West Glens Falls Emergency Squad and I would gladly take a cadillac
any day when it comes to saving somebody's life as, I will take a fur coat when it comes to a building
instead of a parka.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-When I said cadillac, I was not talking about your necessary equipment or
the state of the art equipment, I'm talking about things that are truly a frill.
MRS. GOEDERT -I think when you encourage somebody, I would gladly send my budget to anybody that
would like it. I would rather sit down across a table with them and explain it because it's easy to look at
dollar figures and not know exactly what they mean. There is very little luxury in the volunteer's life
believe me.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-I'm a firm belief that you need state of the art equipment. I mean, I've been
involved with some medical stuff that you know, I appreciate that kind of stuff.
MRS. GOEDERT-You should of at least gave us an oldsmobile.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-But what I said, when we go into things they are not the things that you
actually use type of thing and I think that's what people mis-communicate. Actually, I tell you not the
rescue squads usually the answer is maybe we can cut, but not the rescue squads because they are the one
out doing the bulk of the work out there today making the bulk of the trips and the bulk of the runs. Oh,
and I want some information from you.
MRS. GOEDERT-Gladly, any time.
SUPERVISOR BRANDT-Who would like to speak to us, ask us questions, chew on or ear or whatever?
FRED CHAMP AGNE- Want a comment?
SUPERVISOR BRANDT -Sure.
MR. CHAMPAGNE-I would suggest that in the interest of response perhaps although the board is very
qualified to answer ninety ninety percent of the questions here tonight. I think it would be in the best
interest to have the department head sitting up there with a copy of their budgets so that we can get right to
the specifics and eliminate specific....what some of these concerns are. I think it becomes Betty, Nick,
Pliney, there are still some differences here of opinions as to some of the answers. I think if you had that
department head there with the budget to that particular department it would be a lot easier, plus E.J.
COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-He's probably the most important person.
MR. CHAMP AGNE-I would think so. I think ifE.J. were here he would of saved you guys a lot of
questions to some tough answers.
UNKNOWN-You might want to check your first page totals going across.
PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED
RESOLUTION ENTERING EXECUTIVE SESSION
RESOLUTION NO. 598, 92
INTRODUCED BY: Mrs. Susan Goetz
WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION
SECONDED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby adjourns from Regular Session and
moves into Executive Session to discuss litigation.
Duly adopted this 4th day of November, 1992, by the following vote:
All Those In Favor: Ayes
All Those Opposed: None
Absent: None
RESOLUTION ADJOURNING EXECUTIVE SESSION
RESOLUTION NO. 599,92
INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano
WHO MOVED FOR ITS ADOPTION
SECONDED BY: Mr. Pliney Tucker
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby adjourns from Executive Session
and enters back into Regular Session.
Duly adopted this 4th, day of November, 1992, by the following vote:
All Those In Favor: Ayes
All Those Opposed: None
Absent: None
RESOLUTION REGARDING SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT ON ASSESSMENT CASE FOR JOHN
BURKE APARTMENTS, INC.
RESOLUTION NO. 600, 92
INTRODUCED BY: Mr. Nick Caimano
who moved for its adoption
SECONDED BY: Mr. Pliney Tucker
WHEREAS, the Town of Queensbury has been party to an assessment challenge brought by John
P. Burke Apartments, Inc. contesting tax assessments for the tax years 1989-90, 1990- 91, 1991-92, and
1992-93 on a certain parcel of property bearing tax map number 97-2-5.2 and
WHEREAS, settlement negotiations have been entered into and the settlement negotiations have
been reviewed with the Town Board by the Town Attorney
NOW, THEREFORE BE IT
RESOLVED, the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby approves of the settlement of
the case of John P. Burke Apartments, Inc. against the Town of Queensbury and with the understanding
that such approvement will still have to be approved by the Supreme Court, and be it further
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury acknowledges as part of the
settlement a tax refund will be owed in the amount of Ten Thousand Eight Hundred and thirty eight dollars
($10,838.00) said tax rate to be paid for from the appropriate district accounts.
Duly adopted this 4th day of November, 1992 by the following vote:
AYES: Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Goetz, Mr. Caimano, Mr. Tucker, Mr. Brandt
NOES: None
ABSENT: None
No further action taken.
On motion, the meeting was adjourned.
Respectfully Submitted,
Darleen M. Dougher
Town Clerk
Town of Queensbury