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08-27-2013 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) QUEENSBURY PLANNING BOARD MEETING SECOND REGULAR MEETING AUGUST 27,2013 INDEX Subdivision No. 2-2013 Greenwood Builders 1. PRELIMINARY STAGE Tax Map No. 290.-1-83 FWW 1-2013 Site Plan No.42-2013 William Duell 6. Tax Map No. 303.20-2-15 Site Plan No.43-2013 Carrols, Inc. 8. Tax Map No. 302.6-1-30 Site Plan No.45-2013 Hudson Headwaters Health Network 13. Tax Map No. 309.13-2-31.2 Site Plan No.46-2013 Trustco Bank 15. Tax Map No. 302.7-1-12 Site Plan No. 62-2011 Queensbury Partners 17. FWW 6-2011 Tax Map No. 289.19-1-28 through 35 THESE ARE NOT OFFICIALLY ADOPTED MINUTES AND ARE SUBJECT TO BOARD AND STAFF REVISIONS. REVISIONS WILL APPEAR ON THE FOLLOWING MONTHS MINUTES (IF ANY) AND WILL STATE SUCH APPROVAL OF SAID MINUTES. 0 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) QUEENSBURY PLANNING BOARD MEETING SECOND REGULAR MEETING AUGUST 27,2013 7:00 P.M. MEMBERS PRESENT CHRIS HUNSINGER, CHAIRMAN DONALD KREBS, SECRETARY STEPHEN TRAVER DAVID DEEB THOMAS FORD PAUL SCHONEWOLF BRAD MAGOWAN LAND USE PLANNER-LAURA MOORE TOWN ENGINEER-CHAZEN ENGINEERING-SEAN DOTY TOWN COUNSEL-MILLER, MANNIX, SCHACHNER&HAFNER-MARK SCHACHNER STENOGRAPHER-MARIA GAGLIARDI MR. HUNSINGER-I'll call to order the meeting of the Town of Queensbury Planning Board on Tuesday, August 27, 2013. Before we get into the agenda, I did have a report for the Board. We had asked Town Counsel to be present for the discussion on Queensbury Partners, and they had a conflict this evening, so they couldn't be here when the meeting started. So it has been suggested that we move the agenda order and listen to the Queensbury Partners project last. If there's no objections from the Board,that's how we'll proceed. For members of the audience,we will hear the Queensbury Partners project last. PLANNING BOARD RECOMMENDATION TO ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS SUBDIVISION NO. 2-2013 FRESHWATER WETLANDS 1-2013 PRELIMINARY STAGE REVIEW SEQR TYPE UNLISTED GREENWOOD BUILDERS AGENT(S) JARRETT ENGINEERS OWNER(S) H. THOMAS JARRETT ZONING MDR LOCATION RIDGE ROAD SITE PLAN: APPLICANT PROPOSES SUBDIVISION OF A 16.02 ACRE PARCEL INTO 3 RESIDENTIAL LOTS OF 3.44, 4.13, AND 8.44 ACRES. SUBDIVISION OF LAND REQUIRES PLANNING BOARD REVIEW AND APPROVAL. FRESHWATER WETLANDS: WORK ADJACENT TO ACOE WETLANDS VARIANCE: RELIEF REQUESTED FROM ROAD FRONTAGE REQUIREMENTS OF THE MDR ZONE. PLANNING BOARD MAY CONDUCT SEQR REVIEW AND PROVIDE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS. CROSS REFERENCE AV 43-13, SEPTIC VARIANCE APA, CEA, OTHER NWI WETLANDS,STREAM OVERLAY LOT SIZE 16.02 ACRES TAX MAP NO. 290.4-83 SECTION CHAPTER A183,CHAPTER 94 TOM JARRETT, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT MR. HUNSINGER-Laura? MRS. MOORE-Yes. At this time the applicant's present to discuss any questions. I would recommend the Board open the public hearing,but at this time the applicant is still pending a Board of Health review for a septic variance. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Good evening. MR. JARRETT-Good evening. Tom Jarrett of Jarrett Engineers and the owner of the property, and Gary Scott,partner in Greenwood Builders. GARY SCOTT MR. SCOTT-Gary Scott. MR.JARRETT-This is a 16 acre parcel. It's being subdivided into three parcels,if you recall from our Sketch Plan discussions, and we've prepared full design documents for the project, and in the course of that we discovered we needed a variance for access not through our lot frontage. Lot frontage is directly on Ridge Road,but we're proposing access for Lot Number Three, the larger lot, 1 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) through Stonehurst Drive,which we think is a positive for everyone because it's a shorter driveway. There was a paper street provided for that future development, and it minimizes the number of driveways on Ridge Road. We're here for a recommendation to the ZBA tonight, and if you wish to discuss any other aspects of the project, we will do so, but I know you've got a full agenda. So I'll keep it short and sweet. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Questions,comments from the Board? MR. FORD-How does this differ from a project that appeared before us a number of years back, the same location,some of the same issues relative to the septic systems and the water? MR. JARRETT-Well, we've delineated all the wetlands on the parcel. We have a number of acres that are not wetlands. There's no DEC wetlands on the parcel by the way. There are Corps of Engineers wetlands which are delineated, and we have areas that are suitable for wastewater disposal with groundwater that is deep enough, and the soils are actually quite granular. They're quite suitable for sewage disposal. I'm not privy to what was proposed years ago. I don't know how many lots they proposed and in what configuration. MR. FORD-One of the things that we certainly will be looking at when you come back will be the septic systems. MR.JARRETT-Which you have all that documentation,but,yes. MR. FORD-I know that,but that was an issue in years gone by. MR. JARRETT-The designs have been presented to you, but I know you're only making a recommendation to the ZBA tonight. MR. HUNSINGER-Right. Other questions, comments? The question I had is since you need to get a variance on Lot Three anyway, why did you make it kind of loop around? Just in terms of maintaining contiguous parcels. MR.JARRETT-There were a lot of thoughts, a lot of thought processes that we went through, and in fact at one point we thought of maybe a trail to connect back into the Halfway Brook corridor. That was kind of abandoned because of some privacy issues that people discussed, and they were a little concerned. Stonehurst people were a little concerned,but that was one of the earlier thoughts, and then later on we discovered that we needed the frontage which Ridge Road provides where Stonehurst does not, and rather than go for a variance on frontage we went for a variance on just the access through the front. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. JARRETT-So there were a number of reasons for it, and it is a little bit odd shaped, but it's the balance of the land that is left over from the other two lots. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. I figured there had to be a good reason,and it wasn't really obvious to me. MR. JARRETT-I'm not sure it's a great reason, but the earlier reasons that would have come into play are no longer a consideration. MR. HUNSINGER-Other questions? MR.JARRETT-Just as a further thought to that,we do have an easement set aside along the front for a trail of some nature if there is one proposed at some point by the Town, and certainly if we still own the parcel number three and there is pressure to put a trail in back to the Halfway Brook corridor, we would certainly consider that. We're not sure there would be because of the wetlands and because of the privacy issues back there,but very,very interesting access in the wintertime and in the Fall. MR. HUNSINGER-Right. Yes. We usually do SEQR before we make a recommendation. MRS. MOORE-Correct. That's why you're tabling this. I would suggest you table the application until the September meeting so that they resolve their Board of Health issue so that you can move forward on SEQR. MR. HUNSINGER-Now have you been before the Board of Health already? 2 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR.JARRETT-Yes,we have. The Board was receptive to our variance. In fact, I made an argument, I don't know if you saw the documentation. I made an argument that variances should not be needed there. I think it needs a clarification from the Town Board, and they're going to schedule a workshop to discuss the regulations in general. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR.JARRETT-Of which I volunteered to attend and help them with that process,but with regard to the specific variances we've requested, a couple of neighbors came out and spoke about a stream and some wet conditions, and Mr. Montesi went out with me last Friday, made a site visit, and in fact the area where the stream does flow in wet seasons was not flowing at all. So it's an intermittent stream that the DEC has so classified, meaning unclassified, and that was the concern of the neighbors and so the Board tabled it to take action after the site visit. MR. HUNSINGER-So is it likely that you'll have action from the Board of Health before the September Board meetings? MR.JARRETT-It's my expectation,yes. We're on the agenda for the Stn. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. JARRETT-And I've been told by the Board that they just wanted to visit the site first and then they were prepared to take action. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. So you'd probably recommend that we table this to the first meeting in September? MRS.MOORE-Yes,please,the 17th,but you do need to open the public hearing. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes,thank you. MRS.MOORE-Okay. MR. HUNSINGER-We will open the public hearing. Is there anyone in the audience who wishes to address the Board on this project? We have at least one person. The purpose of the public hearing is for members of the public to provide comment to the Board. I would ask anyone that wishes to address the Board that they state their name for the record. We do tape the meeting. The tape is available on the Town's website and is also used to transcribe the minutes. So please speak your name into the microphone and ask any of your questions or comments to the Board. PUBLIC HEARING OPENED VINCENT SPERO MR. SPERO-Excuse me. My name is Vincent Spero and I live two homes up from the designated parcel. Besides the issues of the wetland, it is a wetland. However you want to classify it or spin it, it's a wetland. There's a stream back there year round. It's wet. Even in the hottest time of the year, you need boots to go back there. It empties into the brook. So whatever goes in the ground goes in the brook. We also haven't been told what type of houses they're putting up. Are there going to be three one family homes? Are there going to be three two family homes? Are they going to be apartments? What are they going to be? Because that is a big issue, too. More people, more waste, more stuff going in the ground. We all use well water there. We all have septics, and as far as I'm concerned, these rules are put in place to protect the environment, and when you deviate, you set a precedent, and once you deviate from that and set a precedent, the next person who's going to want to build a house, and I'm sure in a year or two they're going to want to put another house or two back there, they're going to get the same thing, and you're going to have more of the same. You're going to have more waste; more crap going into the stream, which goes directly into the brook. Now there might be times when you have a very hot summer, and in the back corner there it is a little drier,but it's still wet. The ground is wet. I live,my parcel of land ends right at the wetlands, and there's a stream there, and that stream runs year round. Even when,the hottest days of August, there's still water in it. There might only be five inches of water in it, but in springtime, you can't even go back there it gets so. I ask the Board to take that into consideration, that is the water runoff is very important, and also the fact that they're not telling us what they want to build there. I see three homes. What type of homes? That is very important. If it's a two family home, you're going to have a lot more waste than a one family home. I mean, they could be putting apartments up there. We have no idea. We haven't been told anything. So if they could give us that 3 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) information,that would help some,too,but I haven't heard any of that given. So naturally everyone is concerned. MR. FORD-Have you had any septic issues on your property? MR. SPERO-I haven't, on my property, no. My septic system was installed when I bought the house, and I had a new one installed in the same exact spot some years later because there was a crack in the septic itself and instead of having it repaired, I didn't want any leaks, I had them put a new tank in,but it was all in the same spot. So no variance or anything was needed,but,you know,the homes are so far apart that it really hasn't been an issue. We all have at least two acre parcels or close to two acre parcels. So, but for them to be putting a home so far back closer to the brook, at least one or maybe more, worries me. It worries me, worries me about the environment, and like I say, if you're going to build a home, and you're looking to put in a septic system, you have to know what type of home you're putting in,don't you? I mean,you need to. MR. HUNSINGER-Well, they're here for subdivision, which means, you know, they're taking one lot and making it three. So that three different buildings could be installed. MR. SPERO-Right,but are they going to be two family homes? MR. KREBS-Well, prior to the fact, once they get the subdivision, when they come back to do the individual buildings,they'll have to have a site plan review. MR. SPERO-Right. MR. KREBS-So at that point we'll determine what kind of building will be there. MR. SPERO-And they'll come to us with a specific. MR.TRAVER-Or is proposed to be there. MR. KREBS-Or is proposed to be there. MR. SPERO-Right. I see. I see. MR. HUNSINGER-I mean, it will have to be consistent with the zone, which is Moderate Density Residential. MR. SPERO-Right,because I see what they did at,just down the road,that Moose Hollow complex. MR. HUNSINGER-They're not proposing anything like that. MR. SPERO-Yes, okay. All right, but those are my concerns, and my neighbors. They're not here. I guess they're working. I was working myself and that's why I got here late, but we just have concerns. Anytime somebody wants to start building next door to you, you wonder what are they going to put up, what are they going to do about the septic, what about the water. That's our drinking water. So,thank you for listening to me. MR. HUNSINGER-Thank you. Any other comments from the Board? Were there any written comments, Laura? MRS.MOORE-No,there was not. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. We will leave the public hearing open. I don't know if you wanted to address any of the? MR.JARRETT-I can quickly. MR. HUNSINGER-Quickly. Yes,go ahead. MR.JARRETT-There certainly are wetlands on the parcel. The shaded areas on the overhead depict the wetlands. The stream corridor that Mr. Spero was referring to is right there, and it does not flow year round all the time. It was dry the other day, as a matter of fact. The wetlands behind his house, going north, there were pockets of water, as (lost words) would demonstrate, but there were,there was no flow in it at all. One house is proposed right there in that upland and one house is proposed right there,and one house is proposed right there. So the density of three houses on 16 4 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) acres is far less than the density of anything in that neighborhood, and the houses to be built depend on who owns the lots and what they propose, but it would be zoning compliant. Single family and duplexes are allowed in that zone. We've shown,on the design documents that you have in front of you, single family homes of reasonable size that can fit on those lots very effectively. I'm not sure what else to say at this point. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. JARRETT-The septic systems would be designed; they have been designed to be compliant. They're actually raised systems. Let me rephrase that. They're actually a raised type configuration. They're not called raised systems because we're using fill to make them compliant, but they're above groundwater by the required amount, and the septic systems are in front of the house on Ridge Road, and on the east side of the house in back on the Stonehurst Drive lot. So, we'll get into more detail if you wish. MR. HUNSINGER-Sure. Any other questions,comments from the Board? MR. FORD-Thank you. MR. HUNSINGER-Then I will entertain a motion to table this to September 17th, and it's pending the outcome of the meeting with the Board of Health. RESOLUTION TABLING SUB # 2-2013 PRELIM. STG. FWW 1-2013 GREENWOOD BUILDERS A subdivision application has been made to the Queensbury Planning Board for the following: Site Plan: Applicant proposes subdivision of a 16.02 acre parcel into 3 residential lots of 3.44, 4.13, and 8.44 acres. Subdivision of land requires Planning Board review and approval. Freshwater Wetlands: Work adjacent to ACOE Wetlands. Variance: Relief requested from road frontage requirements of the MDR zone. Planning Board will conduct SEQR review and provide a recommendation to the Zoning Board of Appeals. Project requires a Septic Variance from the Town Board of Health; on 8-19-2013 the Town Board tabled the application to a September meeting; A public hearing was advertised for 8-19-2013; due to the Town Board tabling this application will be tabled until the Septic variance has been approved; MOTION TO TABLE PRELIMINARY STAGE SUBDIVISION NO. 2-2013 FRESHWATER WETLANDS 1-2013 GREENWOOD BUILDERS, Introduced by Donald Krebs who moved for its adoption,seconded by Thomas Ford: Tabled to the September 17th Planning Board meeting so we can have a determination from the Town Board acting as the Board of Health relative to the septic system. Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: MR. FORD-I believe we ought to specify that it'll be the Town Board, but they'll be acting as the Board of Health. MR. KREBS-The Board of Health. Okay, I'm sorry. AYES: Mr. Deeb, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Ford, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Krebs, Mr.Traver, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE MR.JARRETT-Great. Thanks. Hope to see you next month. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes, and the public hearing will be held open, and we will take additional comments. MR. SPERO-No meeting tomorrow? MR. HUNSINGER-Not of this Board. MR.JARRETT-There will be a ZBA meeting. It'll be tabled again, I believe. 5 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MRS.MOORE-Correct. It'll be tabled again. MR. HUNSINGER-We will take public comment again on September 17th. MR. KREBS-And it won't go to the Zoning Board until we make a recommendation to the Board. MRS. MOORE-Just to clarify that. It's scheduled as part of the public notice to be seen at the Zoning Board. It'll be tabled similar to what it was tabled tonight. MR. HUNSINGER-We have a number of items under New Business. NEW BUSINESS: SITE PLAN NO. 42-2013 SEQR TYPE II WILLIAM DUELL OWNER(S) HANS HANSEN ZONING CLI-COMMERCIAL LIGHT INDUSTRIAL LOCATION 59 BOULEVARD APPLICANT PROPOSES VEHICLE STORAGE FOR ICE HOUSE LIMOUSINE IN A PORTION OF AN EXISTING BUILDING. NEW USES IN A CLI ZONE REQUIRE PLANNING BOARD REVIEW AND APPROVAL. CROSS REFERENCE SV 1387, BP 94-189 WARREN CO. REFERRAL AUGUST 2013 LOT SIZE 2.91 ACRES TAX MAP NO. 303.20-2-15 SECTION 179-3-040 WILLIAM DUELL, PRESENT MR. HUNSINGER-Laura? MRS. MOORE-This is, under Summary, the applicant has completed a site plan application for an existing operation to store limousines in a 1,100 sq. ft. space of an existing building. The applicant has indicated that there are no changes to the exterior or interior of the building. The Board may consider the waivers requested by the applicant A thru V. MR. HUNSINGER-Good evening. MR. DUELL-How are you? MR. HUNSINGER-Good. How are you? MR. DUELL-Good. MR. HUNSINGER-If you could identify yourself for the record. MR. DUELL-I'm William Duell. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. DUELL-Co-owner of Ice House Limousine. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Do you want to tell us about your project? MR. DUELL-We're dispatched out of Vermont. This is just a storage facility for a limo coach bus, which is a 25 passenger. We have a van and what we call a sedan airport car, and that's what we keep in there. This property has been used for storage since back in the 30's. It was an old trolley barn, down on the Boulevard. Maybe some of you know it as the bus barn in the 40's and the 50's, and through '55 through 60 something it was the Boulevard Bowling Alley and as of a little while ago, five years ago, it was used as Pristine Limousine storage. There's pictures from the Town of limousines stored outside back then, but they were never required to get a variance. We're storing inside. The drivers bring their vehicles, take the car out, put their car in. It's not changing the outside of the building at all. It's still the same old bowling alley building. The guy did fix up the overhead over the garage door because it was rotted, but there's no painting going on. We haven't changed anything. It's just a storage facility. No offices there or anything. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Great. I'll open it up for questions,comments from members of the Board. MR. FORD-There's no pick up or delivery of passengers at that location? MR. DUELL-No,sir. No,sir. MR. KREBS-I was just going to say, I think it's a good use for the building. 6 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. MR. DUELL-We're only using 1200 square feet out of that, and I think that building is ridiculous big. It's 30,000 or something like that. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes,it's huge. MR. DUELL-It's Hans Hansen's appliance repair place. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. No other questions, comments? We do have a public hearing scheduled this evening. Is there anyone in the audience that wants to address the Board on this project? PUBLIC HEARING OPENED MR. HUNSINGER-I don't see any hands going up. Do we have any written comments, Laura? MRS.MOORE-No. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. I will open the public hearing, and let the record show no comments were received. We will close the public hearing. PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED MR. HUNSINGER-This is a Type II SEQR. So no SEQR review is required. Unless there's any other questions or comments,we'll entertain a motion. RESOLUTION APPROVING SP#42-2013 WILLIAM DUELL A site plan application has been made to the Queensbury Planning Board for the following: Applicant proposes vehicle storage for Ice House Limousine in a portion of an existing building. New uses in a CLI zone require Planning Board review and approval. SEQR Type II -no further review needed A public hearing was advertised and held on 8/27/2013; This application is supported with all documentation, public comment, and application material in the file of record; MOTION TO APPROVE SITE PLAN NO. 42-2013 WILLIAM DUELL, Introduced by Donald Krebs who moved for its adoption,seconded by Stephen Traver: As per the resolution prepared by Staff. 1) Pursuant to relevant sections of the Town of Queensbury Zoning Code-Chapter 179-9-080, the Planning Board has determined that this proposal satisfies the requirements as stated in the Zoning Code; 2) Waiver requests granted: Items F through V on the application checklist; Items A-0 Site plan requirements for approval; 3) Final approved plans, in compliance with the Site Plan, must be submitted to the Community Development Department before any further review by the Zoning Administrator or Building and Codes personnel. 4) The applicant must meet with Staff after approval and prior to issuance of Building Permit and/or the beginning of any site work. 5) Subsequent issuance of further permits, including building permits is dependent on compliance with this and all other conditions of this resolution. Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: AYES: Mr. Deeb, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Ford, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Krebs, Mr.Traver, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE 7 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. HUNSINGER-You're all set. Good luck. MR. DUELL-Thank you. I appreciate it. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes,you're welcome. SITE PLAN NO. 43-2013 SEQR TYPE II CARROLS,LLC AGENT(S) MATT STEVES,TOM BROGAN OWNER(S) DOUBLE H HOLE IN THE WOODS RANCH, INC. ZONING CI-COMMERCIAL INTENSIVE LOCATION 620 AVIATION ROAD APPLICANT PROPOSES REMODEL TO EXTERIOR FACADE, INTERIOR DINING AREA, ALONG WITH ASSOCIATED SITE WORK. SITE &BUILDING IMPROVEMENTS IN A CI ZONE REQUIRES PLANNING BOARD REVIEW AND APPROVAL. CROSS REFERENCE SP 55-05, SV 50-89, BP 05-428 WARREN CO. REFERRAL AUGUST 2013 LOT SIZE 1.59 ACRES TAX MAP NO. 302.6-1-30 SECTION 179-3-040 TOM BROGAN, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT MR. HUNSINGER-Laura,whenever you're ready. MRS. MOORE-Under Summary, I have the applicant has completed site plan application for the renovations to an existing Burger King restaurant; that includes the removal of two existing greenhouse eating areas, redesign drive thru, relocation of the trash to be included in the footprint, new signage, new plantings, and additional sidewalk area replacing the building areas that are removed. The applicant has proposed no changes to the area outside of the building. MR. BROGAN-Good evening. MR. HUNSINGER-Good evening. MR. BROGAN-My name is Tom Brogan. I'm here on behalf of Carrols, LLC, the owner/operator of the Burger King facility on Aviation Road. Carrols proposes to remodel that facility as described in the summary. That would be exterior facade, including removal of the greenhouse structure, interior dining room, bathrooms, ADA upgrades, and replacement and introduction of some signage. I think we're here this evening as a result of the changing of the footprint of the building which is removal of approximately 750 square feet of structure. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Anything else? MR. BROGAN-No. MR. HUNSINGER-All right. I'll open it up for questions,comments from the Board. MR.TRAVER-So you're actually making the restaurant somewhat smaller. MR. BROGAN-Correct. The greenhouse, I think it was a fad of the past and it's a lot to maintain and, you know, seating arrangements. There's adequate seating in that facility as it stands today. So, instead of fixing something that's not really, doesn't have a high intensity of use, and it's an ongoing maintenance issue. MR.TRAVER-Yes. I hate to admit eating Whoppers too regularly,but it can get quite warm in that. MR. BROGAN-I think there was a period where there was a lot of greenhouses built, and it's a thing of the past. I mean, there's really few places that they make sense. They're either too hot some place or it's expansion/contraction with weather and so forth. So the exterior facade, what'll happen is the greenhouse will come off. The walls will come up, you know, will continue up. There'll be storefront glass. The mansard roof that sits on the front of the building today and wraps around the side,that's going to be removed, so there'll be a greater,you know, a larger surface area in terms of facade, without that mansard colored roof, and the colored roof, the portion of the roof to the rear that would remain would be standing seam metal in like a tin coat color, it looks like aluminum, and then the window treatments would have canopies, aluminum fabricated canopies over the windows,much more attractive facility. MR. TRAVER-The only other thing I was going to ask about, and I know it's not part of your plan, but I have to ask again about the connection to the Aviation Mall. MR. FORD-Thank you, Steve. 8 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR.TRAVER-Is there any thought or discussion? MR. BROGAN-Yes. Interesting,we would,we more than welcome that, and in fact there's a plan that I have with me that shows a connection. We, Carrols, have spent money at the request, we started back in the Jim Martin area, where we created a drawing with a connection through Matt Steves' group did a whole study on tree removals,you know,would have to go through„ and that driveway back then connected directly through the back corner here to Aviation Road, Aviation Mall Drive I think they call it Aviation Mall Road, and then there's a subsequent plan. At some point the Town asked us to look at something differently. It was probably as a result of some feedback from the Mall. MR.TRAVER-Okay. MR. BROGAN-So there was an ultimate plan which I think was included in your packages,too. Kind of coming off the back southwest corner. We are not opposed. I've seen communications between the Town and our neighbor where they were, you know, trying to enforce the requirement in the Code, and I can't speak to the, you know, I've, personally, been on the phone with some representatives there but it seems like it got little attention. So we can't enforce it. The Town would be the one that's in a position, I believe,to bring that to fruition. MR.TRAVER-But you're not opposed to the idea. MR. BROGAN-Absolutely not. I mean,we've spent considerable dollars. MR. TRAVER-And in your discussions with Pyramid Corporation, are you hearing that they're opposed to the idea? MR. BROGAN-Well, I've reviewed minutes, some time ago, that were minutes from these hearings, you know, prior hearings, and, you know, there was a lot of discussion, in some cases, I mean, there's a plan. There's a little line shown behind our building on the plans in front of you, and at one point my understanding was the Board required it as part of a previous,the interconnection as part of a previous plan approval. I can't enforce it. I mean, you know, we're more than happy, we even,we had volunteered to build that drive. MR. FORD-When was the last discussion that occurred between Carrols Corp.and Pyramid? MR. BROGAN-I don't know honestly. I mean,if I had to guess,it's been a few years. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. I seem to remember that there was some, when the Mall was here for the proposed expansion we had a lengthy discussion with the Mall about it, and they pretty much kind of tried to dodge it as much as they could. MR. BROGAN-Yes, I've reviewed minutes. Yes, but my understanding from, I mean, I've been around and doing stuff in the township to the point where I've, you know, worked with some different planners over the years, and to the best of my knowledge, I think it was articulated to me, that in fact it was a requirement to one of the prior planning approvals,you know, and I, again, we initially, at Jim Martin's request, had developed this plan, you know, including the vegetation survey, the whole deal. I saw a letter, this goes back, you know, 15 years ago, where Jim said you will,you know, provide for this improvement, and it didn't go anywhere, and then that was prior to one or two or those expansions in the past, and then more recently there was a, probably about the time when that drawing was modified, one of the prior planners had asked to generate another drawing that would show that interconnection, so you would not be adding additional curb cut along the entrance drive, which made sense, and we've generated that drawing that ties in to the drive aisle parallel to the Aviation Mall Road, and at the time the only thing we asked,because it's a little bit more remote and visually you're somewhat obstructed to the facility there,we just said we would ideally like to see if we could have signage there, some directional or a little pylon or something,just to make people aware of the interconnection,but we have never been opposed to it, and we,you know, we have facilities,you know, we have locations in the Mall. So it's not a matter of credibility. We do have,you know,we've operated in their facilities before. MR. FORD-You have willingness,now,to pursue that. MR. BROGAN-If you told us we could go ahead and do that project as part of our remodel, it would get done this fall. MR. HUNSINGER-Too bad we can't force the Mall to. 9 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. FORD-Yes. MR. BROGAN-I don't know enough of the legal portion. I thought it was part of a requirement to one of the prior approvals,but I can't say that definitively. MR. HUNSINGER-Well, I think it was for you,you know,for Carrols. MR. BROGAN-No,it's from their end. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. BROGAN-Yes. The requirement, as best I know. I mean, the various planners have come to us to ask for our cooperation, and we generated those plans, but not as part of an application to you. As a result of the application that was coming in from our neighbor. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. BROGAN-That's as far as I know. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. BROGAN-I think at one point,that's what I know. MR. FORD-Can we ask our Zoning Administrator to reach out to Pyramid Corp. and reiterate that there is a willingness on Carrols Corp.part to make that connector road? MR. HUNSINGER-It certainly seems appropriate,yes. MR. FORD-I would like to see that happen. MRS.MOORE-Okay. MR. HUNSINGER-So you're not proposing to remove that from your site plan? I mean, it's still shown. MR. BROGAN-No, I didn't know how. We gave you guys two drawings because we didn't want to, you know, it's a little bit of a, I'm assuming it was a little bit sensitive, so we gave you the existing condition, as it exists today, as well as what was, I think there's a line directly behind where you queue up for the drive thru, and that was the drawing I got from, I think Matt Steves, as a result of, that was the proposed connection on our neighbor's approval. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. BROGAN-I didn't make sense, there was steeper topography there, and it's right where you'd queue up for the drive thru, and it kind of drives into nowhere, doesn't go into an aisle. So at the time, I think that was the trigger of when someone from the township came back to Carrols and said, you know, there is a plan that your neighbor was conditioned with a plan approval, the connection. However the plan location, the connection doesn't make sense where it is, where it's proposed. So we came up with that drawing there after we asked Matt to investigate the topography and so forth and we wanted to mitigate any impact on parking and make it sort of an orderly flow, and so that's how it ended up in the location as shown on that drawing. MR. KREBS-I have a question. You're removing the greenhouse, which is approximately 1,000 square feet of space. Are you just going to leave the concrete subfloor there? MR. BROGAN-The plan that we've submitted shows, no, we're going to take that out, but our, we're going to put asphalt, we're going to put concrete in its, you know, there's no sidewalk on the west side of that building. There's a planter against the greenhouse. So we'll provide for, you know, a walkway there. We didn't want to get into too much,you know, we could end up with plantings in there, but we didn't want to cause a lot of difficulties in terms of the calculations. I know there's kind of a different formula here in terms of building area, non-building area, and there are not sidewalks along the front. So we wanted to provide for the sidewalks. We also have a dining slab, remote, all the way across the parking field over by the trees on the site, and so right here there's a, this is the restaurant here. This is,there's I think five tables over here for patrons to eat. We could provide a couple of tables in there or something closer. I think it's something to study. I don't 10 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) know, I can't speak directly as to how often this is being used. I know it's used in some peak periods,and people are traveling. I can't speak on a day to day basis. MR. HUNSINGER-And obviously it's a seasonal use anyway. MR. BROGAN-Yes. MR. KREBS-You mean you're not going to go over there and have your burger in January? MR. HUNSINGER-Well,some days I might. MR. SCHONEWOLF-When you come home from skiing you might. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. The one question I had, and you kind of ran through it kind of quickly, is the color scheme. Because we didn't have any color renderings at all. MR. BROGAN-I do. The difficulty is none of this stuff prints well off the, the tones are generally earth tone. This is not the structure, but the concept's the same. So, you have a, you know, a creamy brown color. The lower part of the building's a darker brown. There's two vertical elements in the building. So,the greenhouse sits here today as well as on this front elevation. That gets removed. There's a vertical element. This is a hardy product, clapboard. The two towers here are, this portion is black. This is a dark brown. This is a dark brown. This is the tan, and these are canopies that are fabricated aluminum, and then at the front entrance, the primary entrance on the side here, and then this front entrance,this is a,these are actually a tile, like a six by six ceramic tile was put on there to highlight this entrance, the corner of the building. So there's a, there still is a parapet band here with the (lost words) all the way around to it. (Lost words) the front portion of the building there it's an LED parapet band; it's a lot lighter in beige. It's pretty attractive, though. (lost words) the structure kind of has a pitched roof here. It will look a lot different, and then you don't get,you know, on the front of the building today is,you know,you have a mansard roof there, and that gets (lost words). This is all a hardy panel as well,which is like a concrete,a masonry. MR. HUNSINGER-Is everyone happy with the color schemes? Any other questions on the colors? It would probably be helpful to have that as part of the application, even though it's not the exact same drawing,you know,the color scheme. MR. BROGAN-Sure. The difficulty is this isn't, the difficulties with these is that the color lots, when you print these things,aren't right on,but that's a reasonable reflection in terms of the (lost words). MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. You might as well pass it down. We'll give it to Laura for the record. MR. BROGAN-Sure, and there is a schedule in the building plans that calls out specifically the colors and Sherwin Williams numbers and stuff like that. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. I did see that on the plan,but. MR. BROGAN-I know,it's meaningless. MR. HUNSINGER-Exactly. Any other questions or comments from the Board? MR. KREBS-I was just going to comment that picture shows some nice natural growth here, some flowers,you know,if that's what you ended up with,that would be very nice. MR. BROGAN-No, and currently there is no green space along that side and there's no sidewalk there. So there'll be some combination thereof. From a standpoint of our application, we stuck with the slab so we wouldn't be tripping over the ratios and the calculations on the various required calculations in the package. MR. HUNSINGER-Any other questions, comments from the Board? We do have a public hearing scheduled on this project. Is there anyone in the audience that wants to address the Board? PUBLIC HEARING OPENED MR. HUNSINGER-Do we have any written comments? MRS.MOORE-No, I don't have any. 11 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. I will open the public hearing, and let the record show no comments were received. We'll close the public hearing. PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED MR. HUNSINGER-This, too, is a Type II SEQR. So no SEQR review is required, and unless there's another question or comment, I will entertain a motion. RESOLUTION APPROVING SP#43-2013 CARROLS, LLC A site plan application has been made to the Queensbury Planning Board for the following: Applicant proposes remodel exterior facade, interior dining area, and miscellaneous ADA upgrades. Site&building improvements in a Cl zone requires Planning Board review and approval. SEQR Type II -no further review needed; A public hearing was advertised and held on 8/27/2013; This application is supported with all documentation, public comment, and application material in the file of record; MOTION TO APPROVE SITE PLAN NO. 43-2013 CARROLS, LLC, Introduced by Donald Krebs who moved for its adoption,seconded by Stephen Traver: As per the resolution prepared by Staff. 1) Pursuant to relevant sections of the Town of Queensbury Zoning Code-Chapter 179-9-080, the Planning Board has determined that this proposal satisfies the requirements as stated in the Zoning Code; 2) Waiver requests granted: stormwater mgmt., grading, landscaping & lighting plans; Items A-0 Site Plan requirements for approval; 3) We wanted to add that we wish that the Queensbury Staff would contact Pyramid Corporation to see if we could have that interconnection; 4) Final approved plans, in compliance with the Site Plan, must be submitted to the Community Development Department before any further review by the Zoning Administrator or Building and Codes personnel; 5) The applicant must meet with Staff after approval and prior to issuance of Building Permit and/or the beginning of any site work; 6) Subsequent issuance of further permits, including building permits is dependent on compliance with this and all other conditions of this resolution. Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: MR. KREBS-And we wanted to add that we wish that the Queensbury Staff would contact Pyramid Corporation to see if we could have that interconnection. MR. FORD-Thank you. MR. BROGAN-And for the record,we are not opposed. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes,well,it's on your plan. AYES: Mr.Traver, Mr. Krebs, Mr. Ford, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Deeb, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE SITE PLAN NO. 45-2013 SEQR TYPE II HUDSON HEADWATERS HEALTH NETWORK AGENT(S) RICHARD E. JONES ASSOCIATES OWNER(S) SAME AS APPLICANT ZONING CLI- COMMERCIAL LIGHT INDUSTRIAL LOCATION 161 CAREY ROAD APPLICANT HAS CONSTRUCTED 13 ADDITIONAL PARKING SPACES AND SEEKS A MODIFICATION TO MAINTAIN THEM. MODIFICATION TO AN APPROVED PLAN REQUIRES PLANNING BOARD 12 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) REVIEW AND APPROVAL. CROSS REFERENCE SP 45-10, BP 11-256 WARREN CO. REFERRAL AUGUST 2013 LOT SIZE 6.56 ACRES TAX MAP NO. 309.13-2-31.2 SECTION 179-4-090 RICHARD JONES, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT MR. HUNSINGER-Laura? MRS. MOORE-The applicant has completed a site plan application for the modification to an approved site plan requesting approval of 13 additional parking spaces that were not part of the original plan. The Board may consider the waiver requests for lighting, signage, SWPPP, landscaping,and soil logs. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Thank you. Good evening. MR. JONES-Good evening. For the record, Richard Jones. I'm the architect representing Hudson Headwaters. What we're looking for is a modification to an existing site plan that we had an approval on a couple of years ago. We are adding 13 parking spaces along the, what would be the south property line behind the Health Center building. There are minimal to no changes. We're not modifying any lighting. Minimal changes to grading. We're using porous pavement similar to what we already have on site. We're not doing any modifications to building infrastructure of any type. It's pretty straightforward. I'd be happy to answer any questions. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Questions,comments from the Board? MR. FORD-Do you have any awareness as to how this occurred when it was not a part of the original approval? MR.JONES-Yes. We actually looked to do the modification last fall. We had actually prepared these documents last fall. We had completed the application, and by the time we had it completed and were ready to submit the blacktop plants had closed. Hudson Headwaters was looking to park along that additional area, and basically I told them, don't park on the lawn. If we're going to park, we'll put Item Four down. There is no pavement down. It's basically an Item Four base. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR.JONES-So that they could park on it without sinking into the mud. It was my fault that they did it. I'll admit that. We basically intended, this spring, to do it. We're in the midst of doing the new health center in Warrensburg, and we had not gotten to it yet, and when we got the letter from Bruce Frank,that's when we made the application. MR. FORD-It beats asphalt. MR.JONES-What,the Item Four? Well,we're actually going to put porous pavement down,which is basically, I think,about 95%of the pavement that we have on site. MR. HUNSINGER-Other questions? I was there for a meeting recently, and I can attest to the fact that parking's tight. MR. JONES-Yes, I think when we actually completed the health center project, we were underestimating, I think, the volume of patient encounters that they were going to have there. We were looking to, at that point, transfer some of the patient load from Queensbury Family Health to West Mountain, and it did occur, but in an overwhelming fashion, and the relief that they got at Queensbury Family Health is, Queensbury Family Health is now back to where it was. So their practices are growing. They're adding a lot of physicians to staff, and it's just inevitable. We had planned on roughly two and a half spaces per exam room, which is typical, and the amount of administrative staff and other staff that they have in the building has just overwhelmed the parking. MR. KREBS-And in addition to that you also have the pharmacy there, which also creates some additional problems. MR. JONES-Yes, and I think, of the two facilities, I think the health center is really the one that's reated the biggest backlog for parking on site. MR. HUNSINGER-Other questions, comments from the Board? We did have a, essentially a signoff letter from the Town Engineer. 13 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR.JONES-Yes. MR. HUNSINGER-We do have a public hearing scheduled on this project. Is there anyone in the audience that wishes to address the Board? PUBLIC HEARING OPENED MR. HUNSINGER-Any written comments, Laura? MRS.MOORE-No. MR. HUNSINGER-I will open the public hearing, and again, let the record show no comments were received. I will close the public hearing. PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED MR. HUNSINGER-This,too,is a Type II SEQR. So no additional SEQR review is necessary,and unless there's any other questions or comments, I'll entertain a motion. RESOLUTION APPROVING SP#45-2013 HUDSON HEADWATERS HEALTH NETWORK A site plan application has been made to the Queensbury Planning Board for the following: Applicant has constructed 13 additional parking spaces and seeks a modification to maintain them. Modification to an approved plan requires Planning Board review and approval. SEQR Type II -no further review needed; A public hearing was advertised and held on 8/27/2013; This application is supported with all documentation, public comment, and application material in the file of record; MOTION TO APPROVE SITE PLAN NO. 45-2013 HUDSON HEADWATERS HEALTH NETWORK, Introduced by Donald Krebs who moved for its adoption,seconded by Stephen Traver: This is per the resolution prepared by Staff. 1) Pursuant to relevant sections of the Town of Queensbury Zoning Code-Chapter 179-9-080, the Planning Board has determined that this proposal satisfies the requirements as stated in the Zoning Code; 2) Waiver requests granted: stormwater mgmt.,grading,landscaping&lighting plans 3) Final approved plans, in compliance with the Site Plan, must be submitted to the Community Development Department before any further review by the Zoning Administrator or Building and Codes personnel; 4) The applicant must meet with Staff after approval and prior to issuance of Building Permit and/or the beginning of any site work; 5) Subsequent issuance of further permits, including building permits is dependent on compliance with this and all other conditions of this resolution. 6) As-built plans to certify that the site plan is developed according to the approved plans to be provided prior to issuance of the certificate of occupancy. Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: AYES: Mr.Traver, Mr. Krebs, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Ford, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Deeb, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE MR. HUNSINGER-You're all set. Good luck. MR.JONES-Thank you very much. 14 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) SITE PLAN NO. 46-2013 SEQR TYPE II TRUSTCO BANK AGENT(S) ABD ENGINEERS & SURVEYORS OWNER(S) QUEENSBURY QUAKER LLC ZONING CI-COMMERCIAL INTENSIVE LOCATION 118 QUAKER ROAD APPLICANT PROPOSES AN ATM ADDITION BY REDESIGNING EXISTING DRIVE-THRU LANES. SITE & BUILDING IMPROVEMENTS IN A CI ZONE REQUIRES PLANNING BOARD REVIEW AND APPROVAL. CROSS REFERENCE SP 32-03, SV 30-10 WARREN CO. REFERRAL AUGUST 2013 LOT SIZE 4.22 ACRES TAX MAP NO. 302.7-1-12 SECTION 179-3-040 BRIAN SLEECEMAN, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT MRS. MOORE-The applicant has completed the site plan application for building improvements to an existing Trustco Bank where the project will involve the removal of a 3rd travel lane and canopy area to allow only two lanes for banking with an ATM access. The applicant has provided a site plan showing site details for all of the buildings on the property as the bank is only one of the buildings on the site in an existing shopping center. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Thank you. Good evening. MR. SLEECEMAN-Hi. I'm Brian Sleeceman from ABD Engineers and Surveyors. It's essentially just what she said. It's a renovation of the Trustco Bank right over here on Quaker Road. There are three lanes, one with access to the teller and then two vacuum lanes. They're going to get rid of one of the vacuum lanes and replace it with an ATM with a vacuum further down from the ATM, and that'll be it. There's no other changes to the site. The canopy will be brought in just a little bit, but it'll look the same. We're just going to move the Trustco sign with the canopy. That should be it. So we're just seeking approval for that. MR. HUNSINGER-Questions, comments from the Board? The only question I had was on the lighting. MR. SLEECEMAN-Yes. MR. HUNSINGER-And we've had multiple lengthy discussions, especially with banks, about lighting, and,you know,we do have a lighting code in the Town,and I really had no way to delineate the, and I did highlight somewhere. Yes,there are going to be four 175 watt under canopy lights. MR. SLEECEMAN-Yes. MR. HUNSINGER-Can you give us any opinion as to how that would compare to what's existing there now? MR. SLEECEMAN-I can't exactly. I'm not super familiar with this project,unfortunately. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. SLEECEMAN-But I spoke with the engineer right before I came up and he said something about the lighting. He said it's comparable to what's there. It shouldn't be, you know, any noticeable difference. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. So it won't be any brighter. MR. SLEECEMAN-No. MR. HUNSINGER-Because that would really be my concern with this project. MR. SLEECEMAN-Right,yes. MR. KREBS-Well, plus, isn't there a regulation for; there is a certain requirement for lighting in an area where you have banking like that. MR. SLEECEMAN-Right. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. That was the only question I really had. MR. FORD-Will free samples be given out at either of the lanes? MR. SLEECEMAN-I wish. 15 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. KREBS-Only if they're$50 bills. MR. HUNSINGER-Well,we also have a public hearing scheduled with this project. Is there anyone in the audience that wants to address the Board? PUBLIC HEARING OPENED MR. HUNSINGER-Any written comments? MRS.MOORE-No. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. I will open the public hearing, and, again,let the record show no comments were received. We will close the public hearing. PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED MR. HUNSINGER-This, too, is a Type II SEQR. So no additional SEQR review is necessary, and, with that, I will entertain a motion. RESOLUTION APPROVING SP#45-2013 TRUSTCO BANK A site plan application has been made to the Queensbury Planning Board for the following: Applicant proposes an ATM addition by redesigning existing drive-thru lanes. Site & building improvements in a Cl zone requires Planning Board review and approval. SEQR Type II -no further review needed; A public hearing was advertised and held on 8/27/2013; This application is supported with all documentation, public comment, and application material in the file of record; MOTION TO APPROVE SITE PLAN NO. 46-2013 TRUSTCO BANK, Introduced by Donald Krebs who moved for its adoption,seconded by Stephen Traver: As per the resolution prepared by Staff. 1) Pursuant to relevant sections of the Town of Queensbury Zoning Code-Chapter 179-9-080, the Planning Board has determined that this proposal satisfies the requirements as stated in the Zoning Code; 2) Final approved plans, in compliance with the Site Plan, must be submitted to the Community Development Department before any further review by the Zoning Administrator or Building and Codes personnel; 3) The applicant must meet with Staff after approval and prior to issuance of Building Permit and/or the beginning of any site work; 4) Subsequent issuance of further permits, including building permits is dependent on compliance with this and all other conditions of this resolution. Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: AYES: Mr.Traver, Mr. Krebs, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Ford, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Deeb, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE MR. HUNSINGER-You're all set. Good luck. MR. SLEECEMAN-All right. Thank you. TABLED ITEM: SITE PLAN NO. 62-2011 FRESHWATER WETLANDS 6-2011 SEQR TYPE I QUEENSBURY PARTNERS AGENT(S) MATTHEW FULLER,ESQ. OWNER(S) SAME AS APPLICANT ZONING 0- OFFICE LOCATION SOUTHEAST CORNER OF BAY & BLIND ROCK ROADS APPLICANT 16 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) PROPOSES CONSTRUCTION OF 11 BUILDINGS TOTALING 132,000 SQ. FT. ON A 34.05 ACRE PARCEL. THE INTENDED USES FOR THE SITE INCLUDE OFFICE, BUSINESS RETAIL, AND MULTI-FAMILY. ACTIVITIES ALSO INCLUDE LAND DISTURBANCE FOR INSTALLATION OF PARKING AREA AND OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE AND OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE AND UTILITIES ASSOCIATED WITH THE PROJECT. SITE PLAN REVIEW AND APPROVAL IS REQUIRED FOR MULTI-FAMILY COMPLEX,OFFICE AND BUSINESS RETAIL IN AN OFFICE ZONE. CROSS REFERENCE AV 61-11; SUB 13-99 WARREN COUNTY REFERRAL APRIL 2013 WARREN CO. DPW REFERRAL MARCH 2013 APA, CEA, OTHER NWI WETLANDS, STREAM OVERLAY LOT SIZE 34.050 ACRES TAX MAP NO. 289.19-1-23 THROUGH 35 SECTION 179- 3-040, 179-9,CHAPTER 94 MATT FULLER&DAN GALUSHA, REPRESENTING APPLICANT, PRESENT MR. HUNSINGER-Laura? MRS. MOORE-Sure. Under Summary, the applicant has completed the site plan application and the freshwater wetlands permit application for project on the corner of Bay and Blind Rock Road that involves the construction of 11 buildings -9 of which are residential, 1 mixed commercial residential building, and 1 commercial with associated site work. The Planning Board has completed the SEQR review for this project as a negative declaration and has provided a recommendation to the Zoning Board that there are no adverse impacts related to the variance request for the project. The Planning Board may consider during the reviewing opportunities to incorporate public transportation, tourist traffic, residential storage of recreational vehicles i.e. boats and recreational vehicles. The Planning Board may discuss as part of site plan review how the buildings and other site features work together and interact with the surrounding area. MR. HUNSINGER-Thank you, and I would just add for the benefit of the Board, we are joined by the Town Engineer, Sean. Thank you for coming. Good evening and we will soon be joined by the Town Counsel. Good evening. MR. FULLER-Good evening. For the record, Matt Fuller with Meyer & Fuller, for the applicant, Queensbury Partners. I'm joined with Dan Galusha tonight, one of the project owners. I think I'll just start, recap where we've been. I think Staff had updated the Board. When we last appeared before the Board, it was for a recommendation to the ZBA on what amounted to four variances, one from the 300 foot setback along Bay, two for the 75 foot setbacks along Blind Rock, the third was the height setback above 40 feet. We were just under 47 feet, and the other was for the accoutrements along the intersection of Bay and Blind Rock, some pergolas and outside awnings, things like that. We went to the ZBA and I thought those things might have been acceptable to them, but it came out that the height and the improvements along the corner there, Bay and Blind Rock, again, the outside seating and things like that, seem to have been a concern, and one of the variances down along Blind Rock, one of the buildings, we were asked to take a harder look at that to see if we can move some of those around, and we did end up cutting one back entirely. I mean, it moved, the net effect of what it did was it moved the road a little bit closer to the wetland but not within the setbacks. So we don't have any issues there. We still needed one for the, I'll call it the eastern most residential building along Blind Rock. We did cut the height down from 45 to 40, which basically just removed the elevation to hide the mechanicals, and I will say,you know,just as part of the final approval from the ZBA, that I think in hindsight that probably was regrettable decision, and I think some of the members on that Board felt that way,but it is what it is. I mean, a concern was expressed with regard to height. There were other height, despite arguments that no variances have been granted along Bay for the height,there were variances along Bay, and we were right in that ballpark. There was one at about 45 feet. So we were in that ballpark. Again,that last variance, too, was to hide the mechanicals. So we thought we were in that ballpark, but nonetheless, the ZBA, a few members made it clear that that wasn't acceptable to them. So we cut the buildings down, and resulted in two setbacks, one, again, for that first residential structure heading down Blind Rock Road, and the other for the setback from Bay Road of 300 feet. So those are from upwards of into the 20's of variances that we were at. We finally ended up with two. The brief memo that I gave you tonight just goes through the site plan criteria,it's in the site plan review law, and again,we've been, again dawned on me when I heard the number on the application, 2011, where we are and where we've come on this project, and so I was thinking about it, and I took the site plan criteria and really went through it,because,you know,you get a lot of projects before you, and what you're doing and the questions that you guys ask as you're going through that criteria. It's not like a ZBA where you have to answer specific questions,but,you know, even on the last one, asking about lighting, things like that, that's the criteria you guys are dealing with, and you do that, and you do it diligently. So I wanted to just kind of recap where we've been, the various arguments that have come up in the context of the site plan review law that we have to deal with,and if I could, I'll try not to take a lot of time, but I wanted to go through just the comments that I've prepared for 17 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) you, of where we are, visa vie that site plan review criteria. The first is the Comprehensive Plan. There've been arguments up and down, and I've said it before that, you know, you can pick and choose words out of any statute or the Comprehensive Plan to support your argument,but I turned right back to the opening paragraph in that Office zone,you know, which is intended to be a mix of high density residential, office and commercial, and in working with the Planning Board and the Zoning Board of Appeals, we've accomplished all three, and I think we've done it in a tasteful way. The second is that the project complies with the zoning law, including the setbacks, dimensional, bulk, density regulations, and with that, with those two Area Variances granted by the ZBA, the project is zoning compliant,and that allows the Planning Board, of course,to proceed under the site plan review law. Site plan encourages pedestrian activity. Again,we've,what I would say, included extensive internal pedestrian improvements, both within the project and along the corridor, along Bay and Blind Rock, we have, you know, provided for sidewalks that can stub to neighboring properties if ultimately the sidewalk's approved in either direction, either down Bay or out Blind Rock. Have to conform with Chapter 136, Sewage, and Sewage Disposal, and that became quite a big topic at the Zoning Board of Appeals. Really, frankly, in an effort to derail the project, and there's still, and I know more materials have been submitted to the Planning Board. They'll probably be submitted again tonight, and with the crux of dealing with density that the variances allowed more residential units. I saw that argument again. Again I get the e-mails and things that get circulated around. That's not the case. The density that is allowed on the site is what's allowed per Town zoning. We didn't ask for a single additional unit. Originally, yes, there was a density variance component to one of the earlier proposals after we were working with the Planning Board, but that was made very clear that that wasn't going to happen. So 142 is the number. That is the maximum number. There are no more residential units. There are no density variances allowed. So the discussion of, that the variances allowed additional capacity on the sewer system is false. There was no density variance. We meet the density. So, getting back to the sewage and sewage disposal, some of the other arguments were that we're using capacity in the district. Again, to be frank,yes,we are. Our project is in the district. My clients installed the sewer line that has allowed people to the north and this facility that we're in to connect. That line was oversized at my client's expense, to accommodate our project, whatever facet it may be, this building and capacity to the north. My client wasn't paid for that. The Town didn't compensate them. The Town didn't purchase capacity in that line. My clients paid for that line, but again, that topic's going to come up and we'll deal with it. The proposed use should be in harmony with the general purpose or intent of the Chapter. Again,taking into account the district,the allowed uses, intensity of use, and I think, you know,of all the complaints people have,the one thing they can't have is with the planning that's gone into it. This has been a long process. There's been a lot of changes. We've spent a lot on changes. We've made a lot of changes,both at the request of the Planning Board,the Zoning Board, the joint committee, and I think we've done that in good faith to arrive at a project that's good for the Town. The operation of the proposed use will not create public hazards from traffic, traffic congestion. You'll remember early on, and right from Day One when we came in, the Planning Board made it very clear that traffic was an issue, and we didn't dodge it. We knew it. We knew it from the numbers of our initial traffic report, and you didn't need the numbers. Anybody who lives out here and drives through that intersection knew that traffic was an issue out there. We went to the County. We met with Town Staff. We, ourselves, paid for and commissioned a study to not only evaluate the existing conditions out there, but to recommend a change, and if you'll recall, the engineer came back and said,well,this is going to be a little bit difficult,but you actually don't need a turning lane. That said, it was made very clear early on that the option to have a turning lane coming off Blind Rock is something that not only this Board but the Zoning Board was also interested in, and we've planned for that. That turning lane is built into the plans. It can be done at the inception or later, whatever the Town's pleasure is, but, in addition to that, again, without getting to an approval,we went out and handed the Town the plan to adjust the timing and sensors on those poles, and I think, you know, anybody that's gone through it, I go through it daily, if not a couple of times a day,has definitely resulted in an improvement in that intersection. MR. MAGOWAN-I'd like to thank you for that,because it definitely is a big difference. MR. FULLER-It is a difference, and again, it's similar to the sewer line. There was no approval granted. My client's did it. They paid for that sewer line to go in, and I think you have to do that to show the good faith and the quality that you're putting into a project. So we've addressed the traffic, and I think the traffic, we did get approvals from the County. I know that Laura had contacted me about that, and that should be in the file. I have it as well. Off street parking should be behind the buildings. That's a big Office zone component. If you remember originally, particularly parking along Blind Rock wasn't. The road was flipped, and I think the Planning Board had a good comment that that should be flipped the other way. We worked with the engineers, came up with a plan that allowed that to happen. All the parking along Blind Rock similar or along Bay similar to the rest of Bay is behind the buildings. Those she's not here anymore with us, she's around, I see her every now and then, Gretchen was a big proponent of a parking facility of some 18 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) sort, and we did build internal parking into the project, and the residential units out back and part of the commercial structure along Bay, that does have an internal parking component in the middle of the building. You can't see it. It doesn't look like a parking garage, nor, frankly, do I think it should. I think that's one of the benefits of the project. Back to the criteria, will it have an undue impact on natural, scenic, aesthetic, ecological, wildlife, historic, recreation or open resources. We do have the every elusive SHPO signoff that is in the file. We had accomplished that about a year ago now. Again, no small undertaking. We had submitted an initial report to SHPO and got the oft response as sometimes you do, particularly with a site like that, that,you know, they wanted some further follow up on a couple of the old house locations. So we did it, went back out, did a little work in the dirt, and sent back another rather detailed report with, frankly, a couple thousand of little bits and pieces of things that were found out there. So it wasn't a paper report. It was a field report, and we did get that, again, that elusive letter from SHPO that we'll have no impact on historic resources. Again, the crossover of pedestrian traffic with vehicular traffic on the site, I think that the project, the roads, internally, will be private. Right, as part of this project, is the, I would say the withdrawal of the prior subdivision approval on the site. It will be one lot, and it will be a privately maintained road through the middle. That said,we've got crosswalks and things that you might expect on a public road. So the plan takes those things into account. Stormwater,that is probably the final large, outstanding issue, and I think, and I won't speak for Sean, but I've gone through, I actually went through that letter again today. I printed it and left it on my desk, but I think that they're technical comments, numbers, adjustments to the plan that need to be made, and we've talked to the LA Group,talked to Mike Ingersoll, again, about that last week, and he didn't see a problem with the comments. I think it's,you know, it's styles and how things need to look within the facilities,the stormwater facilities themselves, and Mike didn't see any issue with meeting what were some detailed comments, but there weren't any deal breakers in there that Mike had identified. Water supply. We do have adequate water at the property, and we don't need to extend districts or lines. It will be at the curb cut. Trees, plantings, things like that, are all set out on the plans. They had been for some time. We will be sticking to those plans as we've proposed. Fire lanes, emergency zones, fire hydrants will be adequate and meet the needs and requirements of emergency service providers. Even when we came, dating back now to the original proposal we came in, which was the traditional office along Bay and the apartments to the back, we had that secondary access along Blind Rock. That was an early comment that came out of the fire department. That comment still stands, and the added location with the Knox Box that will be on there is still on the plan. So that will be part of the improvements. We'll take care of that as part of our plans. The design of the structures, roadways, landscapings, and areas susceptible to ponding, flooding and erosion,will it minimize or avoid such impacts. We did do the tests out there as part of the stormwater plans, ponding and things like that aren't an issue. The soils over here are certainly conducive to what we need to accomplish on the stormwater, and the final, this is 0. I've gone A through 0. The site plan conforms to design standards, landscape standards and performance standards of the Chapter, and I think we've gone above and beyond and met all of those design standards. So I kind of treated it a bit like the review you would do with the zoning and the checklist and the ZBA's criteria, but I think with all we've gone through and everything that's going on now, certainly for the Board's information there is an Article 78 pending with regard to the ZBA. There's been an attempted shot at this Board, but I think that will be dealt with in due course. Counsel can speak,but that's an issue with the Zoning Board that we'll frankly answer and deal with in the court process, but with that I'll certainly answer questions of where we are with the plans and where we go from here. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Thank you. Questions,comments from the Board? MR. KREBS-I think Matt did a very good job of covering everything. MR.TRAVER-Yes,that's a good summary of where we stand, I think. MR. HUNSINGER-I didn't want to interrupt you when you were talking about traffic. The last time that you talked to this Board about traffic,you were still waiting for the photo lights to come in and be installed, so that it would trip the light to change, the microwave lights. Have those been installed MR. FULLER-I don't know. Yes. I asked Peter Faith from the engineering firm that did traffic was on vacation this week and I did e-mail him and I didn't hear back from him at the end of the last week to see if they had put those in,yet. So I don't know,but we'll get an answer to that. They were ordered. I know they were ordered. MR. HUNSINGER-No, I know you had said when you were here that they were ordered. You didn't realize that they weren't working until you did the study, and that you thought after they were 19 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) installed they would even improve the light better. I mean, I go through that intersection at least twice a day myself,and I also think that it's much better than it used to be. MR.TRAVER-Yes,those devices would help in the off peak. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. MR. FULLER-Someday I'll get one at Quaker and Ridge. MR. DEEB-Matt,you are amenable to doing the turning lane at the inception of the project you said? MR. FULLER-If it's the Planning Board's pleasure,yes,we can put that there. Like I said,the reason I say if it's your pleasure is that based on the traffic study, it's not needed. So I don't want to say yes and overrule the engineer because that's, frankly, out of my league, but to answer your question, yes. We have the set aside. It is there,and it can be put in,yes. MR. KREBS-Well, plus the fact, you would have to have Warren County's approval to put that in before,whether you wanted to do it or not,you still would need Warren County's approval. MR. FULLER-And that was part of their review when we met with them. MR. KREBS-Right. MR. FULLER-And they were okay, again, with the numbers as they were and the turning lane. It didn't hurt, I guess,it didn't hurt the numbers. It could. MR. FORD-Was it a topic of discussion at that time when you met with the County, anything relative to the potential for width expansion of either or both of the roads? MR. FULLER-With ours. Ours would be a width expansion. That's why we set that aside. So that was the discussion. The outlet of Haviland is constrained by the Town and a house next door. I think practically, we had that discussion. The only way it could come is north, that road. It would have to encroach on the Town's property; just because of the distance of that house isn't nearly sufficient for the space. There is room, on both Bay and Blind Rock, but frankly DOT didn't see any need for any increase on Bay. If any place, it was Haviland, if it ever needed it, and we did have a discussion about the no right sign, and nobody could figure that out,where it came from or why, on Haviland. MR. FORD-Probably the speed of the north,south traffic. MR. FULLER-It could be. MR. HUNSINGER-You talked a little bit about some of the outstanding engineering issues, mostly being stormwater, and we do have our Town Engineer here as well. The last letter that was issued by the Town Engineer was dated May 8th. Do we have a resolution to any of those items at this point? MR. FULLER-No,we're do a response back. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. FULLER-To be frank,we had to wait to see what happened last week. MR. HUNSINGER-Right. That's what I would have expected the answer to be, but I just wanted to make sure. MR. TRAVER-On the other hand, you don't see any comments in there that you don't feel can be addressed? MR. FULLER-No. Again, I won't speak for Sean,but certainly if there are any conditions or things in the plans that are overall plan problematic, I think that we would want to know, but we went through them, Mike Ingersoll and I,and we didn't see any. MR. DOTY-And if I could, Mr. Chairman. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes,go ahead. In fact, I was going to ask. 20 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. DOTY-Yes, a lot of, I think there's 21 comments. Many of them are conformance related to the stormwater design manual,where there's some minor,modest adjustments that need to be made to some of the stormwater devices. The larger of the comments related to total peak and volume runoff numbers. At the design points there's a few design points that have additional volume going off site. They need to provide a bit more mitigation to take care of that. That's the biggest comment in here. There's enough room on the site that I think they'll be able to address it. There's also some additional soil test pitting that has to occur and soils investigation. Those are largely the bigger comments. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. KREBS-Well, and we can certainly make part of our approval the fact that you get engineering approval,but you could work it out with the engineer. MR. HUNSINGER-Any other questions, comments from the Board? What we're talking about is the Article 78 that's been filed against the Zoning Board and if you had any comment about that. MR. SCHACHNER-Technically it's actually being filed against the Zoning Board of Appeals and this Board, although this Board hasn't taken any action yet, other than the SEQR review and an advisory recommendation, neither of which are challenged. I mean, I'm not going to discuss our litigation strategy in an open public meeting. Do you have a question about it? Generally speaking, Mr. Fuller has accurately stated that there is a new Article 78 challenge to principally the Zoning Board of Appeals, although this Board is a named party, despite the fact that no action by this Board is challenged, and the basis of the challenge has to do with the type of variance that was required for the situating of residential facilities within 300 feet of the Bay Road corridor. That determination, the determination that that's an Area Variance issue as opposed to a Use Variance issue is what's been challenged in the Article 78 proceeding. MR. FORD-Okay. Thank you. MR. SCHACHNER-It doesn't really have any specific bearing on this Board's ability to continue this evening, although there's a contention, just so everybody knows, there's a contention in the litigation that this Board can't proceed because the ZBA acted improperly,but that's not, although it is a contention,it is not legally the case that you can't proceed. You are free to proceed if you wish. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. FORD-Thank you. MR. HUNSINGER-Any other questions, comments from the Board? Is there anything else that you wanted to add? MR. FULLER-I know you have a public hearing. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes, that's what we're leading up to. As everyone's probably aware, we do have a public hearing scheduled this evening. I guess I would just add, for the record, even though there hasn't been a public hearing really held for this Board, there has been extensive public comment received for the record, both by the Zoning Board of Appeals and we have all read those minutes. There has also been written comment received that we have all become aware of. So anyone wishing to address the Board, I would ask that you address your comments related to the Site Plan Review, and for the project that's before us this evening. If I could kind of just get a show of hands, how many people do plan to speak and address the Board? AUDIENCE MEMBER-I'm planning on speaking and I have letters from 10 people that would like to allot their time to me to speak on their behalf. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. So are you the only person that's prepared to speak this evening? AUDIENCE MEMBER-There might be a couple of others, but most of the people here have agreed that I can speak for them. MR. HUNSINGER-The reason I asked the question,just for the benefit of the Board,was to try to get a sense for whether or not we wanted to limit comment to three minutes like we often do if there's a controversial project with a lot of public comment. If there's only three people that wish to address the Board, I think we could be a little bit more generous in how we allot time, but I also don't want to give them unlimited time or to engage in a dialogue,which I think would also be. 21 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR.TRAVER-My feeling is that the individuals that are speaking as individuals,we should limit,but the lady who's representing a number of individuals by their consent, I think we should grant her some leeway. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR.TRAVER-Reasonable leeway. MR. SCHONEWOLF-Put a limit on it. Ten minutes. MR. HUNSINGER-Ten minutes. Would that be sufficient? KATHLEEN SONNABEND MRS. SONNABEND-Well, I don't know. We'll see. There's 10 people that would like me to speak for them, and Mr. Fuller has had many opportunities to speak, and he's not presented an accurate picture. He claims there's no evidence. Kathleen Sonnabend. So today I dropped off a packet this thick of evidence, and it's evidence that was supposed to have been taken from Town Board documents, and he says you can take a few comments here and there and paint a different picture, but actually when you read through the Comprehensive Land Use Plan, it makes it very clear that this project of Fowler Square was intended for Main Street, not the Bay Road corridor. I've got the Comprehensive Land Use Plan here, 2007, and when you look on Page 42, it says there are building height restrictions. On Bay Road it's one to two stories. On Main Street,they have to be a minimum of two stories and a maximum of three. On Page 46, Recommendation D-5, the Bay Road Professional Office and Quaker Road East commercial areas, setbacks should reflect the more rural nature of the area. The areas are less dense. The standards imposed on these areas should reflect that. The setbacks should be larger allowing for green space in front of the buildings. The next Page, on 47, Recommendation D-8, commercial mixed use areas, that's what you've been talking about here, that's for Main Street and Dix Avenue to host denser and more varied housing than is found in other parts of Queensbury. Again, not Bay Road, Main Street, and Dix Avenue. The next page, Page 48, Residential uses should not be allowed to overrun mixed use areas. Again,this is the Main Street mixed use idea. By its very nature,the current intense development in the Commercial Mixed-Use areas is not a good neighbor too many of Queensbury's housing areas. Adequate buffering should be maintained between these uses. Again, they're talking about Main Street, not Bay Road. Bay Road is supposed to be rural. Enforcement and Administration on Page 56 of the Comprehensive Land Use Plan. Effective enforcement and efficient administration are vital to the success of a comprehensive plan. Regulations must be predictable and fairly applied. Businesses, individual and their communities thrive in stable environments. Investment becomes tricky when rules change from one applicant to the next. Page 58, Variances should be rare. Zoning rules supposedly provide for the uniform application of adopted standards that will move the community toward its vision. The Zoning Board needs to remember that variances set precedents. Under similar circumstances, the board must grant similar variances. The cumulative effect of granting variances can quickly undermine the zoning ordinance and the community's vision as established in the Comprehensive Land Use Plan. The whole purpose of that update in 2007 to the Zoning Code where they moved from a 1,000 foot setback for multi-family to 300 was to avoid these variances, and 300 feet was not what was discussed during the Comprehensive Land Use Plan study. It was more like 650. Three hundred shows up, and I suspect it's because the internal road on this Fowler Square property for a decade has been set at 300 feet back. So it was very convenient for this applicant to have professional offices in the first 300 feet and apartments beyond, but they're not following that either now. They're having apartments within the first 300 feet. At the bottom of Page 58 of the Comprehensive Land Use Plan, there are two types of variances,Area Variances and Use Variances. A use variance permits a use for the land that is otherwise not allowed by zoning. An area variance permits a use that is allowed,but does not meet dimensional requirements such as setback, height or area. This 300 foot setback is not a setback. It's a use description. When you look at the table, the first 300 feet from Bay Road can only have offices. That's it. Beyond 300, that's when you can have multi-family or offices. At the bottom of Page 59, In the case of both variances, state law requires that the zoning board grant the minimum variance necessary and must at the same time preserve and protect the character of the neighborhood and the health, safety and welfare of the community. Now, Mr. Fuller has said many times that there was no such purchase of excess capacity to protect the other properties up and down Bay Road, but I've got lots of documentation from the Map Plan Report in 2002 and the minutes from the public hearing on December 9, 2002 that confirm that's exactly what happened. In the Comprehensive Land Use Plan it says, the Comprehensive Land Use Plan adopted, now this was the previous plan, 1998, adopted by the Town of Queensbury in December 1998 refers to the need for sewers in the Bay Road corridor. The Town has recognized this need for some time as evidenced by many stop start efforts dating back some 25 years. That goes to the late 1970's. The proposed district extension will not 22 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) only provide sewer service to the properties within the district, but will also provide additional sewer capacity, allowing future extension of sewer service along Bay Road. It says the soil conditions in the corridor are generally not suitable for multi-user septic systems and the Comprehensive Land Use Plan makes the following recommendation. Until this issue of the sewer is resolved, no high density residential users should be allowed in the Bay Road corridor. It goes on to say that, this is, again, the 2002 extension, which included the Willow Brook pump station, the Baybridge apartments, and the Baybrook office buildings. The pump station and force main will be designed to operate under both the initial flow conditions of District 7 and ultimate future flow conditions which would include flow from all of Bay Road corridor north to Cedar Court, and it has a table showing the needs. This list includes all of the properties north of the proposed district along Bay Road corridor up to Cedar Court. These are presented for the purposes of demonstrating the adequacy of the proposed facilities to accommodate the ultimate future extensions of the sewer district that might utilize the sewers and pump station presently being proposed. At that time,they said that the property at Blind Rock and Bay would need approximately 11,400 gallons per day. That was based on having as many as 22 apartments or townhomes and the rest office buildings. So at that point, with a 1,000 foot setback, 22 multi-family units was all they could have on that property. Further it says as discussed in the generation of wastewater flows herein, the proposed sewer collection facilities are designed with adequate capacity for future expansion of the system along the Bay Road corridor. In this regard, the Town of Queensbury will purchase the excess capacity on a per gallon basis. This capacity will then be available for future district extensions to purchase from the Town. Now Mr. Fuller has frequently said,hey,we're in the district. They're not, so, you know, it's available to us. Nobody was in the sewer district until they did a sewer district extension. When Willow Brook was formed, that was a sewer district extension that was paid for by Schermerhorn, Baybridge and the Town because the Town wanted to protect all of the other properties up to and including Cedar Court. When Queensbury Partners wanted to bring the sewer up, they filed the Map, Plan Report for 2006, and in that report it was just the Cedars and BRB or Queensbury Partners that were participating, and so they became part of the sewer district then, too. If Cedar Court decides at some point they need to hook up because of a failed septic system, they will also be doing a sewer district extension. I've talked to Chris Harrington. I've FOIL'd this information, and the answer I got was, yes, the Town prefers sewer district extensions. So it's not like we're a (lost words). That's the way it works. You do a sewer district extension,you pay for it, not the Town unless the Town's buying excess capacity. In the case of the 2006 Map Plan Report, the cost was shared between the Cedars and Queensbury Partners. The Town didn't buy any additional excess capacity, but the excess capacity relates to the Willow Brook pump station which is what their pipe hooks up to, and everybody else along Bay Road that would be hooking up would be going through that Willow Brook pump station. That's where the excess capacity was purchased. In the 2006 Map Plan Report it also recognizes that they have to think about the other properties. It says the goal of this proposed sewer district is to extend sanitary sewer service to large existing developments as well as to any new development that may occur along the corridor. The project will also address contributing flows from existing properties along the sewer route that have not elected to be part of the proposed district at this time. It says further the region along Bay Road has experienced dense growth in the past 10 years and is expected to have, that future development would strain the percolation limits of the soils, particular when the BRB or Queensbury Partners development is built. At the time of this report, they said that they would be building offices, no multi-family. Now this in 2006. After they'd been here in 2004 and 2005 talking to the Planning Board about a big apartment complex, no offices, but in 2006 they say we're going to be building offices, and the maximum office space we can build is 120,000, and that 120,000 square feet would need 12,000 gallons per day. So that's very close to the 2002 Map Plan Report that said they needed 11,400. So when, and then it says further that they also took a look at the wastewater flows generated by all other properties from Walker Lane north to Surrey Fields. Now we're going even further beyond Cedar Court. So as I said, in this particular report they were expecting 12,000 gallons per day. So that is what Fowler Square is entitled to, absolutely. They are entitled to that, but they are not entitled to 44,000 gallons per day, which is what they're now saying they need, at the expense of everybody else who was supposed to be protected along Bay Road. So this very dense apartment complex, and this is what they've always been trying to do. Every single proposal that has come before us over the past decade has been for a huge apartment complex on land that was intended for professional offices, and the reason it was intended for professional offices is that the Town has known since the late 70's that the soil conditions along Bay Road are not conducive to multi-user septic systems. So the way the Town got around it was saying, okay, because we know there's this limit, but we still want growth, let's have the Bay Road corridor be professional offices that don't need as much sewer capacity. It'll be a nice transition from the commercial Quaker Road to the rural residential that's to the north, and everything was working great. All the other developers were cooperating,but these guys kept coming in saying we need to build a lot of apartments and it's our right to do it, and it's right to take the remaining excess capacity. Could you put up that PDF file that I e-mailed to you? I did a spreadsheet. I've been asking since December for information from the Town. I've been asking them to do a real 23 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) sewer study. I've been asking them how much sewage is currently flowing through Willow Brook, who's already hooked up, so that I could figure out how big of a crisis we've got going. When that opens up, I'll show you. I finally got the information I needed on August 6th when Chris Harrington issued his sewer report. It's not a complete study. It isn't everything we need, but it gives me enough information to point a few things out to you. First of all, this column is from Chris' report. The next column is the 2002 Map Plan Report. The last one is the 2006 Map Plan Report, and you'll notice here $12,000 and $11,400, that's what was assumed that Queensbury Partners would need, versus $44,000 they told Chris in March that they were going to be needing for this project. I can also hand you individual sheets. So basically what we've got here in the Chris Harrington report. MR. SCHACHNER-Mr. Deeb would love to have an individual sheet. MRS. SONNABEND-Sure. MR. KREBS-So would I. MRS. SONNABEND-So Chris has said that currently there's 50,000 gallons per day going into that Willow Brook pump station. That consists of the Baybridge townhomes, the Baybrook Office Park, which is Schermerhorn's big offices, the Cedars, which has two phases now. Originally they were expecting one. There's two more, but they're probably not going to do them. The Queensbury Town Hall and Surrey Fields. Those are all of the properties currently connected generating 50,000 a day. When you look down below, and this screen is cutting off the bottom,yes, there you see the current capacity is 150,000. Chris says that with a minor adjustment, minor expense, he can probably get that up to 168,000, and by the way, he was very generous with his time. I called him because I wanted to make sure I understood his report. I'm not an engineer, and I did not want to be presenting something to you that I did not believe was accurate. So he went through it with me and explained it. He's talked to the manufacturers. He's confident he can get it to 168,000. With another expenditure of between $35 and $60,000, he can get it up to 192, he thinks, but he's not going to be confident of that until he's had a chance to see how the increased flow works, because when a pump station is only at a third of its state of capacity,the numbers, I'm not an engineer,but I guess the numbers don't always work out well. When you get closer to capacity, then you can tell really what the real capacity is. So what he's telling us is that without having to replace the pump station and go to a very big expense, he can get it up to 192,000 gallons per day. So if you could scroll down a little bit. So right now there's 50,000 gallons per day going through there, and these, by the way, are average numbers. Peaking factors, which you hear about, are much higher, and it could be anywhere from three to four times that number. I'm just working with average daily gallons per day. So we've got 50,000 currently going through. There's going to be an extra 15 to 20,000 gallons per day with the new Schermerhorn apartments that are going in where there would have been offices under the old Code, and then we've got 30,000 he says coming from the new apartment complex that Valente got approved, which was much denser than anybody expected. It was originally going to be townhomes, and then you've got 44,000 for Fowlers Square. So the total is 139 to 144,000 which is getting pretty close to the limit. So now you've got to think about what about all the other properties. When you look at the 2002 report, the numbers are based upon current properties and development that would occur under the 1,000 foot setback assumption. So that 2002 report, they thought they were solving the sewer problem on Bay Road forever,but they didn't know that this Town Code would be changed to a 300 foot setback, and now we're talking about a variance that has no setback for multi-family. So we're going to have much more intensive development along Bay Road. So if you look at the properties that were supposed to be taken care of, you've got the Baybrook apartments who are part of sewer extension seven that have not hooked up yet. So they definitely have a right to hook up. Now we're over 150,000 a day, and then you've got all of the other properties, including Cedar Court, the church, Bayberry Court, Adirondack Manor, Old Coach Manor, Canterbury Woods. All of those properties, according to the 2002 report, would add up to about another 72,000 gallons per day. The 2006 Map Plan Report was not as inclusive. They didn't include some of the properties and they did not include any estimates for future development. Their number was more like 56,000,but if you include the other properties that are already there, you're getting pretty close to the 72,000 also. So when you add these numbers up, you're well, if you scroll down, you're well over even what Chris Harrington thinks he can do to increase the capacity. So now we're talking about really big numbers. You're going to have to replace the T-4's at the pump station with T-6's, and not just replace that equipment, but probably replace the infrastructure underneath it, because when you put these things in, everything else has to coordinate with the size. So we're talking about big dollars. If you would just follow the Code and hopefully scale back the 300 feet someday, but that's, right now it's the Code. If you just follow the Code, that will minimize the impact of this, but by giving Fowlers Square the variance and approving this project,you are setting us up for a sewer crisis that could be happening in just a few years. We're not talking decades down the road. Most of these properties that are not hooked up, they've been around for a while. Their septic systems are 20 years old or 24 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) more. How long do you think a multi-user septic system lasts? I'm told the average is about 25 years, and when they fail, they can't just replace them. The DEC has told us that when your septic system fails, if it's a single family home, that's one thing, that's not a problem, but when it's a development with more than four entities going into the same leach field, so it's a multi-user system, they will not let us replace it because they know how bad the soil conditions are along Bay Road. They will force us into the sewer. That's what happened to Surrey Fields. That's what happened to Baybridge. Baybridge was under a DEC mandate. The Willow Brook pump station saved them. So this is really serious. I haven't just been making things up. I haven't just been fighting this project to fight it. Yes, I would rather, I've been here because I want you to follow the Code, and I want you to make long term decisions that are in the best interests of the community, and it's not just the sewer. They say the traffic problem has been resolved,but who are we kidding. The traffic study they did doesn't even talk about all the Schermerhorn and Valente apartments that are going to be built in the next year. They didn't talk about the ACC dorms. They're assuming a one percent annual increase in traffic without even considering what's going to be added by those properties, and with this project, if you approve it, I'm willing to bet you're going to see a flood of people coming in here saying, now I want to build apartments along Bay Road. Because you can fill apartments. Professional offices take longer. Look at Valente's project down there. He's finally got two office buildings, and that park has been there for a couple of decades. Now with the Nanotech park really scaling up we might have a chance of getting some really good companies, engineering companies, consultants, wanting to build professional offices up here, but it's not something that happens overnight. Whereas you can build all the apartments you want, and we'll be attracting people from other communities. There are people in other neighboring communities who move into apartments in this Town to get their kids into the Queensbury school district, especially if they have special needs because we've got really good services in our school district, that some of these surrounding communities cannot afford. So we've got a problem here, and the traffic, if you really look at the maps, first of all, Country Club, Quaker, Blind Rock, Haviland, those are County roads, and the Post Star reported on August 9th that 42% of the County roads are impaired. Over the last three years, they have not been spending enough on maintenance. So where's the County going to have the money to widen Blind Rock when it needs to be widened, and you know it's going to have to be widened one of these days. We really should have a traffic circle there because when you start thinking about where could you put stop lights, there's no good place on Blind Rock or Bay, along Fowlers Square, to put a stop light in. So we've got all this traffic coming and going. When the school buses are running in the morning or ACC classes are out, sometimes traffic is backed up almost a mile on Bay Road. I've personally experienced it, and even with the improvement, and I admit, the timing of the lights was a good improvement, but that's based on the traffic now, before this gets developed and everything else is getting developed, and it's not like we have an easy option. When I leave Cedar Court, most of the time, I want to go south or west. I've got to go through Blind Rock and Bay. My only other option is to head north and go way out of my way to go around Glen Lake or around Sunnyside. It's not like I only have to go a couple of blocks to find an alternate route. This is a really choke point here, and we've got to be really careful. We allow these developers to do these intensive projects,they make great profit from it, and then the taxpayer gets stuck with the hassle and the expense of making the sewer improvements and making those traffic, those road improvements. There's so many things that Matt Fuller has said in person or in writing that just aren't true, and I,you know, I could go on for hours. I just wish that you would listen more to the public and please don't approve this. This is crazy. The first item on the site plan review is,is it consistent with the policies of the Comprehensive Land Use Plan. Well it's obviously not, when this is a project that was intended for Main Street, not Bay Road, and the idea of having a walkable neighborhood and having more of this development on Bay Road, yes, if the sewer and the roads could handle it, it would be great to have connecting sidewalks where people could walk to services, but I'm telling you, we can't even afford to have this project go in, and once it's in, there isn't going to be any other opportunity for any contiguous, so there's going to be nice sidewalks on their property, but it's not going to go anywhere, and trying to cross Blind Rock or Bay, students coming from ACC, it's dangerous walking down Bay Road, and trying to cross over, it's just not, it's not the right place for this kind of a project, and there has been consistent public controversy over the change in neighborhood character, over the sewer and the traffic. We've written letters,we've done petitions. I don't know how it's been so easily discarded. We've been told that we didn't care, that we didn't have any problems with the change in the neighborhood character, we didn't have a problem with the setback on Blind Rock. I know the setback on Blind Rock is not as significant,but that road's going to have to be widened, and then that setback does become more significant. At a minimum, we need a left turn lane on both ends, onto Bay and onto Country Club, and the left turn lane can't just be two cars long, because oftentimes we've got several cars waiting to turn left onto Bay. So if you only have a lane that's two or three cars long,you're still going to be backing up the road. So there's a lot of things that need to really be thought through better on this project. They also talk about how density's not an issue. Well density's a calculation,but it also is subject to all of the other requirements of the site. You've got, you're subject to the height requirements. They're not supposed to have three stories on this property. It's supposed to be limited to two. You're 25 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) supposed to be set back far enough from the wetlands. I'm not sure it is in all places. You're supposed to have enough room so, you have to meet Town standards so the snow can be cleared. They're compliant proposal,what they call compliant from 2010, I've got a copy of the map here. It shows 98 apartments, and they are crammed in tight. I've not even sure it's compliant,but if this is compliant, 98 is the maximum apartments they can build, even though the density calculation is bigger. If it doesn't meet all of the other requirements like no apartments in the first 300 feet, no buildings above two stories, all those requirements, then you can't have the density of 142. If anybody has any questions about this, I'd be happy to answer them. I've done a lot of research. I've gone through and read minutes. I've got lots of proof and evidence. I just have not had the time, in the past, being limited to three or five minutes, to, I've referred to these things, but I haven't been able to show it to you,but it's been there all along. MR. HUNSINGER-Thank you. It's very obvious you really did your homework on this,yes,very good presentation. Yes,thank you. MRS. SONNABEND-Did I forget anything you guys wanted me to talk about? Okay. MR. HUNSINGER-I know a couple of other members of the audience wanted to speak. I don't know who wants to be next. DOUG AUER MR.AUER-I gave up my time already. I can't hold a candle to that. MR. KREBS-Thank you, Doug. JOHN SALVADOR MR. SALVADOR-I kind of feel like the dog and pony show following the burlesque act. MR. FULLER-I've been called a lot of things, John. I don't know that dog and pony show is one of them. MR. SALVADOR-Good evening. My name is John Salvador. I'm a resident in North Queensbury. The record compiled for the review and approval of this Board's recommendation contains a memorandum of law prepared by the applicant's attorney, Mr. Fuller. In said memorandum of law, Mr. Fuller offered a convincing argument that, quote, the sewer capacity is a site plan and SEQR related argument. Better said, the sewer system conveyance and treatment capacity. With respect to the treatment capacity of the sewage system components of transmission lines and pump stations being a site plan issue, Town Code Chapter 179-9-080 requirements for site plan review, speaks in Section K to that sewage disposal facilities be adequate and will meet the current requirements of Chapter 136. Chapter 136 deals with on site waste disposal, not with municipal sewers, and I think the problem we're having here, this Board and the ZBA, sewer district extensions are an affair of the Town Board. They're not a zoning issue. They're not covered in Chapter 179. Pursuant to Town Code, the sewer capacity of Fowler Square project, of which Mr. Fuller speaks, cannot be considered a site plan issue. The only other possibility, according to Mr. Fuller, is that, quote, sewer capacity is a SEQR related issue. As you know,this Board, as SEQR Lead Agent, rendered a SEQR determination of no significance on April 23, 2013. Before the Fowlers Square project received final approval for the Area Variance 61-2011. The project was still in a state of flux when this Board approved SEQR. Wasn't it? It was in a state of flux. Significantly, the project was announced to all involved agencies, and advertised to the public as a SEQR Type I project. However, excuse me, how is it that this Board in its resolution of approval approved a SEQR Type II project? That is a Negative Declaration, and the meeting of April 23"d was subsequently affirmed,the minutes. MR. HUNSINGER-No,we did a Long Form on this, Mr. Salvador. MR. SALVADOR-Pardon me. MR. HUNSINGER-I'm sorry to interrupt you,but we did do a Long Form on this. We did do a Type I SEQR review. MR. SCHACHNER-Yes,the contention is completely erroneous. 100%wrong. MR. SALVADOR-I'll get to that. 26 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. All right. MR. SALVADOR-It seems to me that a SEQR Neg Dec of a Type I project is a contradiction in terms. With respect to the sewer capacity being a SEQR Type I action, the applicant completed Part I, project information on the environmental assessment form. In answering no to EAF Part I Question Number Twelve, is surface liquid waste such as sewage disposal involved,the applicant overlooked that the sewage from the project will, in fact, be disposed of as surface liquid waste to the Hudson River during a storm event. This occurs because the Town of Queensbury failed to run new sewer lines to the Glens Falls sewage treatment plant as recommended in the EPA's 1984 final EIS on the Warren County Sewer District Number One, of which this community was a part of the study area. Instead,the Queensbury sewage, once mixed with the City stormwater, and the combined sewer, is shunted, untreated,to the Hudson River. I understand this occurs about 30 times a year, and that's causing our, untreated sewage is causing pollution to the Hudson River. This storm associated event was completely overlooked when the Board completed Part II of the Environmental Assessment Form,that is this Board. In the section titled Impact on Water, Question Number Three, will the proposed action affect any water body designated as protected? You answered no, the answer is yes, the Hudson River. Question Number Five, will the proposed action affect surface or groundwater. This Board answered no. It should have been yes. Sub question to Question Number Five, liquid effluent will be conveyed off the site to facilities which presently do not exist or have inadequate capacity. The Glens Falls Wastewater Treatment Plant has inadequate capacity during a storm event. In a letter to the Chairman of the ZBA, Mr. Fuller stressed, as he did here tonight, that my clients have built the sewer line having undertaken it in good faith. In good faith for what? For the assurance that the Town would approve the sewer line as a district extension? This assurance amounts to the Town acting in violation of the State constitution,Article 8, Section 1, no Town shall give its money or lend its credit to a private purpose or undertaking. No way would a developer build this sewer in anticipation that he's going to operate it the rest of his life. There has to be reasonable assurance that the Town is going to take it over in a sewer district extension. Fowlers Square is a private undertaking. The Town lent its credit to a developer to take the sewer. Continuing with SEQR concerns. EAF Part II Number 15, Impact on Transportation. Will there be an effect on existing transportation systems? The Board said no. I contend that the answer should be yes, when consideration is given to the transportation of school children to and from school. School buses stop,by the way, school buses in this community do not enter the development. They stay on the main road, and they stop on the main road, and when they stop on the main road, two lanes of traffic stop. You're familiar with that. they do travel on Blind Rock Road. I can't imagine the tie up that will be there at that time of day, morning and afternoon. EAF Part II, Question 19. Will the proposed action set an important precedent for future projects? You heard Mrs. Sonnabend expound on that. I don't have to talk about that. EAF Part II Question Number 20. Is there likely to be public controversy related to potential adverse environmental impacts? I don't have to go any further. The Planning Board's Lead Agency request should have included the Queensbury Town Board, because of this sewer district extension. The City of Glens Falls should have been an involved agent, because the sewage is going to the treatment plant. The DEC issues SPDES permit for the Glens Falls Sewage Treatment Plant, and I can tell you that direct discharges are not allowed. Other involved agents might have been County DPW, and the school district, with regard to school bus traffic. The project was originally classified as a SEQR Type I. It was erroneously, unanimously approved as a SEQR Type II. That's in the record, with a Negative Declaration. A Type I Negative Declaration, as I said before is a contradiction in terms. The SEQR Negative Declaration aside,the SEQR review itself was the very essence of segmentation, as defined in the SEQR law. Thank you. MR. HUNSINGER-Thank you. Anyone else? No other comments. Were there written comments, Laura,since the last meeting? MRS. MOORE-I have written comments from Kathy Sonnabend. Did you want me to read the information that you submitted? MR. HUNSINGER-Is that the same package that was submitted to the Board? MRS. SONNABEND-It's a comprehensive (lost words) going through all the site plan,A through 0. If you need that before you go any further, than maybe you should read it. If you're not going to vote tonight,then you should read it at your leisure. MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. Thank you. As I mentioned at the beginning of the public hearing, we did have extensive comments, one of which was submitted last week, which all of the members of the Board got a copy of, and we've also read all of the comments that were made at the Zoning Board meetings as well. Were there any other written comments. 27 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MRS. SONNABEND-There's some new information that I dropped off to (lost word). MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. MR. SCHONEWOLF-I'd like our attorney to comment. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. Well,go ahead and ask him. MR. SCHONEWOLF-I'd like your response to some of the comments that were made,because I know they're not true. MR. SCHACHNER-Which ones do you want me to respond to? MR. SCHONEWOLF-Any ones that you think are important. MR. SCHACHNER-I guess my broad base comment will be that,to her credit,the vast majority of Ms. Sonnabend's comments do relate to this Board's site plan review function,with the exception of her comments, and I'm not criticizing them, but with the exception of her comments about the allowance of residential uses within 300 feet,which is not this Board's decision and not this Board's purview. That variance has been granted. Right, wrong, better, worse, that's not before you this evening as an issue, but the rest of her comments pretty much do relate to your site plan review function and she looked at the right criteria in our Zoning Law. As to the next commenter, Mr. Salvador, his comments were largely or exclusively focused on your SEQR review. Many of his comments are completely, legally erroneous. He did say one thing that I think is true. In his whole diatribe I did identify one thing that I think I agree with, and that is that school buses do stop on Blind Rock Road, and when they do, sometimes traffic stops as well. The SEQR, first of all, your SEQR review ship has sailed. It's been more four months since you conducted your SEQR review. That's not what's on your agenda tonight. You've done that. All the criticism of your SEQR review, in my opinion, Number One, is too late. Number Two, is misplaced, and Number Three, to the extent he made a number of comments about legal issues involving SEQR review, they were 100% incorrect. This Board did not treat this action as a Type II action. A Type II action means no SEQR review required. You didn't treat this as a Type II action. You conducted SEQR review. You treated it properly as a SEQR Type I action. There was what's called coordinated review, which means designation of this Board as the SEQR Lead Agency, and the notion that there's something legally inappropriate about issuing a SEQR Negative Declaration for a Type I action is completely erroneous. As an empirical, statistical matter, more than 95% of the Type I actions in the State of New York ultimately receive SEQR Negative Declarations. That was a statistic of some years ago. My personal,my professional suspicion is it's now probably closer to 99%,but as of a few years ago, more than 95%. So it's just wrong. There's nothing else to comment. Those comments are too late, misplaced, and incorrect. I'm referencing Mr. Salvador's SEQR comments. Ms. Sonnabend's comments, again, other than the 300 foot one, do relate to your site plan review criteria, and, you know, she's made a number of points that you can consider. The other thing that Mr. Salvador said that is completely incorrect is that sewer capacity is not a site plan review issue. That's not correct. That is actually one of the things you're allowed to take into account. He did say one sub thing that is correct there, which is that I think you all know, it's neither this Board nor the Zoning Board of Appeals that has the legal right to approve of sewer district creation or sewer district extension. I think everyone in the room knows that is, in fact, and he's correct, a Town Board function, but he's not correct when he said, and I wrote this down because I was so shocked, that sewer capacity is not a site plan review issue. That's completely incorrect. Helpful? MR. SCHONEWOLF-Thank you. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes,thank you. MR. FORD-Thanks. MR. HUNSINGER-Was there some comments? MR. FULLER-Just a couple of comments. I want to deal with the sewer issue. Could you pop that chart back up again. I got a copy of it as well. A couple of things. Because I, too, talked to Chris Harrington myself actually months ago when this issue first surfaced. These numbers are not actuals. He hasn't run actuals. They're based on Map Plan Report average unit numbers. There's been no flow meter that's been installed out there, and we'd tell you that. The second part is, the big comment, and this keeps coming up, that all these prior reviews and all of these numbers, in particular this 2002 Nace Map Plan Report and it wasn't a comment that was made once. I counted three times that it came up, that it was based on a 1,000 foot setback. That is legally impossible 28 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) because that 1,000 foot setback was not enacted until the Town Board flipped to a different majority and three members voted to jack that zoning up to 1,000 feet. MS. SONNABEND-That's absolutely wrong,and I can prove it in the minutes. MR. FULLER-That part,right there,it happened in'06. We all remember it. MS. SONNABEND-It was in 2002. MR. FULLER-That's when it flipped. There were members of the Zoning Board that were put on the Town Board. So that's, there certainly is, with any sewer district that is either going to have extensions to it or have additional users put in it, a point where improvements are required, and that's why there, frankly, is quite a sizeable fee for this project to even develop in its own district. There's a development fee that doesn't get discussed here, but ultimately we have to pay to the Town to put these units in the district. That goes into a pot to make these improvements. MR. HUNSINGER-Well,there was reference,in an e-mail from Chris Harrington,of that cost. MR. FULLER-Exactly. That's right. It is in the record that we'll pay, and the final part is, again, it's, there's a letter, and I didn't submit it. It was put into the record last week, no, a couple of weeks ago, August 8th. At a meeting of the Board of Directors the Cedar Court Homeowners Association held on January 5, 2011, the Board voted to terminate our interest in establishing a sewer district for Cedar Court. They had an option to get in. I get that, and they look to the future to be able to do it. I get that. No question, but they opted out. They had an ability to get in and they opted out. Read it. There was an option, in the future, if we need to, we'll look at it again. No question that they'll look at it again. MR. HUNSINGER-Excuse me. Ms. Sonnabend, no one interrupted you. I would appreciate the same courtesy to the applicant. MS. SONNABEND-I didn't get a chance to rebut him. MR. HUNSINGER-You don't get a chance. I'm sorry. Please be courteous. That's all I ask. MR. FULLER-I'll read the whole letter. At a meeting of the Board of Directors the Cedar Court Homeowners Association held on January 5, 2011, the Board voted to terminate our interest in establishing a sewer district for Cedar Court at this time. Two factors influenced our decision. First, the estimated cost presented through the Feasibility Study was prohibitive, by everyone's standards especially considering the number of residents who would have to bear the burden. Second, after extensive investigation into the health of our current septic system, it was determined that it is functioning as it was designed. The Board contracted with a separate septic company to uncover the distribution tanks in our four zone leach field. Upon inspection, it was found that they are in perfect working order. In fact, the contractor made the comment that they looked brand new. So, at this time, the Board is adopting an enhanced maintenance program for our current system and holds the option of hooking up to the Town's municipal system for the future. The Board would like to thank you and the town staff and in particular Mike Shaw for all you have done to help us through this process. It is comforting to know that the information in the study will be available if needed in the future. And no different than what the developer on this project will have to pay. An out of district user of that number of units that's in Cedar Court will pay that similar number, based on a per unit basis, and whatever extension it takes to get there. So, I guess the overall comment is, yes, the development will use up capacity in the sewer system. No question, but based on the numbers, and even the projected numbers of what's there now, eventually if you come to a threshold and it's your project that comes to a threshold where improvements need to be made, you need to make those improvements. We're not there yet. To penalize a developer that's here now when this topic wasn't raised when Valente was here, a year ago, is patently unfair. That's my argument to the Board. MR. HUNSINGER-Well,we did ask the questions of the other developers. MR. FULLER-Yes,right. MR. HUNSINGER-And I guess the question I would ask, and I don't know if it goes back to Staff. Certainly you can answer it if you want to comment,but,you know,ultimately,who is the arbitrator to determine whether or not there's capacity. I mean, it's the sewer department in the Town. Correct? 29 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MRS.MOORE-Yes. MR. SCHACHNER-The short answer is yes. MR. HUNSINGER-And I do recall,and I was looking for it during one of the presentations. I do recall that we had either a memo or a letter stating that there was current capacity to serve the proposal, and I wasn't able to locate anything. MRS. MOORE-I have identified an e-mail from Chris Harrington on March 8th. I can read through eight items. It just comments back and forth to the LA Group. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. I found that myself. That didn't really address capacity, though, did it? Or maybe it was a different memo that I found. MRS. MOORE-This is simply in reference to, it also identifies the discharge calculations and information that's needed from the applicant. I don't. MR. FORD-Can we get clarification as to whether, in fact, there is a flow meter on the present system or not? MR. SCHACHNER-Did you ask did you,or can you? MR. FORD-Do we have that available tonight? MRS.MOORE-I don't have that information at the moment. MR. FORD-Okay. MR. SCHACHNER-Yes, and for what it's worth, if there is any dispute as to whether there's existing capacity, it would certainly be appropriate for the Board to get that information from Mr. Harrington,along with the,whether there's flow meter information or not,as Mr. Ford mentions. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. Just to go back to the comments, this is the same memo that Laura, well, it's an e-mail dated March 8th from Chris Harrington where he talks about the discharge calculations, and he says, this figure is used to calculate the buy in, which is 327 a gallon. This includes buy ins for the City of Glens Falls capacity of $1.15, general fund money to pay for infrastructure downstream of $1.12, and an equity buy in for the Queensbury Consolidated Sewer District of $1.00. So I think that's what you were referring to,but nowhere in this e-mail does he say anything about capacity, but again, I thought we had something previous that addressed the capacity issue, from either the Town Engineer. MR. TRAVER-Aren't those costs, those fees and those costs projections based on anticipated need and capacity? MR. HUNSINGER-Yes. MR. TRAVER-So we may not have those numbers in front of us, but the numbers we do have indicate that capacity has been considered,considered in view of this project. MR. HUNSINGER-Right. Yes. MR. FULLER-And, again, you've got the added unusuality, it's not a leverage, as Mr. Salvador put it or a promise to the future, but if that line hasn't been run down the front of that property as it is now, and we had to run it, we'd be paying for it. We'd have to bond it, for us to improve it, or we'd have to put a cash letter of credit for us to put that line in. It's already there. We've already paid for it,to the tune of half a million plus. So that's in addition to that number that you were talking about. It is a different circumstance where the applicant has already put in a line. MR. GALUSHA-Typically it isn't done that way. Typically you don't put the line in until you get the project. MR. FULLER-But that money has been already spent. That's a less risky developer proposition for the Town. MR. SCHONEWOLF-I think we discussed that and I think we encouraged you to do that. 30 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. FULLER-Many years ago. MR. TRAVER-There was a, I have in my notes, and I don't remember who brought it up, but in the public comment, there was an issue about, I think, again, relating to the sewer capacity, and/or SEQR that the project was in a state of flux, but I think from the very beginning it was always anticipated that there would be a connection to the sewer system, and it was always anticipated that the capacity would be what has been consistently discussed. So that was not in flux. MR. FULLER-And that, again, goes back to the constant argument about density and that variances have driven density. The number of units that Craig calculated can be built out there, whether it's an office at the front of that property or an apartments at the back. We can fit them in. There's adequate space with the space, the land that we've got open for development. It has never been a density issue. It's never been a density variance. To say they allowed it or this Board working with the applicant allowed some higher density is just, it's patently untrue. The zoning set the density and we haven't gone over it. Craig Brown calculated it and it's been met. Years ago it was calculated. MR. HUNSINGER-Other questions,comments from the Board? MR. FORD-Does our engineer have anything that he wishes to reflect upon that was presented in the last hour? MR. DOTY-Is there anything specific you'd like me to talk about? MR. FORD-No. If there's something that trips your trigger,then I want to hear about it. MR. DOTY-Yes. We were requested to review stormwater management and erosion control items only. So I have not reviewed sewer capacity. I have not reviewed any traffic engineering. I haven't reviewed any of those elements, just stormwater for this project. So really that's what I would be best suited to speak about. MR. SCHONEWOLF-What you're saying to us is any approval from this Board has to be (lost word) on approval of what you said about stormwater. In other words, they have to meet those conditions,but if they do meet those conditions,you're satisfied. MR. DOTY-In regard to stormwater. MR. SCHONEWOLF-Correct. MR. DOTY-Again, I haven't reviewed any other elements. MR. DEEB-Well, I'd like to ask a comment, Ms. Sonnabend, and, Mark, I think you're the one who's going to have to maybe help us with this. Is that with the Comprehensive Plan, which I admittedly am not versed on yet, that the Bay Road corridor isn't suited to this. Is there anywhere in the Comprehensive Plan that discourages that or? I guess what I'm looking for, I took heed of her comment,and I'd like clarification on that. MR. SCHACHNER-We'll probably tag team answer this, myself and Laura, Dave. I mean, I think my sense is, and I haven't looked at this in a while, but I have looked at it, and Laura can amplify this because she's more familiar with our Comp Plan than I am, but as I recall there are sections or verbiage from the Comp Plan that could be taken out of the Comp Plan that would arguably be supportive of this type of mixed use development and there are sections of the Comp Plan and verbiage that can be taken out of the Comp Plan that are arguably not supportive. That's my recollection,but Laura knows the Comp Plan better than I do. MRS. MOORE-I guess I can refer to the previous Comp Plan as well as this one. Prior, the previous Comp Plan, this area was always indicated as a professional office mixed use area. It's always been in the Comp Plan. The recent Comp Plan indicates that this area,yes,you know, parking should be behind buildings and things like that. So specifically for this specific project it's not going to identify that, but it's going to identify generalities of what was anticipated in this area, and this type of use was anticipated. MR. DEEB-So it was never exclusively excluded. MRS.MOORE-Correct. 31 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. DEEB-From the Bay Road corridor. MRS.MOORE-Correct. MR. SCHACHNER-Certainly not excluded. MR. DEEB-Okay. MR. HUNSINGER-Other questions from the Board? Comments from the applicant? MR. FULLER-I think we've gone through what we've gone through. It's been a long process and we've got some final engineering comments to take care of, but the contents of the stormwater can be resolved. MR. SCHONEWOLF-Yes. Looking back, this is, what,two years, we've had the project in front of us, and we turned around and decided, with your help, that we could make it better. That set the project back a long time. In retrospect, I still think we were right, and I thought we did the right things in meeting with the Zoning Board and trying to get a mutual level of understanding. I'm disappointed that didn't happen, but, you know, the Zoning Board is the Zoning Board, and we're the Planning Board,but I still look back on the project with what you're left with,and I still think it's a very good, solid project, and in the long run it'll be good for the majority of the people in this Town. So I don't feel as bad as I did six months ago when I was getting hacked about this variance and that,but I think this Board did a good job, and I've served on other Boards, and it's rare that the Planning Board gets a chance to do planning, and in this case we did, and I commend the Chairman for getting us into that. MR. HUNSINGER-Thank you. MR. FULLER-I think that's probably the one argument that I have no response to, because it's been lodged at me and certainly my clients a bunch of times, which is you followed, or you blew open that door once it was opened, and that's why you have the ZBA, is we got a project that, as I said at the ZBA, I started to grow concerned as the variances started to mount. I was keeping track of them after every meeting. When we went back and made changes, we had a lot of meetings on our side, and I knew, I've been before the Board. I know the Zoning Board. I knew it was going to be an issue, and that's, it's kind of the balance. It's the checks and balances, if you will. They've got a role, which is to yea or nay on the adjudicatory side of a variance, and they expressed big concern and we came back. So,yes, to that extent, to the extent we can be accused of following that process, we did, but I tend to agree. Traffic problems on this side of Town,we don't have nearly the issues that other areas do,and I would disagree with that from a living on this side of Town standpoint. MR. SCHONEWOLF-You don't know what traffic problems are until you've lived in some of the bigger areas. MR. FULLER-West of the Northway,try to get east. MR. SCHONEWOLF-Get down around Exit 20 I'll show you traffic problems. MR. FULLER-I think it's been a long process. I think we have legitimately done everything we were asked to do. Did we do it willingly? Yes. Guilty,but at the end of the day, I can remember when we came back,the very first time when I came in with that first project,thought we had it nailed down, went through every minutes from 2004 to, up to that point, and I checked off, made a list of all the allegations that were made against my client's project,hit them all, and came in and the Board said, no, and then moved in one direction. The Zoning Board brought it back. We had joint meetings and we got to the project where it is today. I still think that the roof part should be there to hide the mechanicals,but it's not a deal breaker if those had to go. MR.TRAVER-I think they call it a site plan modification. MR. FULLER-I think even after, it was a heat of discussion at that Zoning Board meeting where the height thing came up. There were a lot of discussions about the Blind Rock setbacks and things,and I think that one, that discussion of the height was a victim of that discussion. You can look in the minutes, that the ZBA, some of the members said afterwards. (lost words), but it is. It's part of the project,and that's what we'll build. MR. DEEB-So you're saying the mechanicals are going to be exposed? 32 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. GALUSHA-Yes. MR. DEEB-Whatever happens, I really feel that that turning lane should be done at the beginning of the project. I just don't feel we should leave that up to chance. MR. FULLER-It is there and can be done. MR. DEEB-I feel very strongly about that. MR. GALUSHA-I think we've shown through this process what needs to be done and done right, we've been down this road for two years. So it's all there. You folks see it. It is what it is. We would just like to move forward. MRS.MOORE-Can I interrupt? MR. HUNSINGER-Is there any other information that the Board feels we need from the applicant at this time? Yes,go ahead, Laura, I'm sorry. MRS. MOORE-Chris, can I just add, I know that there's a draft motion in your packet. I also have a draft motion that's more detailed if the secretary would like to review that. MR. HUNSINGER-Do you have a hard copy for him? MRS.MOORE-Yes. I'll need it back,but I just wanted to make sure that he had it available to him. MR. FORD-I would tend to agree that if there was, if we proceed, that there would have to be all steps taken to address the present and anticipated traffic flow issues. They're going to happen. They're there now. It's not going to get any better with greater density. MR. KREBS-But I also laughed a little bit at this argument about school buses, etc.,you know, I grew up in Argyle and major roads, Route 40, the school bus stops and everybody behind it stops and waits for the kids to get on. I mean, that's part of life. You're not going to change that. That's kind of ludicrous. I don't care. I live over here in Hiland, and every day when I come out and get on the road,when the kids are going to school, I have to stop and wait for the school buses. MR. FULLER-The bus already stops closer to that turn. MR. KREBS-Yes. MR. FULLER-I've been behind it. For the apartments that are there now. MR. KREBS-So that argument about school buses, as far as I'm concerned, is a useless argument. That's my opinion,okay,but,so I wouldn't even consider that as part of the decision. MR. FORD-I didn't mention that. I was talking about general traffic,day and night. MR. KREBS-But already, Tom, you live near where I do, and I'll tell you, the timing change that they've made already on those traffic lights has significantly increased the flow factor. I can tell you that from my own experience. I go through that intersection three or four times a day. MR. FORD-I agree. It's very noticeable. MR. DEEB-I would like to commend Ms. Sonnabend on her passionate presentation. I thought it was excellent. MS. SONNABEND-I appreciate it. It's all true. It's based on documents from the Town. MR. HUNSINGER-So what's the will of the Board? Where are we here? MR.TRAVER-Well,we have engineering comments. Obviously there's an outstanding issue with the zoning,but that's not our business tonight. MR. HUNSINGER-Right. Yes. MR.TRAVER-So I think we should move forward. 33 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. SCHONEWOLF-So does I. MR.TRAVER-That's my feeling. MR. SCHONEWOLF-Don's got a lot of things he's got to include in it. MR. SCHACHNER-Chris, I mean, if you entertain a motion, you know you've got to close the public hearing first. MR. HUNSINGER-Yes, and I was about to ask the Board if anyone would like to make a motion, would anyone on the Board like to make a motion. I'm sorry? MR. SALVADOR-Are you going to allow rebuttal? MR. HUNSINGER-No. MR. SALVADOR-I thought you said she. MR. HUNSINGER-No,we have no obligation to provide a rebuttal. MR.TRAVER-I'll make a motion that we close the public hearing. RESOLUTION CLOSING PUBLIC HEARING SP 62-2011 &FWW 6-2011 QUEENSBURY PARTNERS MR. HUNSINGER-We have a motion. MOTION TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR SITE PLAN NO. 62-2011 & FWW 6-2011 QUEENSBURY PARTNERS, Introduced by Stephen Traver who moved for its adoption,seconded by Donald Krebs: Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: AYES: Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Krebs, Mr.Traver, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: Mr. Deeb, Mr. Ford MR. HUNSINGER-Okay. The public hearing is closed. PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED MR. HUNSINGER-Would anyone like to put forward a motion? MR. KREBS-Yes. I'd like to put forward a motion to Approve Site Plan No. 62-2011 & Freshwater Wetlands 6-2011 for Queensbury Partners. Waivers were not asked for, so we're not denying or granting them, per this particular copy I have, okay, and I was just going to point out this is per the draft which was for 4/23,okay, and of course engineering signoff will be required prior to signature of Zoning Administrator for the approved plans. MR.TRAVER-Second. MR. HUNSINGER-We have a motion and a second. Did you have a comment, Sean? MR. DOTY-I thought perhaps you might want to make one of the conditions that turn lanes be done. So we're all on the same page,because that was brought up. MR. HUNSINGER-I was just going to ask the Board if there were any special conditions. MR. KREBS-Well,you know, personally, I feel that these engineering things should have been taken care of a long time ago. Okay,but we don't do,we don't have a process, and I remember a couple of years ago I made a big thing out of this. We need to change the procedure so that you resolve those engineering things before they ever come to the Board, and only those that can't be resolved should come before the Board. We get these papers, 23, 34 engineering comments, you know, it's kind of ludicrous. So, but in any case, this particular draft does require engineering signoff prior to. So it will be resolved. MR. FULLER-We don't have a problem with that. 34 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. DEEB-Are we going to include it in the motion? MR. SCHONEWOLF-It is included. MR. HUNSINGER-Laura? MRS. MOORE-Yes. As he stated before, Chazen reviews stormwater and provides comments on that. In regards to traffic,that is something that the applicant has agreed to, and I would encourage you to add that as a condition. MR. HUNSINGER-Would you like to make an amendment to your motion, Mr. Krebs? MR. KREBS-Yes, I'd like to make an amendment that a traffic study provided by the applicant will be reviewed by the Town Engineering department for proper use. MR. HUNSINGER-Do you want to specify the turning lane? MR. DEEB-I want to specify the turning lane. MR. KREBS-Okay. New amendment. We will require the applicant, when constructing the project, to make available a right turn lane,which will give us a left turn lane also, at the corner of Bay Road and Blind Rock Road. MR. DEEB-At the inception of the project. MR. KREBS-Yes, but you have to understand, we're saying this, you have to understand, they can't make that decision. That is a Warren County road and Warren County is the only person who can make the decision. MR. HUNSINGER-Well,they have to grant the approval. MR. FULLER-We'll apply. I can concede that we're going to include it on our application for the permit. MR. KREBS-Okay. MR.TRAVER-And they've already discussed it with them. MR. FULLER-We did. MR. HUNSINGER-Do we have a second to the amendment? MRS.MOORE-And as approved by the County DPW. MR. FULLER-Correct. MR. KREBS-Okay. MR. HUNSINGER-We have an amendment that was. MS. GAGLIARDI-Can I just ask you, so were you actually going to say at the inception of or, I just want to make sure I get the wording right. MR. SCHACHNER-Right. Mr. Deeb suggested, I think, that the condition regarding the turn lane include that it be provided at the inception of the project, and Maria's asking is that part of the motion? MR. KREBS-I don't believe that we can require that because you have to have Warren County's approval to change their road. MR. SCHACHNER-Right. All due respect, Mr. Krebs, you can require it. Warren County may not agree, and in which case the applicant will not be able to fulfill your approval, but legally you do have the authority to require a right turn lane, but the question that's on the table from our secretary is is Mr. Deeb's editorial comment suggesting that the condition include the phrase at the inception of the project,is that part of your motion? 35 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) MR. KREBS-Yes,because they've already agreed to do it. MR. SCHACHNER-All right. So it's part of the motion and part of the second. MR. KREBS-Yes. MR. SCHACHNER-Yes and yes. MR. HUNSINGER-And we did have a second from Mr. Schonewolf. Is everyone clear on the amendment and the resolution? MR.TRAVER-Thank you for that clarification. MR. HUNSINGER-Is there any further discussion? MS. GAGLIARDI-I hate to bother you again, but could, I hate to ask you, but could you just start the motion over again,just so I'm sure 100%what you want in the motion,because I want to make sure I get it right. I'm sorry,but there was a lot of discussion. MR. KREBS-Well,we weren't provided with a proper motion tonight. So this one is from a May 231,x, but I'll read it again. RESOLUTION APPROVING SP# 62-2011 &FWW 6-2011 QUEENSBURY PARTNERS A site plan application has been made to the Queensbury Planning Board for the following: Applicant proposes construction of 11 buildings totaling 132,000 sq. ft. on a 34.05 acre parcel. The intended uses for the site include office, business retail, and multi-family. Activities also include land disturbance for installation of parking area and other infrastructure and utilities associated with the project. Site Plan review and approval is required for a multi-family complex, office and business retail in an Office zone. SEQR Negative Declaration on 4/23/2013 and reaffirmed on 8/27/2013; ZBA approved variance requests on 7/24/2013; A public hearing was advertised and held on 4/23, 5/23, 7/23 &8/27/2013; This application is supported with all documentation, public comment, and application material in the file of record; MOTION TO APPROVE SITE PLAN NO. 61-2011 FRESHWATER WETLANDS 6-2011 QUEENSBURY PARTNERS, Introduced by Donald Krebs who moved for its adoption, seconded by Stephen Traver: Per the draft resolution. 1) Pursuant to relevant sections of the Town of Queensbury Zoning Code-Chapter 179-9-080, the Planning Board has determined that this proposal satisfies the requirements as stated in the Zoning Code; 2) The limits of clearing will constitute a no-cut buffer zone, orange construction fencing shall be installed around these areas and field verified by Community Development staff, 3) The Sanitary Sewer connection plan must be submitted to the Wastewater Department for its review,approval,permitting and inspection; 4) If curb cuts are being added or changed a driveway permit is required. A building permit will not be issued until the approved driveway permit has been provided to the Planning Office; 5) Engineering sign-off required prior to signature of Zoning Administrator of the approved plans; 6) We are adding a requirement to this motion that we will require them to provide a right turn lane at the inception of the project,at the corner of Bay Road and Blind Rock Road. 7) If required,the applicant must submit a copy of the following to the Town: 36 (Queensbury Planning Board 08/27/2013) a. The project NOI (Notice of Intent) for coverage under the current"NYSDEC SPDES General Permit from Construction Activity"prior to the start of au site work. b. The project NOT (Notice of Termination) upon completion of the project; 8) The applicant must maintain on their project site,for review by staff: a. The approved final plans that have been stamped by the Town Zoning Administrator. These plans must include the project SWPPP (Stormwater Pollution Prevention Plan) when such a plan was prepared and approved; b. The project NOI and proof of coverage under the current NYSDEC SPDES General Permit,or an individual SPDES permit issued for the project. 9) Final approved plans, in compliance with the Site Plan, must be submitted to the Community Development Department before any further review by the Zoning Administrator or Building and Codes personnel. 10)The applicant must meet with Staff after approval and prior to issuance of Building Permit and/or the beginning of any site work. 11)Subsequent issuance of further permits, including building permits is dependent on compliance with this and all other conditions of this resolution; 12)As-built plans to certify that the site plan is developed according to the approved plans to be provided prior to issuance of the certificate of occupancy. Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: AYES: Mr. Deeb, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Ford, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Krebs, Mr.Traver, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE MR. FULLER-Thank you. MR. HUNSINGER-You're all set. Good luck. Is there any other business to be brought before the Board this evening? If not,would anyone like to make a motion? MR. FORD-So moved. MOTION TO ADJOURN THE QUEENSBURY PLANNING BOARD MEETING OF AUGUST 27. 2013, Introduced by Thomas Ford who moved for its adoption,seconded by Donald Krebs: Duly adopted this 27th day of August, 2013,by the following vote: AYES: Mr. Deeb, Mr. Schonewolf, Mr. Ford, Mr. Magowan, Mr. Krebs, Mr.Traver, Mr. Hunsinger NOES: NONE On motion meeting was adjourned. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED, Chris Hunsinger, Chairman 37