Loading...
1985-08-13 185 TOWN BOARD MEETING AUGUST 13, 1985 TOWN BOARD MEMBERS Mrs. Frances Walter-Supervisor Mr. Daniel Olson-Councilman Dr. Charles Eisenhart-Councilman Mr. Daniel Morrell-Councilman Mrs. Betty Monahan-Councilman Mr. Wilson Mathias-Town Counsel PRESS: G.F. Post Star, W WSC TOWN OFFICIALS: Mr. Paul Naylor GUESTS: Mr. Carr, Mr. Stewart, Mr. Cardinale, Mr. Altare, Mr. Burch, Mr. Cline, Mr. Harad, Mrs. Waite, Mr. Pitman, Mr. Skellie, Mr. Singer, Mr. Coccia, Mr. Kilburn, Mr. Cutting, Mr. Stranahan, Mr. Stevens, Mr. Alden, Mr. DeMars PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE LED BY COUNCILMAN OLSON MEETING OPENED 7:38 P.M. QUEENSBURY BOARD OF HEALTH PUBLIC HEARING NOTICE SHOWN 7:39 P.M. Sewage Variance Application of William Ross-property Bay Parkway, Assembly Point Tax Map No. 9-1-16.1 SUPERVISOR WALTER-We are looking at the Town Sanitary Sewage Disposal Ordinance Sewage Article 3 Section 3.030 ...Mr. Ross is looking for a variance he does not comply with the 200' set back from the shore line... Mr. Carr the builder of the proposed system is present tonight... MR. CARR-The application is self explanatory the problem arises with the 200' from the Lake requirement, the lot is only 160' deep there is no other alternative. I have met with Mr. Dean of the Queensbury Bldg. Dept. and Mr. Glass of ENCON and test pits were dug and found that the proposed system would be workable. The system is the same as Mr. Bob Stewart has next door. It is a workable system. COUNCILMAN EISENHART-What is the present use of the property? MR. CARR-Vacant COUNCILMAN EISENHART-This is in order to build a house on the property? MR. CARR-Yes COUNCILMAN OLSON-There is no house there, it is vacant land. Does the size of the lot meet the requirements to construct on? MR. CARR-There is an application for a variance for a set back from the lake... COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-How many square feet on this lot? COUNCILMAN EISENHART-Approximately 9 - 10 thousand square feet... COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Is this a pre-existing individual lot? MR. CARR-A pre-existing lot...with its own identity...Mr. Caffry researched that and had a ruling from a Judge that it is now and has always been a seperate lot. MR. BOB STEWART-Attorney-Speaking on behalf of myself and my wife who owns the property adjacent also authorized to speak on behalf of Mr. Milford Lester and Katherine O'Keefe the neighboring properties...1. on behalf of all three of the property owners we approve of Mr. Ross's application and we would ask that x_86 you would approve it. He has a substantial lot of 135' on the lake but is a pie shaped lot that goes to about 45'. The ordinance states 200' or more back from the lake for a septic system. As I have pointed out at many meetings there is no existing lot of a depth that complies with that so each applicant has to come before this board (in that area). The test holes were dug by ENCON and found sand, he could probably put an ordinary leach field but he has agreed to go the extra expense to have the Wisconsin Mound System which is considered the state of the art. I have this system and it works. This lot was a pre-existing lot. It is part of a subdivision that was laid out in the 1920's. Mr. Ross has owned the property for over ten years, he is now getting to the point where he would like to build his year around home. We have no objection to any of that. COUNCILMAN EISENHART-You have no objection of putting a house on that small of a lot? MR. STEWART-No. We have seen the plan...a two car garage is part of the plans... COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Mr. Stewart, at one time you were having trouble with your septic system, has that been solved? MR. STEWART-Yes. My last solution was the mound system which was in place about five years ago and that has worked without fail. (Discussion held in regard to distances from each adjoining lot and the proposed system...) COUNCILMAN OLSON-Questioned if there were wells in the area? MR. STEWART-There are no private wells on that section of Assembly Point.... water comes from the lake...some residences in Shore Colony have wells... I have my water checked with the Glens Falls Hosp. about every two years and our water is pure. COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Mr. Carr, does Mr. Ross have any intention of drilling a well? MR. CARR-The water will come from the Lake. Most of the wells have been the 500' - 700' range have sulfa water... COUNCILMAN MORRELL-The three adjoining property owners, you being one of them have no objection to this variance now. What would happen, using your legal expertise here, that ten years down the road you sell your property and the new owner has all sorts of problems because we granted the variance in 1985. Is there any way we could have a signed statement or something on record as to the fact that if we granted this variance that at the time the three adjoining property owners had no objection, so that if a new property owner comes in and runs into problems because we approved this variance then they could understand what was happening. MR. STEWART-I would have no problem with that...I will draw up and submit a statement...Your present zoning says every lot on Assembly Point should be one acre. When you passed that a few years ago almost every lot on Assembly Point was developed and there is not a single lot of one acre. None of us meets those criteria. We all have our septic systems as far back from the lake as we can get them, and we have all designed state of the art septic systems as presently known. COUNCILMAN MORRELL-My only concern is for adjoining property owners to be aware of what was done. SUPERVISOR WALTER-Asked for further public comments...hearing none the public hearing was closed. 8:05 P.M. RESOLUTION TO APPROVE VARIANCE RESOLUTION NO. 2, Introduced by Dr. Charles Eisenhart who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: WHEREAS, the local Board of Health of the Town of Queensbury has reviewed the request for a variance of the Sanitary Sewage Disposal Ordinance requested by Mr. William Ross and has determined the following: 1. That there are special circumstances or conditions of which the strict application 187 of the provisions of this Ordinance would deprive the applicant of reasonable use of such land. 2. That the Variance would not be materially detrimental to the purposes or objectives of this Ordinance, or to other adjoining properties or otherwise conflict with the purpose or objectives of any plan or policy of the Town. 3. That the granting of the Variance is necessary for the reasonable use of the land and that the Variance is the minimum Variance which would alleviate the specific unnecessary hardship found by the local Board of Health to affect the applicant. SPECIAL CONDITION-Signed affidavit by three neighbors indicating position of system will not affect their properties shall be filed with the application. NOW, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, pursuant to the above findings the local Board of Health has approved the variance of Mr. William Ross, property located on Bay Parkway, Assembly Point, Tax Map Number 9-1-16.1. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None COUNCILMAN OLSON-This variance is only for the individual applying. Tt cannot be passed on if another person, purchases the property before the system is in place.... QUEENSBURY BOARD OF HEALTH ADJOURNS...8:08P.M. QUEENSBURY TOWN BOARD 8:08 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING Notice Shown Opened 8:09 P.M. Proposed Local Law - To Regulate the Operation of the Off-Road Recreational Vehicles SUPERVISOR WALTER-The Town Board has been faced with quite a few complaints from residents in the Town of Queensbury, that their safety and welfare was being disturbed by off-road recreation vehicles. The local law that we have for public hearing is based upon a local law in the Town of Moreau. Asked for public input... MR. GARY CARDINALE-JECKLE AND SONS HONDA-The biggests retailer of this type of vehicle in this area...I would like to say I agree with the Town's concept that the laws are needed. I apologize to everyone in this room that has been offended or harassed or any way inconvenienced by all-terrain vehicles. I think ...that one or two percent spoil it for the other 98-99%. 1. The State was aware that laws were needed...it was signed into law August 7 or 9 ..the law governs every use of ATV's (copies given to Town Board) this law become effective Jan. 1, 1987. I believe this is what you people are after in terms that are fair to everyone to allow people to use these. Requested that the Town Board take the time to digest the State's Law, I agree you have an immediate problem and you have to act on it sooner than the State Law becomes effective but in many cases these laws address the areas you are interested in, in some areas they are different than your proposal. When the State Law becomes effective it will over-ride almost all areas that municipalities have to govern or make laws in. The State Law could eliminate the need in 16 mos., we will have to re-educate the public the courts the law officers and those people using and offended by three wheelers. The Town of Fort Edward passed an ATV regulations but they were things that both sides could live with, they did not go to extremes. In one or too cases, the proposed law is too harsh, these areas may be changed in 16 mos. when the State Law becomes effective. Noted that Jeckle and Sons are educating their sales people to become safety trainers...will have schools that I88 people can attend...this training is stipulated in the N.Y. State Law. COUNCILMAN MORRELL-Mr. Cardinale, do you think that your training program is going to instruct people not to go on other people's private property? MR. CARDINALE-That will be part of it, ...We will tell them yes, can we prevent them, no. COUNCILMAN MORRELL-You are asking us to wait 16 mos.? MR. CARDINALE-No, I as asking you to review the State Law, and more closely align your law with theirs. COUNCILMAN MORRELL-Please do not take offense, I believe in the individual's right to privacy of ownership and peace of ownership...I have been a 1000' or more from Potter Road and I could not talk to the person next to me because of the noise, that is City owned property, which is posted. I do not see how your training program is going to educate these people not to ride on someone elses land? --� MR. CARDINALE-I am not trying to substute my training program for your proposed regulation, you need to adapt some regulations, I am saying study the N.Y. State Law... COUNCILMAN MORRELL-I do not think N.Y. State knows what our problems are in Queensbury. MR. CARDINALE-In 16 mos. it will over- ride what you have done... COUNCILMAN MORRELL-We can correct it 16 mos. ahead of time.... MR. CARDINALE-The N.Y. State Law only varies in a few areas from your regulations. I do not think it makes sense to incorporate a law now that will be changed in 16 mos. The N.Y. State Law is more thorough...reviewed the law... MR. OLSON-...axe you a resident of Queensbury? MR. CARDINALE-Yes...Glen Lake... COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Spark arrestors are on ATV's that you are selling now, when did that become a part of ATV's? MR. CARDINALE-Honda has always had them, 1970... COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-If they are not on, is there a way they can be put on? MR. CARDINALE-Yes. COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Would there be a possibility of you dealers putting a program together to start issuing safety certificates within the Town of Queensbury if we asked you too, within three months? MR. CARDINALE-We are sending personell from our dealership to SVIA who are training people to become trainors, instructing instructors so that they can be certified to give classes. COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-When will the certified instructors become available to the area? MR. CARDINALE-In about two months. J COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Are any other dealers in our area sending people to be trained? MR. CARDINALE-Conversations that I have had was that they were going to pursue it... COUNCILMAN MORRELL-I am not as concerned on how they will ride but where they will ride. MR. CARDINALE-Your law and the State Law deals with that. Noted that there is a program under Parks and Recreation to lease land from International Paper on West Mt. that those vehicles would be allowed to operate... COUNCILMAN OLSON-This is a proposal... MR. CARDINALE-I was told that the budget for the proposal was accepted and the trails would be workable in the spring. SUPERVISOR WALTER-I sat in on that meeting, also Mrs. Monahan, the trail system a very small part in the Town of Queensbury most in the Town of Lake Luzerne, it would be a county project, ...this proposal has only gone through the committee and has not yet gone before the Warren County Board of Supervisors. There has just been discussion... MR. CARDINALE-I was involved in helping lay the trails out and as a show of good will American Honda through our dealership gave to Warren County Parks and Recreation a three wheel all-terrain vehicle to help lay the trails out and in the future maintain and police them. COUNCILMAN OLSON-Suggested that the City could use such a vehicle to patrol thier water shed property.... SUPERVISOR WALTER-You may want to donate one to the Warren County Sheriff's Dept., I was going to ask the Sheriff's Committee that they include one in their budget next year. i COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Already ATV's are allowed to use some northern portions of the Snowmobile trails in the wintertime... COUNCILMAN OLSON-They pay a permit fee. MR. CARDINALE-(Regarding the proposed local law) paragraph 3.5 "It shall be unlawful to operate any off-road recreational vehicle within 500 feet of any dwelling other than the dwelling house of the operator."...I would like to see something that is fair. The N.Y. State Law Item 26.10 sets it as 100 feet and other parts of the law ban the usage during certain hours. Midnight to Six A.M. speed not greater than needed to propel the vehicle forward. COUNCILMAN OLSON-Questioned if the property line was considered the dwelling? MR. CARDINALE-In the case of paragraph 3.5 that you align it more in line with the State at 100'...Section 5 under penalties and 6 confiscation, under item 2289.2 page 7 of the New York State Laws says that each and every violation can have a maximum of $100.00 fine. I believe that the Qsby. proposed penalties does not fit the crime... MR. GUY ALTRE-Illinois Ave.-I do not think that the law as it has been presented will prevent the problems...bandits will be bandits...this law will only hurt the persons who drive honestly. Noted that he was handicapped and used the vehicle to go into places to fish where he is unable to get before...l. How will this be enforced? 2. Is it right that persons will be inconvienced by officers to see written premission? People that give us oral permission will not give written permission...they put themselves up for liable suits if something happens...3. Suggested that every vehicle be registered with a small fee and large numbers be placed on the vehicle...4. A Law is needed and education must be given to all drivers...5. It should be the responsibility of the Town to educate the people...and designate places to ride...6. This law will discriminate against handicapped persons...7. You already have trespass laws, can you enforce them? Enforce your trespass law, please do not make a law breaker out of me. MR. CLYDE BURCH-29 Buena Vista Avenue-I do object to living in a dust storm...in the area of Potter Road...my house faces Potter Road ...noted that when a sqadron of the vehicles pass by it is impossible to hear then the dust settles..I have lived for 7 years at Potter and Buena Vista, this problem has become increasingly greater as the years have gone by. I would like as a resident of Potter Road area to sit in my front yard, I have never sat there in seven years...I think that the fines are a little excessive and the confiscation is tough but if thats what it takes to get people back to where they can sit down and enjoy the home, I have waited a long time to afford, them I think now is the time. MRS. MARGARET WAITE-Owner of Wait's Cycle Center...when we sell a bike we do show them how to ride it and ask them to ride it in a prudent manner but when they leave our place they are on their own. Questioned the 500', we own several properties on Dix and County Line Road and that would not be 500' if you O put them all together—this might effect our business very much, we are not the largest dealer but the oldest, forty years is quite some time. If you say they cannot go within 500' that is quite some distance ... If they are having a problem on Potter Road, they have no right on Potter Road if they are not licensed...If they cannot enforce that law to keep them off the Road how are they going to keep them out of the fields? Noted that 100' is quite a distance... On the new vehicles the law states you cannot sell a vehicle that is too noisy, what they do is buy the vehicle, take it home and take off the muffler to hear all the noise, there should be a law against that. Noted that the ATV are used by farmers they may have to go near someone's property to get some animals. Are they liable for a fine for this? MR. DAVID CLINE-No. Queensbury-I am in favor of the ordinance as proposed...I feel 500' is not enough, sixteen months is too long to wait to enact State Laws. We need some laws today to protect the taxpayers of Queensbury. MR. THOMAS HARIG-Sweet Briar Lane-I have lived in the area two years... I have noticed an increase in traffic along Potter Road...100' is inadequate...A Deputy sat on the corner in June and stopped 42 individuals on a Saturday Afternoon, that is forty-two layers of dust...there has been poor enforcement probably because of poor cooperation between the agencies involved. The Mayor has indicated that he was thinking about putting up barracades in the Potter Road area...I am concerned over the age of the riders, appear to be 7 to 8 years old...I would think that you might consider that there must be direct adult supervision. We are also concerned about the fire hazard in the water shed area, there are a lot of beer parties held in the evening...We request that you require spark arresting mufflers. We are concerned about the County Trails, on West Mt. I suspect that entry to that will be along Potter Road, I suspect that the kids that live behind me are not going to walk their machines down there and start them up. If you could figure out access to the trails other than my back yard I would appreciate that. MR. CHARLES STEVENSON-Upper Bay Road-I have a three wheeler, I use mine to check my property, I carry my chain saw on it, this law would prevent me from doing so because of the 500'. I have eighty acres...you will deprive me of my right to check my property with the machine I would have to use a four wheel drive which would cost more money. If this passes, you must be 500' from a neighbors dwelling ...the 500' is way too much, at the present time my property on the highway is only 400' wide and therefore I would be violating the law, I think 100' would be plenty. MR. RICHARD PITMAN-68 Main St. W.G.F. - I represent the Kawasaki Shop on --� the Boulevard-The vehicles are sold to farmers and people who like to plow their driveways with them. Anyone who plows their driveway would be closer than 100' to their neighbors...it is a lot quieter than a snowmobile or snow blower or lawn mower, why should be banned from plowing our driveways with them. SUPERVISOR WALTER-How do you feel about the 500'? MR. RICHARD PITMAN-I think it is too excessive. (Discussion held on mufflers) COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-The mufflers should meet certain requirements... MR. PITMAN-The mufflers that come on ATV's are approved by the Federal Government. COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-We should not just say we require a muffler, because it is possible to take off an approved muffler and put on a non approved one, so we should have specifications regarding the muffler. MR. JOHN SKELLIE-8 Richardson Street-Wilton Town Board passed a law on the ATV's the law requires that everyone will have a 3x5 registered number, all drivers will have approved state helmets and eye protection, the machines will be allowed to drive between the hours of 8:OOA.M. and 10:00P.M., anyone under the age of 18 will have the supervision of an Adult, anyone caught with an unregistered vehicle will be fined $50.00, anyone caught breaking the law provided by the Town will be fined $100.00 and the registration certificate will be held up for one year. I have a three wheeler and I agree that the 500' limit is too much, they have less than that for snowmobiles, they have a right to cross the road, we will not have that. The vehicles are used for chores around the yard, it is a shame that after spending all that money we cannot use them on our own property, 100' would be plenty. Lys MR. PAUL BAIRD-Corinth Road-I think people should be able to use ATV's but not on private property, the dust that is created is terrible...I do not like all the fines, they could change a few things in there... MR. KEN SULLIVAN-Star Route Ridge Road-Why should all these people be permitted to use private property? I think the law is very good... MR. RICK SINGER-Ridge Road-We are talking about people not the machine...the control of people who are misusing machinery that is what this is all about. On the basis that the proposed law is ambiguous, ill-defined, poorly drafted, and not fairly drafted to protect the rights of the citizens of the Town of Queensbury I request that the Board not adopt the present proposed law as it is written. (Specific Items) 3.1 regarding written permission...there are lands that exist and people like myself have no way of determining who owns those lands. Questioned — who can you get permission from those properties that are listed as Unknown Owner? There are laws on the books regarding trespassing and if someone would enforce those laws then we would not need Section 3.1 ... COUNCILMAN MORRELL-So I have to post my land because you want to use it? MR. SINGER-I posted land that I own and people took the signs down, I do not understand what you are saying? Section 32 Noise- Define loud noise in detail... SUPERVISOR WALTER-I am going to ask that, that be revised, Section 32 MR. SINGER-I also have difficulty with the wording of peace and tranquility of other persons...SECTION 3.3 in my opinion this is poorly worded and drafted and vague, what is reckless and negligent so as to endanger...I would like to know who the prophet is that is going to come down and tell us that this individual is likely to endanger the welfare of someone else...I do not think that that can be reasonably determined...SECTION 3.4 what is reasonable and prudent in reference to speed, if the Town feels that no vehicle should go over thirty miles per hour then the Town should say that or any other number, but what is reasonable depends on the operator and equipment and terrain....this is poorly written, poorly drafted and poorly considered... SECTION 3.5 ...you are saying that all the people on Assembly Point who own less than an acre of land cannot operate anyone of the vehicles that this law designed for ...you cannot operate it inside your own garage you cannot run the damn thing in your basement...because your not 500' away from another house. I own motorcycles, and I cannot operate it on my own property...I do not know what the right footage is, even 100' is excessive in some areas...SECTION 4.1 The only objection I have with this section is it is limited only to off-road recreational vehicles, I wish the Town would adopt this law and enfore it so I can get some sleep on Ridge Road with the Cars, Trucks, Motorcycles and everthing is running up and down the road. SECTION 6 Confiscation - I think that this is unusually harsh punishment ...under what section of the N.Y State Law allows for confiscation under a misdemeanor... This proposed law is not maintaining the rights to private property but limiting the rights to some people to the enjoyment of their own property. In summary the terms and conditions proposed by this law are basically in my opinion unenforceable since they are undefinable, ill-defined and not properly defined and I think that the provisions are carelessly throughout and badly drafted and confiscatory of real property rights granted to us by the Constitution of the United States, the Bill of Rights legislative history the federal legislative history and the common laws of the United States. SUPERVISOR WALTER-This proposed law has been reviewed by the Warren County District Attorney who felt that the items were something that he could defend against and also the Warren Co. Sheriff's Dept. felt that what they were lacking _ as far as enforcement was a local law and that this local law if it were adopted as it is would be helpful to them in apprehending those who were in violation of the law. The District Attorney did state that we should stipulate in the law that a vehicle have a stock muffler... MR. JAMES COCCIA-White Pine Road-SECTION 5 Penalty- I have seen many under the age that could have a drivers license, the parents are giving them these vehicles, the fine provision, says the violator, the little eight year old girl that tore by my house and almost got killed was the violator but may we should have an and/or the owner, maybe it is time we go after her father for letting her ride. MR. KENNETH KILBURN-177 Meadowbrook Road-I ride and my children ride, never at any time do I feel that we infringe on anyones rights by riding, we do not tear up property or do vandalism I feel that the law should be scrapped. You need 192 more information to consider the total picture, not just a few complaints...it is not a good law...confiscating the equipment goes way out of bounds ... One problem is that we have not got one legal place where we can ride...noted that there were the same problems with Snowmobiles and trails were made...If this law is passed will it cover golf carts? TOWN COUNSEL-I think that it probably does. COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Mr. Kilburn, you have trained your children to ride, would you give some thoughts as to what the regulations should be as far as children, age and under what kind of supervision etc. and get back to me? MR. KILBURN-Yes. (Discussion held on insurance...) MR. DICK CUTTING-Lake Sunnyside-I am against this law it is discrimintory and an invasion of privacy ...golf carts are an off road recreational vehicle...regarding written permission-do all golfers have written permission to ride their golf carts across the road, close to other people's houses, I do not think so. If you pass this law you will have all the big wheels at the G.F. Country Club down your throats...I am for a law, we should have an interim Town Law registering them, give the people a certain amount of time to register these vehicles, and have numbers on them like the Town of Wilton has...why penalize me for what someone else does...You will be requiring a letter to ride on someone elses property, do you have a sample? SECTION 3.2 why can't that be modified to say with other than a factory type muffler without modification...SECTION 3.3 I agree with that—we have had one person on the east side injured on an ATC accidents that I know of, there has been a total of five or six in the entire west side of Queensbury. I do not think this is an issue...The people should be trained and at what ages they should be supervised... regarding speed, reasonable and prudent, by whom? SECTION 3.5 500' I disagree with that...I use the vehicle to carry tools...this will be taken away from me because I would be closer than 500' from my neighbor. What defines a tractor? Would an ATC be considered a tractor when used for snow plowing or mowing? Noted a lot of motels use golf carts for transportation of supplies...Regarding the Lake, in the winter time we have motorcycle and three wheel races on Lake Sunnyside ...this is something else you will take away...the privilege to these people practicing and learning how to handle bikes at high speed... recommended that we have trails... What constitutes an emergency vehicle? COUNCILMAN OLSON-That is in regard to fire companies and rescue squads and Police Agencies... MR. CUTTING-Does that mean that we can put a blue light on them and run them any where we want to? COUNCILMAN OLSON-I would say it would have to be used in the rescue of someone or assisting someone in an emergency. MR. CUTTING-Under State Law, from the time we leave the house regardless of the vehicle we are in, when in response to an emergency, until we return back what ever we are on is considered an emergency vehicle. COUNCILMAN OLSON-I thought it meant that a Fire Company or Police Dept. could own an emergency vehicle, to be used for emergency service... MR. CUTTING-I have used my vehicle to transport the Parking Police back and forth at the Balloon festival and to transport handicapped persons...according to this I can no longer do this...who would I get written permission from at the Warren County Airport? Why can't I use my machine on my own property if the motel owners can use golf carts for maintenance...? COUNCILMAN EISEN HA RT-Beginning January 1, 1987 no person shall operate ATV's on a frozen surface of public water within 100' of a person including but not limited to a skater, nor in a pond ...an ATV 100' of a fishing shelter except that the minimum speed required to make a forward motion or in an area cleared for skating purposes unless that area is necessary for access to public water... MR. CUTTING-Insurance, I have full liability at the maximum amount...insurance is available for these machines. MR. SKIP STRANAHAN-Upper Bay Road-Can't we buy a plate right now for an 193 ATV? COUNCILMAN EISENHART-It is provided for in the law but does not take effect until 1987. MR. STRANAHAN-I think a plate would be a big deterent. It identifies who was doing it...Section 3.5 would stop me from entering 4000 acres on French Mt. from my own property, I own three acres at the foot of French Mt. which is adjoined by 250 more of Stranahan Industries which is adjoined by 40 more of my wife's and mine...500' in my three acres there is not 500' I couldn't start my vehicle, I couldn't garage it, load it or anything... E SUPERVISOR WALTER-You do not want any footage at all or you think 500' is too much? MR. STRANAHAN-In looking at the first paragraph, my log skidder could fit in it...under definitions... MR. ROY STEVENS-LAKE LU ZE R NE-(presented clippings to Town Board)Two items brought me here the Article regarding ATV trails on Luzerne Mt. and Post li Star report of August 13...If the Queensbury Law is adopted one result may be that greater interest will be focused on the proposal to open 500 acres of ATV trails on Luzerne Mt. Lake Luzerne. I do not represent a horse association but I am a member, I request that the Queensbury Town Board to review any request made to the County regarding those acreage to Luzerne Property, I think it would be detrimental to the horse industry as we know it in the North County...ATV's and horses will never be campatible. It took 35 or more years to develope a horse industry as we know it with hundred of miles of trails used by visiting tourists at our ranches. I do not think would relish the idea of riding on a trail and be confronted with an ATV. In the future this will be a big issue, tourism is a growth industry in the north if a horseman feels his rights are taken away by mechanism of the trails he will cease to come to northern N.Y. and that big industry will fall to zero. My request is that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury take into consideration a resuggestion of this proposal of adapting any Lake Luzerne Properties on or near horse trails very seriously. COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Are any horse trails on IP land? MR. STEVENS-no COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Is there a place on ATC so that they can be numbered like racing bikes, plates on front and back and each side? MR. CARDINALE-Most machines are not manufacture now with that purpose in mind, but it is municipalties and states adopting rules and regulations like that, that will force manufactures to comply, they do it with racing bikes because that is necessary so there is no reason it cannot be done on ATV's... COUNCILMAN MONAHAN-Can the numbers be made so that they can be seen at night? MR. CARDINALE-Yes. Plates can be affixed to machines that are not factory equipped... N.Y. State Law will become effective in 16 months, they have addressed every topic that was addressed here tonight, I urge you to go back and look at every topic that this proposal attempts to address and read what N.Y. St. has already done and incorporate it. MR. HERRICK-I think that the Vehicle and Traffic Law under definitions it clearly defines what an off-road vehicle is, a golf cart is not one... you also could reference the Vehicle and Traffic Law under Section 3.4...Police and Emergency vehicle are also defined under V&T Law...Regarding Insurance, if the Town gives someone permission to use a vehicle on town property and an accident takes place, isn' t the town liable? TOWN COUNSEL-I am sure the Town would be named... COUNCILMAN OLSON-I would suspect that Town properties would be off limits to ATVs. MR. HERRICK-The City of Glens Falls will certainly also deny use of the Water Shed Property... 194 MR. CUTTING-I am for visible numbers on these machines a token fee of 2-5 dollars to be registered with the Town so these people who cause the problem can be the ones that are penalized. If you go to a number system I want number 1. MR. CECIL ALDEN-VanDusen Rd.-I think that if many of your laws were enforced and encourage the Sheriff's Dept. to enforce the laws as they stand, a lot of your problems would lessen. SUPERVISOR WALTER-Asked for further comments... TOWN COUNSEL-Noted that there will have to be some additions made in Section 6... j i SUPERVISOR WALTER-I have just polled the Board and because of the amount of comments that were made that they would like to take this up in a workshop...no decision will be made tonight. Asked for further comments, hearing none the Public Hearing was closed 10:37 P.M. 3 min. Recess Back in Session 10:40 P.M. RESOLUTIONS RESOLUTION TO APPROVE MINUTES RESOLUTION NO. 182, Introduced by Mr. Daniel Morrell who moved for its adoption, seconded by Dr. Charles Eisenhart: RESOLVED, that the Town Board Minutes of July 23, 1985 be and hereby are approved. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None r Absent:None RESOLUTION TO APPROVE BINGO LICENSE RESOLUTION NO. 183, Introduced by Mr. Daniel Olson who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mrs. Betty Monahan: RESOLVED, that Bingo License No. 17049 be and hereby is approved allowing West Glens Falls Volunteer Fire Co. to hold Bingo Occasions from August 10, 1985 through February 1, 1986. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None RESOLUTION TO TRANSFER FUNDS RESOLUTION NO. 184, Introduced by Dr. Charles Eisenhart who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: WHEREAS, the postal machine used by the Town of Queensbury is seventeen years —� old, obsolete and periodically requires excessive repairs, and WHEREAS, the cost of the new machine was not anticipated in the 1985 budget, NOW, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, to transfer $3,726.00 from A1990.440 Contingent Account to A1620.200 Building Equipment Account. 195 Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None RESOLUTION TO ACCEPT DEED TO TOWN OF QUEENSBURY FOR PREMISES FOR TOWN HIGHWAY TO BE KNOWN AS FOX HOLLOW LANE, (additional) RESOLUTION NO. 185, Introduced by Mrs. Betty Monahan who moved for its adoption, seconded by Dr. Charles Eisenhart: WHEREAS, Lucille E. Weaver has executed and offered a deed for a Town Roadway not less than fifty (50) feet in width and an easement agreement for drainage purposes which is more particularly described in the documents marked schedule "A" and "B" annexed hereto and made a part hereof, and WHEREAS, Paul H. Naylor, Superintendent of Highways of the Town of Queensbury, has advised that he had made the necessary inspection of the right of way clearing, sub-base preparation, drainage implementation, and surface treatment and finds that such work has been performed in accordance with the standards and requirements of the Town of Queensbury, and he recommends that this Board accept this land for highway purposes into the Town Highway System, and WHEREAS, Thomas K. Flaherty, Superintendent of Water of the Town of Queensbury, has advised that he had made the necessary inspection of Water Line Installation in the proposed highway which is located within the geographical boundaries of the Queensbury Consolidated Water District and finds that said installation has been made in accordance with the standards and requirements of the Town of Queensbury and that he recommends that this Board accept this land insofar as the water installation is concerned, and WHEREAS, the title to the land proposed to be conveyed has been approved by Wilson S. Mathias, Esq., Counsel to the Board, NOW, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Supervisor is hereby authorized to execute the aforesaid drainage easement agreement, and be it further, RESOLVED, that the aforementioned deed be and the same is hereby accepts and approved and that the Town Clerk be hereby authorized and directed to cause said deed to be recorded in the Warren County Clerk's Office after which said deed shall be properly filed and maintained in the office of the Town Clerk of the Town of Queensbury, and be it further RESOLVED, that this new road, be hereby added to the official inventory of Town Highways, be be described as follows: Road No. 387 Description: North/South Name: Fox Hollow Lane Mileage: 1,278 feet Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None (Schedule A & B are on file in the Town Clerk's Office along with the letters of approval from the Highway Supt. and Water Supt.) RESOLUTION TO ACCEPT DEED TO TOWN OF QUEENSBURY FOR PREMISES FOR TOWN HIGHWAYS TO BE KNOWN AS PINECROFT DRIVE AND THISTLEWOOD DRIVE RESOLUTION NO. 186, Introudced by Mrs. Betty Monahan who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: J-90 WHEREAS, Maine Enterprises, Inc. has executed and offered a deed for Town Roadways not less than fifty (50) feet in width and an easement agreement for drainage purposes which are more particularly described in the documents marked schedule "A" and "B" annexed hereto and made a part hereof, and WHEREAS, Paul H. Naylor, Superintendent of Highways of the Town of Queensbury, has advised that he had made the necessary inspection of the right of way clearing, sub-base preparation, drainage implementation, and surface treatment and finds that such work has been performed in accordance with the standards and requirements of the Town of Queensbury, and he recommends that this Board accept this land for highway purposes into the Town Highway System, and WHEREAS, the title to the land proposed to be conveyed has been approved by Wilson S. Mathias, Esq., Counsel to the Board, NOW, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Supervisor is hereby authorized to execute and aforesaid drainage easement agreement, and be it further, I RESOLVED, that the aforementioned deed be and the same is hereby accepted and approved and that the Town Clerk be hereby authorized and directed to cause said deed to be recorded in the Waren County Clerk's Office after which said deed shall be properly filed and maintained in the office of the Town Clerk of the Town of Queensbury, and be it further RESOLVED, that these new roads, be hereby added to the official inventory of Town Highways, to be described as follows: Road No. 411 Description: East/West Name: Pinecroft Drive Mileage 427 feet Road No. 412 Description: East/West Name: Thistlewood Drive Mileage 583 feet Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None (Schedule A & B will be on file in the Town Clerk's Office along with letters from the Highway Supt.) SUPERVISOR WALTER-requested that the Water Dept. also place a letter on file stating that these accepted roads are not in the Water Dist. COMMUNICATIONS -The following mobile home applications were presented to the Town Board: Don Wood of Warren Lane to replace a mobile home Joseph & Barbara Saville to Feld Avenue to replace a mobile home Richard Phillips of Sanders Rd. to replace a mobile home Delton & Aleane Tabor of 22 Luzerne Road -transfer of ownership... DISCUSSION HELD: Counsel has reviewed the applications and have also reviewed the current mobile home ordinance, also reviewed Local Law #2 of 1985 which is the mobile home moratorium ... I cannot think of any rational of avoiding the moratorium..recommended that the fees be returned...no permit can be given... Councilman Monahan-Questioned if it was possible to amend the Local Law #2 to exclude replacements? Counsel-You would have to have a public hearing... The Moratorium will be over October 25, 1985...Supervisor Walter-Suppose there are zones established for mobile homes and there exists mobile homes outside these zones and they wish to replace them, are they grandfathered? Counsel-I think that you could place a period of time they would have to come into compliance. Councilman Monahan-questioned if mobile homes placed before the original ordinance would be grandfathered...Counsel-no...It was the consensus of the Board to table the applications until after the moratorium...if for any reason any applicant wishes to withdraw their fee would be returned.,. 197 Mr. Saville-noted that he understood from the building inspector that he had to order the trailer before the application was submitted...questioned what should they do ...also questioned if he had to hook up to Town Water... Supervisor Walter-requested that Town Counsel contract Mr. Saville and review their application... BID OPENING August 13, 1985 at 2:00 P.M. 1986 D.C.O. VAN Ford Garage Co. Inc. P.O. box 679 G.F. N.Y. 12801 1986 Dodge Van $10,207.00 (Non Col. attached) Maltbie's Garage Co. P.O.Box 311 -- Lake George, N.Y. 12845 1986 Chev. %Ton $10,096.00 (non-Col. attached) Ltr.-Highway Dept. recommended the bid of Maltbie's Garage, on file... RESOLUTION TO ACCEPT BID RESOLUTION NO. 187, Introduced by Mrs. Betty Monahan who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: WHEREAS, The Town Board of the Town of Queensbury requested that we advertise for bids for a 1986 Van for the Queensbury DCO and WHEREAS, two bids were submitted and received and opened at the specified time and place by the Director of Purchasing/Town Clerk Donald A. Chase and such bids were then turned over to Mr. Paul Naylor, Highway Supt. for his recommendation, and WHEREAS, Mr. Paul Naylor, Highway Supt. by letter has recommended that the bid be awarded to Maltbie's Garage of Lake George, New York, NOW, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Queensbury hereby accepts the bid of Maltbie's Garage, Lake George, N.Y. for a 1986 Van in the amount of $10,096.00 and be it further RESOLVED, that the financing for such Van is in the 1985 Budget. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None -Ltr. Planning Board-approval of the rezoning request of Daniel & George Drellos of Luzerne Road LI to LI-AMH on file Discussion held-Councilman Monahan requested that the minutes reflect who was at the meeting and their vote...would also like the definitions spelled out in the the Planning Board decision...Counsel-recommended that the definitions be reviewed for LI-AMH... Councilman Olson, qustioned the additional acreage that was added to the requested zone change...the consensus was to table any action until further information is obtained... Supervisor Walter-The Court Clerk's Mrs. Joslyn and Mrs. Stockwell request permission to attend a training seminar... RESOLUTION TO ATTEND SEMINAR RESOLUTION NO. 188, Introduced by Dr. Charles Eisenhart who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mrs. Betty Monahan: RESOLVED, that permission is hereby granted to Mrs. Phyllis Joslyn and Mrs. Karen Stockwell to attend a training seminar for traffic safety law enforcement and disposition 198 on August 26th 1985 at 7:00 P.M. at the Warren County Municipal Center, Lake George, N.Y. and be it further RESOLVED, that the Town Board authorizes all reasonable and necessary expenses. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None r Supervisor Walter-Request from Mr. Thomas Flaherty...for the Water Supt. and Chief Operator to attend the Fall Meeting of the American Water Works Assoc. to be held in Canada Sept. 10-13th 1985...Discussion held, questioned if either party had a part in the seminar... RESOLUTION TO DENY ATTENDANCE AT SEMINAR RESOLUTION NO. 189, Introduced by Dr. Charles Eisenhart who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: RESOLVED, that the Town Board hereby denies the request for the Queensbury Water Supt. and Chief Operator to attend the American Water Works Conference in Canada on September 10-13 1985. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Walter Noes: Mrs. Monahan Absent: None Supervisor Walter- I would say that one could go but not both, noted that another revised request should be submitted to the Board... TOWN COUNSEL-The Building Dept. referred to me several violations, proceedings which are now in Court, regarding alleged violations of the Zoning Dept. Three complaints were of several persons parking tractor trailers in their side yards or parking area in a residential zone, building and zoning dept. said they could not do that. I reviewed the complaint and was forced to come to a contrary conclusion of what the language in the ordinance said. I discussed the definition with Mr. Dean and with one of the triers of the fact who would have to make the determination of what it meant, Judge Little, who agreed with me in terms of what the definition was. I think the clear intent under the Zoning Ordinance was to allow one commercial vehicle to be parked in a residential area for the person who operated a plbg. or other contractor business, but that that vehicle had to be limited in weight. It was not intended to allow someone to park one commercial vehicle of tons, I have reviewed the definition and have proposed an amendment to the Zoning Ordinance to take care of that. I suggest that a public hearing be set to amend the Zoning Ordinance. RESOLUTION TO SET PUBLIC HEARING ON AMENDING THE QUEENSBURY ZONING ORDINANCE ARTICLE 2 SECTION 4.020 a) 42. RESOLUTION NO. 190, Introduced by Dr. Charles Eisenhart who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: WHEREAS, Town Counsel has recommended that the Queensbury Zoning Ordinance Article 2 Section 4.020 a) 42. be amended to read as follows: 42. "Garage, Private Parking" means an accessory building or structure, attached _..i or detached, used primarily to shelter automobiles; and provided that, with the exception of farms, such garage may be used to shelter only one (1) commercial vehicle but in no event shall such commercial vehicle exceed one and one half ton capacity. See also definition #81 "Parking Area, Private". and WHEREAS, the proposed ordinance is worthy of consideration of legislative action, i99 NOW, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, that a public hearing be held concerning the proposed amendment to the Queensbury Zoning Ordinance Article 2 Section 4.020 a) 42. and that said public hearing be held at 7:30 P.M. in the Meeting Room of the Town of Queensbury Office Building, Bay and Haviland Rds. in the Town of Queensbury, Warren County, New York on the 27th day of August, 1985 at which all persons interested in the subject thereof will be heard, and it is further RESOLVED, that the Town Clerk be hereby directed and authorized to publish and provide notice of said public hearing as may be required by law. —' Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent:None OPEN FORUM 11:40 P.M. -Mr. DeMars-Representing the Big Bend Property Owners Associ at on_ On July 27, 1985 we sent a letter to Mr. Dean, no response as of yet...July 20th we had a neighborhood cleanup and we felt bad after the cleanup we could not do anything about the Phillips / MacIntosh situation...we are volunteering our time if the Town could volunteer a vehicle to clean up the property...(burned out house)...also noted a problem with the property of Mr. Carl Graves, complaint of 20 cars on the property... we would like help to get rid of these conditions. -Town Counsel-We have a local law regarding unsafe structures, which includes procedures for cleaning up such structures...after certain procedures are complied with it allows the Town to go in a cleanup with the cost of such to be added to the property tax...We cannot go on private property without going through proper procedures and you as a group would not have a right... -Supervisor Walter-I will check and see what Mr. Dean has in progress regarding this situation. -Councilman Monahan- Mr. DeMars I would like to compliment your group for cleaning up the road sides... REPORTS -Town Clerk-Month of July, 1985 -Buidling & Zoning-Month of July 1985 Reports placed on file... RESOLUTION TO APPROVE AUDIT OF BILLS RESOLUTION NO. 191, Introduced by Dr. Charles Eisenhart who moved for its adoption, seconded by Mr. Daniel Morrell: RESOLVED, that Audit of Bills as appears on Abstract No. 85-8B and numbered 1403 through 1596 and totaling $230,771.19 be and hereby is approved. Duly adopted by the following vote: Ayes: Mr. Olson, Dr. Eisenhart, Mr. Morrell, Mrs. Monahan, Mrs. Walter Noes: None Absent: None Abstain: Mrs. Monahan -Voucher 1416. On motion the meeting was adjourned. Respectfully Submitted, Donald A. Chase, Town Clerk